....to ask what you think of white poppies (Remembrance-related)?

[PlumpingUpPartridge]

I had been dimly aware of the existence of white poppies but hadn't really given them much thought until DH mentioned them this weekend. I checked out the website and saw this:

linky

I liked this quote:

"In 1933 the first white poppies appeared on Armistice Day (called Remembrance Day after World War Two). The white poppy was not intended as an insult to those who died in the First World War - a war in which many of the white poppy supporters lost husbands, brothers, sons and lovers - but a challenge to the continuing drive to war. The following year the newly founded Peace Pledge Union began widespread distribution of the poppies and their annual promotion."

I am very happy to express my admiration and respect for those who died in wars, but I don't particularly want to see any more wars. I don't know what the alternative is, but I'd like to see more effort go into finding it.

I've been sifting through the threads and noticed some anti-white poppy feeling (along the lines of 'it's disrespectful'). I didn't grow up here so don't have childhood experience to guide me on this. Please can you tell me what you think of it and, if you think it's disrespectful, why?

I'm not a journalist by the way, just curious and trying to be impartial

Well I can't make statements about which undertones may or may not be present, because the spotting of undertones is all a bit subjective.

All I can make claims about are my own beliefs. When I started this thread, I had never thought much about the military (except for the fact that my ex-fiancee's family were very jingoistic and had 'jokey' names for every nationality other than their own and were very firmly pro-military, so in my head the three items became conflated and equally distasteful).

After reading all these responses, my opinions have changed. I am impressed by the work that people in the services do and disappointed by the lack of governmental support for them and their families. I am more inclined to donate to military charities as I now realise that they're doing the work the government should be doing.

My disquiet is now directed at the government which directs military action rather than the people who carry it out. I have a new respect for the work that the people do but my opinion of the government is reduced.

As for poppies, I think it's all just a bit complicated and I'm going to sit out on that one for a while longer.

And as I said earlier fairycaravan, I wouldn't want my kids to join the forces as I wouldn't want them to work for any employer who undervalues them (i.e. doesn't provide basic practical support).

You won't find what happened on a SFSG base in the general news

One can only wonder how the blood carrying poppy wearers managed to access the place, then.

Poppy seller attacked
Cadet attacked

Meanwhile out in the real world elderly people and children are being attacked for selling poppies.

I want to make it absolutely clear that I am in no way associating this with white poppy wearers at all . So don't jump on me.

But there are idiots out there who believing that red poppy supporters are war apologists etc etc etc And are setting children on fire.

I got about 10 pages into google using a variety of search terms with no luck earlier. I was going to ask for more details but thought it might be pushy. It sounds a bit like the sort of thing Britain First would make up.

Anyway, if it is true, it is sort of behaviour I would condemn utterly. It goes absolutely against the spirit of peace which the white poppy represents.

No idea, not sure if it was on the streets of the MQ's or the car park which is accessible to all, I highly doubt it was behind the gates.

Those attacks are appalling. But (a) not committed by white poppy wearers (b) not perpetrated by people on this thread.

Nobody on this thread has done what we have been accused, repeatedly, of doing.

Molly Yes it sounds exactly the sort of thing the Britain First or the EDL would make up.

You said this Rabbit

Add message | Report | Message poster RabbitOfNegativeEuphoria Wed 05-Nov-14 11:16:51
Miaw - I agree. I must admit my first thought when I see someone I don't know wearing a red poppy is that there's a good chance I'm looking at a person who doesn't think but just goes with the flow.

Not one person told you, your opinion was irrelevant. People accepted it. You've got no facts to back this up!

But I wasn't expressing an opinion about the contents of this thread.

You clearly feel my opinion is irrelevant and that is your right but I'm a bit that you can't see the difference.

My opinion is also widely shared by others for example war journalist Robert Fisk

One of my DGC is contemplating joining the Marines and are being encouraged by another grandparent who was a marine.

I'll continue to love and support the young person in whatever choice they make.

I'll also be hoping that they change their mind.

"I want to make it absolutely clear that I am in no way associating this with white poppy wearers at all . So don't jump on me."

