Bust up with the inlaws :( help please

[NoSnotAllowed]

PIL live over 200 miles away so they come and visit for a long weekend once every couple of months. We also go down to visit them too. We have two DS's who are 2 and 1.

We've just had a very tearful, emotional phone call from PIL who apparently are fed up that we don't talk to them enough, don't reply to texts/emails quickly enough and make them feel uncomfortable when they come to visit.

To be honest I completely see where they're coming from but I don't see how to fix it - we are total polar opposites. DH and I are very independent, quite private people who both suck at making small talk when the subject matter is inane (eg the weather, random neighbours we don't know etc). We have both always been like this and we would both much prefer to sit in a comfortable silence with each other than to talk for the sake of it. PIL are the opposite - talk constantly, want to know every aspect of our plans/lives, NEED to be helpful/useful and also can't sit still for more than 5 mins.

I don't know what to do I don't want them to feel uncomfortable and neglected but I'm also annoyed that they can't just take us as we are. We've tried to explain politely but just get countered with more tears and accusations from MIL. The kids adore them but their visits are becoming more and more hard work.

Anyone got any suggestions about how to deal with this?

3-4 days is a long time for guests, I think. Can you cut it down a bit, to 2-3, it might be less exhausting.

I would love to cut it down! But it's a 4 hour drive each way so they don't feel it's worth the while for less time.

I think they sound childish, needy and demanding. I'd be tempted to leave DH to deal with them and just be busy in the evenings with work or whatever.

But I know that's not very nice.

I agree with things like board games or jigsaws. Or could you cook or tidy together? I'm not a small-talk person or very good at chat, but it does come easier when you're doing something together as you can just talk about the thing you're doing.

Forgot to say, YANBU about the calls and texts, you are busy parents of small DC and they can't expect you to respond immediately.

I hate this. it's one of those situations where the ones who shout the loudest/make the most noise cast themselves as the injured party. But the reality is you find it just as difficult to be with them as they do with you - only you aren't calling people and crying about it. This implies to them you aren't bothered. I would be tempted to use language they understand. Cry back about how much their ways upset you. They don't get to be 'right' and you 'wrong'.

We have similar with my parents. They are loud, rambunctious, shouty, sociable people and we are quiet and gentle. I hated growing up with them as i was steam rollered constantly. When we visit them we fit in with them, as it's their house (or try to - dh often gets very overwhelmed and excuses himself to go for a walk/do some work. At which point they tell me how rude he is, after they have basically ignored and shouted over him and the tv/stereo for 2 hrs ). But when they visit us we also fit in with them, as they are our guests.

This is very hard and I have the same in a way with my parents. My mum gets very upset (sobbing) if I don't phone more than once a week. She cannot understand that we're just not in the house as much as she is So, if she phones at a certain time and there's no answer when she's expecting us to be there, she gets very sad. She refuses to call my mobile or leave an answerphone message. We do email, which is good for sending photos of the DC etc. She won't text - only turns her phone on when she needs to make a call. When I do call and a week might have passed due to one thing or another, I frequently get, "Where on earth have you been, we were so worried" , or she gets my dad to phone and, essentially, tell me off in the most PA way you can imagine. It's exasperating. DH and I are quieter than them and sometimes after the hustle and bustle of the day, I just want to shut down for a bit.

Some lovely patronising suggestions on here.
Wonder how some of you will feel when you're in the same position in the future?
Others have been far kinder.

I know there is no law that says you have to have anything in common with your parents/in-laws but some of the comments on here would be breathtakingly hurtful if they were read by the people in question. So I can't help but wonder if some of them do have a bit of an inkling about how they are viewed.

But OP you say you're shit at chatting and it feels awkward, I go back to my point that this is something you can work on, and something that can improve other aspects of your life (work dos, school gate, etc etc). I've made a definite effort and feel much less socially awkward than I did. I guess there are books out there with tips, but I just observed how other more extrovert people managed various situations. It's a bit of a case of fake it til you make it?

