to think that you shouldn't fake religion to get a school place?

[Carrierpenguin]

A friend of mine became catholic when she married her husband, then they split up. She hadnt been religious beforehand, but now she's chosen to go to church every week for the last year in order to get her ds into the local catholic school. She's told me that she doesn't believe in all that 'mumbo jumbo' but the church school gets the best results locally. I understand that everyone wants the best for their children, but this seems a bit disingenuous.

I suppose it's open to all - if you're willing to fake religion you can get into the best school, I suspect that the good results are due to parental influence as you have to be very keen to commit to two years of Sundays at church, presumably this filters out parents who don't care about education, whereas the secular schools cater to all.

I'm not against faith schools or the system, if it gets great results then why not I suppose? Aibu to think faking religion is not ethical though?

Hakluyt
What's the problem?

"Hakluyt
What's the problem?"

If I can find a way to explain without being rude I will. I can't at the moment. Just that those are values I would not wish children of mine to have.

"Have a laugh at the nonsense of it all"

Surely the talk of hypocritical individual that is the lowest of the low.

Pommalina - while I wouldn't do what you do (at least I don't think I would - have never been put to the test), your attitude is entirely logical. The school isn't asking you to be a Christian, it's asking you to attend church. It's their own fault entirely if their schools then fill with the children of atheists who are attending church purely to get into the school.

The fact that they don't do anything about it makes me think they don't really care. They prefer to have the children of parents who are prepared to work the system than the children of parents who won't - because if you're prepared to work the system, then you probably care about your kids' education and from their point of view that makes your kids worth having because it will show in the league tables.

That is 'working the system' in a totally hypocritical manner teaching children zero respect....

Awful

That is 'working the system' in a totally hypocritical manner teaching children zero respect....

Awful

FWIW, a state school place costs around £6000 per year.
So anybody paying less than that in tax per year per child (ie around 90% of the population) is being subsidised by the super rich.
Maybe only they should have a say in how schools are run

It's selection. Selection always favours the sharp elbowed, devil take the hindmost type of person. The sort of person whose children will do well anywhere because they will makes sure they do. Getting into a selective school just makes it easier for them, and keeps their children away from the hoi polloi.

TalkinPeace: "FWIW, a state school place costs around £6000 per year.
So anybody paying less than that in tax per year per child (ie around 90% of the population) is being subsidised by the super rich."

That assumes that the only people who benefit from children being educated are parents. But of course everyone benefits from children being educated, including (gasp) the super-rich. Where do they think future doctors, nurses, lawyers, accountants (particularly the ones that can help you dodge tax) are going to come from if we don't give children an education?

Hak
If the church do not give a shit what we believe then why should anybody else care?
Its all about money for them
so if they are preaching to the unconvertable, more fool them.

Fill the church schools with atheists : best way to break down the segregation

Can you imagine if we had school that had a race criteria " only blacks allowed" or a salary criteria " only those who's parent earn sx figures"

It's a disgrace.

You shouldn't have to fake religion for schooling - state funded schools should be secular.

Can I ask why you think I should be paying for a catholic education for your children?

All taxpayers are 'paying' for things and lifestyles of which they do not necessarily approve.

There is a Jewish state school local to me which is selective in favour of Jewish children, I don't think it's just Catholic schools?

No,nit's not just Catholic schools. But the poster concerned was talking specifically about Catholic education.

"All taxpayers are 'paying' for things and lifestyles of which they do not necessarily approve."

I can't think of a similar situation. There could be two schools next door to each other, both of which I contribute equally to. My catholic neighbour would have a choice of two schools, I would only have one.

I have suggested previously that people who want fair schools should only be allowed to go to faith schools, declaring their choice at the birth of their child -surprisingly, this did not go down well!

Once we put a stop to religions discriminating against non-believers this won't happen any more.

She tells you that she doesnt believe in all that 'mumbo jumbo' but TBH how do you know that she isnt embarrassed to tell you she believes?

she MAY be playing it down, but you do not know.

But only 10% of schools are actually Catholic, that is a fairly smally minority - so I dont really understand how abolishing faith schools will suddenly make the system so much fairer?

Actually OP you missed out part of the title. It should have read:

AIBI to think that you shouldn't have to fake religion to get a school place

I would prefer if all religions were taking out of all state schools. Cameron, Gove and Blair all use state school religious schools when they could instead pay fees and by doing so they ensure their children have a worse education. Osborne instead takes the morally right course of reliving the state of the cost of educating his children by paying school fees as do I.

"But only 10% of schools are actually Catholic, that is a fairly smally minority - so I dont really understand how abolishing faith schools will suddenly make the system so much fairer?"

Well, it would make it fairer for the people affected!

And there are many more schools of other faiths. I'm not suggesting only abolishing catholic schools........

Only 10% of school may be catholic, if you live next door to a catholic school and are unable to access it due to your religion it is unfair. You are being unfairly denied access to your community school due to your religion. It is discrimination.

10% of the NHS hospital beds here are for religious people only. If you are really sick you just have to pretend to believe to get treated..

Fair enough really....

Neverbuyheliumbalonz - about 30% of schools in England are faith schools. The vast majority of these are C of E or Catholic. There are a handful of Jewish, Muslim and other faith schools.

The idea of segregating children by religion is very odd if you think about it. I think most people are so used to it that they don't think about it.

I think selection by parent's religion is totally unfair and -as this thread shows - pointless, as you can only measure religious observance. That being the case I think the fact that many parents are working to subvert an unfair and discriminatory system is excellent.

But, as other posters have mentioned above, I'm pretty sure the Church is aware of the 'problem' of subversion and doesn't care cause it gives them the nice, middle class catchment they want. These excellent schools could prioritise their intake to cater for the children of the poor and needy but strangely they are not keen to do so.