No of course not. You just linked to them just after somebody said that white poppy wearers had thrown pigs blood over service families and also suggested that they had burned red poppies. Completely coincidental. No association at all.

For clarity - if someone says my opinion about something is this, then they are entitled to express it and it can be agreed with, disagreed, with, deemed relevant or irrelevant as their interlocutors wish but it can't be proved wrong. If someone says 'my opinion about this thread is that it includes statements saying x and y' and the thread doesn't actually include statements saying x and y, then irrelevant is a polite way of describing it.

If I were to say in my opinion all the red poppy wearers in this thread have said they want the white poppy banned, then I would be incorrect because not all (not any) of the red poppy users have said that. The fact that my opinion was that they had would be irrelevant since my opinion would be immediately disproved by the facts.

Hakluyt - Don't fucking dare put words in my mouth.

I hadn't even read that post which is blatantly bullshit our it would be all over those arseholes Britain Firsts pages and facebook.

I had repeatedly said I support the idea behind white poppies and would probably wear one on a different day.

I'm done with this now. You are on some agenda I can not relate to. Enjoy your life. Wear your white poppy. I will now never wear one congratulations.

yeah your right Rabbitt, does that make you happier now you can express an opinion and it be right but if anyone else feels different or forms a different opinion they are wrong. Glad you cleared that up for us. I'll make sure I feel the sane as you and draw to the same conclusions because your obviously the all knowing one.

sorry yoda...

Rabbit, people all the way through this thread have said they don't support the modern military. Here's an example from Sunna

"I feel differently about conscripts than I do about those who enlist, not a popular view. If you voluntarily join the army and take the "King's Shilling" you do so knowing the risks and also knowing it can be a good career.

So, what is she saying? Tough shit to my son if he ends up injured or dead because he knew what he was getting in to? Would she say that to a widow, or a man missing three limbs?

Then we've had the "wonder how I'd get on with my white poppy in Aldershot?" That implies that the military are angsty, aggressive people. You, yourself, continued this by saying about your "rough squaddie pubs", completely missing out the fact that there are worse ones in your city!

Posters are giving this thread an undertone and I agree with Ginger.

Fairy nowhere did Sunna say she didn't support the modern military, although even if she had that isn't the same as saying she didn't respect them or thought they are warmongers. She said she felt differently about conscripts. That is neither a crime nor tantamount to calling career service people warmongers.

The fact that you know that the worst pub in my city isn't a squad die one is BECAUSE I SAID SO. So how can you claim I missed it out? I was not troubled for wearing a white poppy outside the druggie pub though. I was hassled by a group of squaddies outside the squaddie pub Mentioning that is ALSO not tantamount to saying all servicepeople are warmongers.

The only bad impressions being given of service people in this thread are coming from you and Ginger, which is a bit of a shame, I suspect the service people deserve better advocates than they are getting here.

it's just a bit of banter on tinternet....Jesus

How is Fairy giving a bad impression of service people? She is a civilian.

Absolute rot, Rabbit and you know it!

Copy and paste my posts which give a bad impression of service people!

You said it after Rabbit, in another post because I questioned you. You wouldn't have otherwise!

How do you know they were squaddies? Were they in uniforms? Did they flash their ID?

I'd like to add I'm a civilian too for accuracy as people are being so pretentious here

I feel differently about conscripts than I do about those who enlist, not a popular view. If you voluntarily join the army and take the "King's Shilling" you do so knowing the risks and also knowing it can be a good career.

So, what is she saying? Tough shit to my son if he ends up injured or dead because he knew what he was getting in to? Would she say that to a widow, or a man missing three limbs?

I can't speak for Sunna, but to me anyone agreeing with the first paragraph will not be agreeing with the second.

I have the greatest sympathy for any injured service personnel and their families. But I don't have to agree with some of their duties.

Climbing Everest has greater risks than walking in a park, being a soldier has greater risks than most jobs. Especially as all military (including Majors) have to obey orders whether they think it is a just war or not.

that should be precious . damn autocorrect