To be marginally put off applying for jobs when the advert says things like this?

[sunflower49]

'Regular team nights out!'
'We are a friendly team and often end the day over a drink, close to X restaurant X bar etc'
'Social life perks!'
'Regular team outings/trips away' etc?

I'm looking for a job. I don't want to feel pressured into also making it my social life? I've seen such as the above several times in my search.

I understand that sometimes It's great to be friendly with colleagues and sometimes after a long day It's really nice if the boss says 'Right, we all deserve a drink', but does it need to be in the job spec as a 'perk'?

I have my own friends who I like to socialise with. I also don't often feel like going out and even more rarely feel like doing such after work, I have commitments and, usually after a full day's work I just want to go home!

I will say it doesn't make me not apply for a job I really fancy. It just makes me a bit more wary of applying.

And, I could be being unreasonable due to past experience, my last work place was very 'cliquey' and anybody who didn't choose to socialise with the rest of their colleagues after work, or turn up to every organised 'do' was somewhat ostracised.

I am only applying for graduate positions so perhaps they're looking for people much younger than me, having said this I felt the exact same way when I was younger.

AIBU?Or old fashioned?Or a miserable git?

TooSpotty that's the sort of thing I was looking at before I was qualified. It was so intimidating as someone who didn't have any professional qualifications and just wanted a job to get by. They expect the world and pay so little.

No you're right sunflower it's bloody awful. I hope you find something soon!

It's horrible, isn't it, Grays? My first full time job paid under 10k but that was before the minimum wage. And they had people with PhDs applying. (Bookshop.)

Mind you, at least they're paying. They're not looking for unpaid interns.

Interesting - I am often involved in hiring, and we like to emphasise the friendliness of the team (because this is one aspect that everyone mentions as being exceptionally attractive).

But there are plenty of parents who want to get home to spend time with kids, young grads with their own busy social life & commitments, etc, and there's no "mandatory fun" element.

It's clearly a trickier line to tread than I'd realised. Will bear it in mind.

I have to say it would put me off applying! I have always drawn a line between my work and home life, and I socialise with my friends, not my work colleagues. I like going out for a drink but I'd rather do it with people with whom I'm not already spending 40+ of my waking hours each week and with whom I don't really have a lot in common other than work! There are a couple of people in my team who have made it very clear that they think I'm a bit weird / stuck up but tbh I couldn't care less - I go to the Christmas party and to leaving dos, I'm friendly and nice to people, but the hours outside those I'm paid for belong to me and I won't be pressured into doing things I don't want to.

Unfortunately though someone quite senior has noticed my lack of attendance at social events and suggested to my boss that I might like to show my face a bit more as 'these things get noticed' . Good thing I'm not interested in getting promoted I guess, otherwise I suspect it would go against me.

it's wrong IMO, I know I'm good at my job and I don't need to go to the pub with my workmates to prove it!

My last job was £16,500. However due to aforementioned things my pay was also structured so that I was left out of the bonus structure, I often worked 8am until 8pm or 9am until late,and it was expected. People there seemed to think it was normal. Saying no to nights out was a 'no no' , there were lots of couples there and it was very cliquey. Rewards weren't for hard work, more so for fitting in and being part of the cult clique.

Whoops, cross-posted. 12.5 K is a shockingly low salary for a grad role.

toospotty Yep, I suppose we have to thank our lucky stars it wasn't zero hour contracts too!

slightly it's good to see that this perhaps would influence how you advertise in future. I understand how you want to make it sound friendly, but sometimes it's a bit OTT and seems like it's forcing sociability and this 'stepford-team' as I named it

No OP you are not being miserable at all. Some people do not like socializing with colleagues. Nothing wrong with that if it does not suit you. It is a good idea they put it in the ad because then you do not have to waste time submitting a CV or turning up to the interview.

Boo that's my sentiments exactly. And I had the same things said to me. Also the top managers were often involved in the pub/club outings so everyone else knew them better than I did, it definitely affected their treatment compared to mine. It's a tricky one.

Glitter I'm sorry if I've started something that's worried you! It seems I'm not the only one but also, a lot of people have had much more positive experiences than I have, so my mind is more open now :)

Slightlyglitterstained, I'm really glad if this thread is giving you pause for thought.

Another thing that comes to mind is people who struggle in social situations. They may be able to cope through the working day, and do a great job, but be really intimidated by the thought of enforced socialisation at the end of the day. Even someone who was just fairly introverted might find the idea exhausting.

And there are people whose cultural and/or religious background mean that they are not encouraged to spend time in places serving alcohol, or socialising with people of the opposite sex. Or social events in Ramadan for example. My employer changed the date of a big training event which involved a semi-compulsory social element because it fell in Ramadan.

Sounds like kind of place where they could be quite nasty if your face doesn't fit for some reason. And they are trying to control you by taking over your social life

I also didn't go to the xmas do.

I shall tell you for why..

It was £50 per head.

It was a 'free bar'.