I think it's fine to just be yourself. If they don't like it, tough. Why should you have to change the way you are in your own home? And if you don't want to text or email as much as they do, that's fine too!

I sympathise op - as I have had similar issues with my MiL - in that we are different people with very different expectations of our relationship. I am not introverted and neither is she.

OT but I must say something about all the assumptions about personality types on this thread. It is a mistake to conflate extrovert and narrow-minded/ self centred just as it is a mistake to conflate introvert and shy/ poor at communicating. DH is an introvert but he is much better at small talk and works in communications - but he needs hours of alone time each night to recover from interacting with people all day. Anyway moving on...

MY MiL had a pretty close relationship with her MiL and they organised all get togethers and talked often on the phone etc. which has much to do with the strong/ silent taciturn nature of my fiL I suspect. As dh is her only child I think she was hoping for a similarly close relationship and perhaps a more mother/ daughter relationship with me. I am not seeking that with her. I have my own dysfunctional relationship with my mother (who dh rarely sees and never calls btw!). So I am only interested in facilitating a good grandparent relationship for the children and am not particularly bothered whether I see PIl much I like them and think they are good people but I do not need closeness.

So MiL has expressed to dh her dissatisfaction in the past (when she was unwell so I take it with a pinch of salt). Saying that I do not like her and I do not make an effort to get in contact. I thought that was harsh as I make an effort in my opinion - these days I rarely phone anyone (including my mother) so PiL get more contact with me than other members of my family outside kids and dh. But clearly there was an issue to be addressed - no matter how fair I felt it was (or wasn't).

DH family is small and intense my family is sprawled messy and relaxed - we don't fuss much about appearances/ formalities etc. and I struggle with the higher expectations of dh family.

Yesterday dh called me to ask me to call mil to invite them to christmas dinner, and make plans for the weekend. Citing it would be better/ more appreciated coming from me... I hate all this 'handling' of a grown woman but I do it bowing down to dh people management skills. It was appreciated by mil and I am sure will help our relationship to have happy in laws.

OP if you are struggling with your in laws expectations then a) get some advice from your dh - he should by now have insight in his parents minds even if he is struggling.
b) as your children get older it will help as they can take on phoning duty - get a text? Dial the number and get a dc to have a pleasant chat with Grandad. They will also exhaust you all in the day thereby ensuring early nights!
c) Take turns in finding evening entertainment - cinema/ theatre/ pub for in-laws so there is something to talk about (may involve you staying home and 'letting' dh have a fun night out with his parents...)
d) It is worth finding a solution as pil are important - if they did not exist neither would dh - that is what I told myself as I prepared to make what I feared would be an awkward phonecall yesterday.
Now I have to find a way to stop my mum being so horrible to my dh - another thread entirely

I don't think it is fine to be yourself if it makes a guest in your home feel uncomfortable, and you know that it is your actions (or lack) making them feel that way

You change the way you behave in your own home when someone stays precisely because you KNOW it will make them feel more comfortable and welcomed.

If you cannot do that, you invite them less often.

Oh dear - I really feel for you, OP. I'm an introvert & while I'm pretty good at small talk, I do feel as if I'm going insane if I have to be with people, conversing constantly, for days at a time. We're a similar distance away from my PIL, & we do try to get out & about by ourselves when we're there. We have friends in the area, which helps. PIL stay in a B&B when they come to us as there's no spare bed here, so that makes it easier.

To be fair to my PIL, at least they don't do what my late mum used to do - complain that I was "neglecting" her when I visited if I didn't want to sit around watching TV with her all evening. She didn't want to talk, & would also moan if I interrupted one of her programmes - but apparently it was still rude of me not to be in the room

Totally agree with the idea of doing what you can - ie. sending brief responses to texts / emails without too much delay, something which isn't any harder for an introvert than an extrovert! But as HairToday said upthread, I don't think you should apologize for who you are. It sounds like your PIL know that their son has a quieter personality than they have, & it does suggest a certain inflexibility / lack of empathy on their part that they're still trying to change him after all these years.

Think I must be reading a different thread from NannyOgg, BTW, because I've read so many really helpful suggestions & balanced posts here, & don't get which bits are patronising - or to whom?

