To hope William Cornick spends at least the next 50 years in prison if not the rest of his life.

[smokepole]

William Cornick should never be released from prison, for his horrific and brutal attack on Ann Maguire. The judge has sentenced him to a minimum sentence of 20 years, no doubt based on his age. However, despite his teenage years and the stupidity and thoughtlessness that comes from these years his crime was so appalling he should spend the rest of his life in prison.

The only country that sentences children to full life terms is the USA, that is called a injustice by most of the world , because it does not allow for rehabilitation of children. William Cornick can not be rehabilitated for this crime and despite what the European court of human rights will say , he should serve the maximum sentence available under English law "Life in Prison".

The parents of Cornick must be living in a nightmare, wondering how they have bred such an evil child and thinking they are to blame for not stopping him from committing this heinous crime.

Lil my son was diagnosed with a personality disorder and he was/is way under 18.....

Mayy

Forensic application of the Mental Health Act is significantly different to the sections used generally in low risk, open mental health units. For instance, a patient detained in a secure unit such as Broadmoor would be under a section that requires Home Office approval for movement out of the penal environment. Release too. It cannot just be lifted.

Here is a simple guide to some forensic mental health sections for anybody who is interested. Not that these apply to the boy in question because he has not been deemed to be of unsound mind.

wanna

They do DX some personality disorders before 18 but generally not antisocial personality disorder and again, it is a grey area because of brain plasticity and the developmental difficulties. Sadly however we are still working under a system where diagnosis unlocks treatment as opposed to symptoms.

In the judge's sentencing comments, he refers to the report of Dr Kent, who was the prosecution's leading psychiatric expert. The judge wrote: He found evidence of personality disorder with some marked psychopathic traits with a preoccupation with homicide. Presumably, that's where the term "psychopathy" came from.

I don't know whether there's a difference between marked psychopathic traits and what was previously termed "psychopathy". Or whether it's relevant anyway.

Apparently (according to the Daily Mail), Cornick has had to be moved from where he was being held, because of the attitude of others towards him. I don't know whether not naming him publicly would have made much difference.

OK Horrible child. But a recent trawl/wander on Youtube found a video short on children who kill(there, sadly, have been a few). What stunned me was Mary Bell. Not merely the crime, of course it's dreadful, but the suggestion that she went on to become a parent(what kind of parent, who on earth would marry her?). There have also been a couple of Law & Order episodes about school shootings, psychotic children etc. The question may be, if you suspect your child is unusually aggressive and you fear they may plan to hurt people - indeed other children - then what can be done about it. Is the answer really a lifetime in a mental hospital for the uncommitted crime? Of course, in this case, the damage is done, but there is inevitably the day the boy will be released(likely with a new identity). What then?

I really liked Fiona Phillips' piece in the Mirror today. Though I suspect the backlash from such empathetic and liberal writing in a red top won't be pretty.

I agree - someone does not have to be mentally ill to be a killer. I am dubious about rehabilitation simply because a lot of those delivering it have God complexes..an unshakeable belief that they CAN rehabilitate and their diagnosis is always correct. I don't know how the system works but I would like to know that rehabilitation is assessed at several stages before going to most senior level for final assessment. This boy is of age to know and rationalise what he was doing. I hate the idea of him snuffing out a life in violent fashion, leaving a bereaved family in emotional pain for the rest of their lives, and no doubt a class full of traumatised classmates..and then walking free to possibly commit violent murder again.

Completely disagree. It's a horrific crime, but at his age he does have time to completely change and become a totally different person as he matures.

If he doesn't, or isn't given the opportunity then it's another tragedy AFAIC.

And if he really is a psychopath, he will probably never be let out as many other high profile killers never have.

The thing I don't get is why none of the kids told anyone he had a knife. Or of the threats he made. Very very odd

They didn't say anything because the idea that he would do that was not something any of them could contemplate. They thought he was sounding off - my cousins ds said when they told him it was Will he said they must have got it wrong - he was in the same class and had been at primary school with him.
Hindsight is a terrible thing with which to judge the actions of a group of 15yr olds for not predicting this or acting.

People banging on about rehabilitation scare the living shit out of me. Some people cannot be rehabilitated. It's a fact.

I accept that some people cannot be rehabilitated, and he might be one of them, but we simply don't know that until we try. The Spanish approach to dealing with young offenders is inspiring I thought. www.theguardian.com/society/2014/nov/07/tough-love-young-prisoners-spain-model-prison

This thread is really interesting reading. What has happened to the school since the attack - is it still going?

Mull

Don't make the mistake of confusing rehabilitation with release. They aren't always the same. I would talk of rehab in the broader sense, of understanding and trying to work with people to see if empathy can be developed, and working towards owning and being responsible for actions and their consequences.
And remember that no person in their mid teens is truly capable of empathy. Not mature, adult empathy. Most of us get it muddled, let alone a child. It is a skill that develops in adulthood. No matter what proud parents think, their ten year old/fifteen year old is showing sympathy and kindness, NOT empathy.

The school carries on, they are a supportive and loving community. That year group have moved on to various 6th form colleges in Leeds.

Mulligrubs have you watched the documentary on Broadmoor Hospital yet?

I found it profoundly insightful. Amazing that the staff can treat the patients with such respect and dignity when they face attack on a daily basis.

However, also incredibly insightful comments from the patients. Patients who know how dangerous they are. Who know they are a risk -to themselves, others and the public. Who wish it was different but accept that Broadmoor is where they need to be.

Lougle I am watching it right now, it definitely is very insightful. The patients who know they need to be there and that they are a risk are very interesting.

I still maintain some people cannot be rehabilitated. Some can of course, I am sure some can but some just cannot.

I think you'll see at some point that it's acknowledged on that documentary. Some people will never be able to face what they've done, let alone reach a pint of self-awareness that can lead to their rehabilitation.