It was in a place where the food was all burger/chips/steak and I don't eat meat. There was nothing on the (set) menu I could eat. The deal the company got was set menu only. I did not feel like spending £50 to go out with people I wasn't particularly interested in spending time with, and eat something that would likely be salad.

BUT!After the 'do, a lot of colleagues that I did like and get on with went to someone's house for drinks and I merrily turned up with some wine and had a drink with them all. I'm not a total social recluse. I was absolutely fine with that.
And I listened to them all say that yes, it was a 'free bar' as in the £50 meant you didn't pay for drinks, however they were not allowed to go up to the bar to get themselves a drink, once they'd sat down to eat.They had to remain at the table and ask a waiter. They were only 'allowed' to order one drink per person per order. So they couldn't say 'We'll have a bottle of wine between us' , or 'I'll have two beers please' they had to order each glass/drink separately. And the waiters were very busy and a few people said they sat there without a drink for a long time.

I was very glad I didn't go!

Spotty I'm beginning to realise I am a bit like that. I need relaxation time after being around folk all day.

Kiffy when I spoke to my union after bad experiences at the aforementioned workplace, 'My face didn't fit' was the exact same phrase I used . Definitely can be very true.

No sunflower, it's actually pretty useful. If I'm trying to explain to young, single, sociable managers or HR that their ads may be interpreted not just as offputting, but as code for "we want to discriminate based on age/family responsibilities", they would be absolutely horrified - but only if I can say "I've heard from other mums that this is offputting because...".

If it's theoretical, then I'll just get "oh, but nobody will really think that" because it's so far from their experience.

I don't think our ads are that OTT from memory, but it's definitely useful to bear in mind.

It is ironic though that an ad that's intended to mean "it's not cliquey and everyone talks to each other" can read as exactly the opposite if not worded carefully!

Slightly off topic, I often see adverts that say "we are a young, dynamic company" or variations thereof, or "would suit 2nd jobber" and assume they are looking for a young person but are not allowed to say that.

Yes, a bit of a minefield, glitter ! I am now thinking how it could be worded!

(Non-Compulsary) social events for those who are interested!

'Friendly, sociable team, we often organise out of work events for those who are interested! however if you're not we won't think you're a freak ....

It's disheartening is that, december ...Why can't somebody in their forties be useful to a 'young, dynamic company' ?

Age isn't a one-size fits all. I've seen that sort of thing, too. I wouldn't find it as off-putting as what I detailed in the OP, but I also wouldn't be drawn to it.

Being self employed for the last couple of years means I've missed out on socialising with work people. I miss some of it. I'd like a nice pub lunch or post work drink on a Friday now and again.

It can go the other way though. One go my first jobs out of school was telesales for a recruitment firm. It was owned by a group of guys in their 20s, and if you weren't willing to join their little clique you were given a very tough time. They routinely worked late, drank until 4am, then started at 8am the next day. Everyone did shitloads of coke in the toilets. Even young, single, and childless me couldn't keep up with them. 12 years later and the place is still in business. Amazing. I got fired for some stupid reason after the sales manager grabbed my ass and I turned him down. Really wish I'd sued the assholes back then.

Gawjus and Boo your experiences are so similar to mine It's uncanny. Although I didn't see anybody doing drugs I really suspect it was happening.I wondered how they were all so perky in the morning when we'd been out until daft o' clock, whilst I was half asleep. Daft o'clock's fine by me if I don't have a day of work to contend with, I don't want people thinking I'm not sociable generally, it was DP's birthday this week and we we were out in the city until 4am!

But I definitely agree, Boo, when I am not being paid that's my time.

Yes, being self employed in any capacity can be lonely I agree. I feel like I want to be back to a workplace now for various reasons, but I hoping I get lucky this time. I am very lucky to not be feeling desperate for work.

I must admit I am drawn to more menial jobs that aren't for graduates, though. Just because I feel I'd be under less pressure. That's not very good.

Sorry I know I'm hijacking my own thread!

A few years ago I worked for a "young and dynamic" small start-up. It was a really nice place to work actually, didn't discriminate on age (hence employing me) and were very understanding of family issues, although the boss was young and childless. And still in their job ads they advertised themselves as young and dynamic with not a mention of their family friendly policies or their unusually generous maternity pay. They were doing the right thing but had no idea that these things were worthy of advertising, although they were advertising for senior positions as well as graduate level. It was all down to lack of experience in HR, they just didn't realise what was important to people.

What a shame, MrsPiggie. Also, how nice to hear about a company being so family friendly. It's so easy to do really, if you're willing to treat your employees like responsible people. Frustrating that so many companies get it so wrong.

Rather a team atmosphere than a stuffy hierarchical one where bosses are inaccessible. I would be attracted to that, but not an ad that alludes to anything boozy. I'm not teetotal but also not that interested in alcohol so if I thought socials were based around pubs then I would be put off. Especially if I thought I'd be carrying hungover peers each Friday.

Yanbu hate all that shit