There are loads of good board games out there:

Table top is a good place to look for different one.
www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4F80C7D2DC8D9B6C

Otherwise have you tied getting/taking a new film to watch?

Regarding the texts -explain again and again you are busy.

I found all the GP assumed as I was home with young DC they assumed was doing nothing - my time had no value - while in reality I was struggling to do the basics which they could see on visits but didn't register somehow.

Is this an innocent thing regarding the texts and calls?

MIL, my DDad and DM - all have form for picking the worst times to ring - bedtime - they'll ring, nap time when I they found out I'd sometimes nap when they were babies - they'd ring. When DC were very young we'd try a film and takeout to have celebration - they ring and wouldn't go. We took to ringing them before hand but it would still spoil any mood.

They all did the repeat ringing - even when we had an answer machine they wouldn't leave a message but wait till beep hang up and do it again immediately afterwards.

Once cooked a Sunday lunch first in a long time - MIL - DH was busy so I answered explained we were literally just sitting down to dinner at DH would ring her back in 20 min - she rang both DH mobile and house phone clocked up 30 calls while we ate. She didn't want anything when he rang back just a chat - which she didn't get as he was then in a bad mood.

When he was working away from home on a date we'd usually celebrate she did her usual of ringing 10 min in asked him was she interrupting us - apparently very taken back she wasn't he pointed out were in different locations which she knew and asked why she sounded disappointed. We did then think about it and realised both my parents and MIL had this pattern and had for years or ringing to interrupt stuff that was important to us - everything to watching favourite TV show to sleeping in when we had chance.

It was sort of making everything about them. We stopped jumping and they don't do it now. Though we also now go out to celebrate things now DC can join in - and have random wine bottles take out and movies.

Maybe you should suggest they should cut the visits down by half, seeing them less and condensing your 'chat' with them. You do seem to see them a lot.

I do think they are being manipulative with the tearyness. They should accept this is the way you are. I would get DH to have a word.

Quite frankly if someone cried and whinged they didnt see me enough...well that kind of behaviour would make me not want to see them more

Vitabrits - that is fine if you are content to 'be yourself' at the expense of a good relationship with your family. I would also wonder if you would give the same advice to the in-laws - be yourself, expect more from your son and dil? As a guest I do expect some awkwardness - there always is and I do expect things to carry on as normal when I am a family member and regular guest but I also expect/ and am given consideration as a guest in their house. I often stay with my sister for 2 or 3 nights as they live hundreds of miles away (in same town as my mum). I fit in with them but I am also fed entertained, talked too and treated as a welcome intrusion ( while I do my best not to be disruptive or entitled). It is not rocket science - but it is easier because I get on well with my sister, her dh can be a bit annoying but we make concessions for each other as well. It is what social interaction is based on recognising and allowing for each other - a bit of tolerance ... not always easy if you feel it is one-sided. But worth it.

Sorry, my boob pressed post !

Could you agree a code word that you can reply to texts with - or just a kiss or something - when you want to make sure they are acknowledged but don't have time to reply properly? Or even set up a thing on your phone so it automatically says "sorry am up to my armpits in baby stuff. Can we talk when the children are in bed?" Then you will be able to acknowledge texts without having to actually exercise your brain/ thumbs when you don't have headspace?

I am all for being accommodating, and supporting family relationships, but in this case, I really don't see what the OP is doing wrong- as she points out they are spending one full month (including nights!) a year with this one set of grandparents! Few people who live 200 miles away can claim that.

I also think it is important you don't give credence to the idea there is anything wrong with your husband. It is horrible to be disapproved of by them for the 'crime' of not being great at small talk and just being a quiet person, and I honestly would not pander to this too much at all. What if your children, as often happens with quiet people, also turn out quiet and independent? Are they going to be accused of not paying them attention too?

There have been lots of sensible suggestions on this thread about not exacerbating the problem (replying to texts definitely). But, I am a firm believer that 'least said, soonest mended' with family relationships and it is a shame they couldn't make the time more fun in a subtle way, or ask you if they can help you in any way than wailing down the phone in a way which is likely to make you all dread them coming more than you did previously. If their intention is to draw you closer and improve family relationships, they have a funny way of going about it.

Why would you set yourself up for feeling uncomfortable and unhappy every few weeks? OP is not trying to make pil uncomfortable. Pil are rude to expect op and her dh to make constant small talk when it's obviously not who they are.

I will say though that I have been living for a long time in regional Australia, and I think as a generalization we tend to be much more 'take us as we are' out here.

I'm starting to get angry with them now so not sure I can look at it impartially anymore, so sorry if this starts to turn into a rant!

I think it's very rude of them to say they feel uncomfortable in our house when they have invited themselves to stay, exhausted the children beyond their limits even though we ask them not to meaning that bedtime is horrendous and then expect two parents of very young children to have the energy to do anything other than chill out after 8pm.

I don't want them to visit at all anymore

In the interest of being pro-active as suggested I sent mil a pic of the boys 2 hours ago. She hasn't replied yet!

Just come right out & say it - I'm an introvert & constant socialising drains me, it makes me uncomfortable, it's the way I am, will always be, tAke it or leave it! (Maybe not the last bit!!) but they do need to understand & accept your personality. From there you came perhaps come to an arrangement that suits everyone (staying in a hotel/just one night??)
In fact the world needs to accept there's nothing 'wrong' with introverts, we don't need cheering up, we're not antisocial, we like quiet & calm, we are happy as we are!! Sorry rant over

Is it easier to deal with them if you are doing something you can all participate in? And do they actually help with the dc at all?

Ideally you would all find a solution that makes everyone happy. Could you leave the dc with them and go out for the evening just you and dh? Or ask pil to take the dc out for the afternoon so you're not so tired at 8pm? Or have other people round or do an activity?

I do sympathise. Both my parents and my fil can be a bit oblivious to other people's needs while being rather demanding of their own. Luckily mil is as antisocial as I am of an evening :)

I'm not surprised you're feeling like that, NoSnot - they don't sound very understanding. Leaving aside all the introvert / extrovert stuff, it's not unreasonable to expect GP to get that parents of very young children are likely to be knackered by the end of the day.

It's kind of you to keep trying & to send your MIL a pic - sorry she hasn't replied. Maybe she hasn't got it yet.

Could your DH suggest they stay in a B&B when they visit you? Tell them that you've been thinking about what they've said, & are sorry that they feel uncomfortable when they visit you. Fact is, you like seeing them, but you're tired at the end of the day - you're sure they remember what it's like with young children - & you NEED some time to relax / read a book / whatever you do. If it's too boring for them you do understand, & maybe they'd be happier staying close by, where they'd be free to go off & do their own thing in the evening? After all, we're all different, aren't we, & you're just not as sociable as they are.

Of course even staying at your place, they could go out for a walk in the evening, or read a book or something by themselves. I don't think grown adults should need entertaining by someone else every minute of the day, especially when they see you pretty regularly.

Not sure how you / DH could best phrase this, but I certainly think it's fair for you to express - clearly, politely & sensitively - your needs & feelings, given that they've not been backwards in expressing theirs.

Ultimately if they're the kind of people who choose not to see anyone else's POV & see different personalities / needs as a kind of affront to them, then you're in a tricky situation. I'd be inclined to back right off, & show them that being demanding & manipulative doesn't make me want to spend more time with them. Surprised they can't see how counter-productive this behaviour is, really.

Just come right out & say it - I'm an introvert & constant socialising drains me, it makes me uncomfortable, it's the way I am, will always be, tAke it or leave it! (Maybe not the last bit!!)

or - "I don't really like you, I think you are rude saying we made you feel uncomfortable - so I don't want you to come stay with us. We are at a different stage in our lives now with young kids, and don't want old folk round here chatting about crap that doesn't interest us - even if you are family"

Rubbish , Shop Girl - they are adults and at the op's house a lot - not one off visitors who you go all out for. Family consideration goes both ways.