... to ban BIL at Christmas? And how do I tell DH?

[NoRoomInTheInn]

OK, so the time has come to broach the subject of BIL and Christmas with DH.
My BIL was very long term drug addict (since 17 – now 49) being worse at some times than others. He’s held down a couple of jobs in this time, other times been to out of it to work, other times survived by dealing.
He takes fewer drugs now, but is alcoholic. This is far worse: the booze has turned him aggressive and horrible. Even to DH, whom BIL loves more than anyone in the world. He had to leave his flat, so now lives with MIL who is in early stages of dementia. This is far from ideal, to put it mildly.

Anyway the problem is that he usually comes for Christmas. I don’t want him here. I don’t want my DC seeing him drunk or aggressive to MIL or DH. And it’s not safe to have a large drunk man around young children (youngest are 8 and 5).
The biggest concern though, is the effect on my vulnerable DD3 who will have just turned 17 at Christmas. She has had bad MH problems, severe self-harm and a period of drug misuse. She is mostly better now - new friends, getting into hobbies and working hard at school – but is still on medication (antidepressants). I will not let anything (or anyone) derail this recovery. I'm certain he gave her a smoke or two from a strong joint before. He says he wouldn’t ever give her anything at her age but, sorry, will if she wants when she’s 18 as she’ll be an adult. I’ve told DH he’ll never be welcome here with that attitude: even at 18 she will be young and vulnerable. He’ll be so drunk at Christmas he’ll have no idea how old she is anyway (DC 1 and 2 are older).
DH is lovely, but totally in denial about the seriousness of the situation of BIL (or MIL, but that’s a whole nuther post ). He rarely pulls him up about his worst behaviour, so why would BIL try to change?
I know DH will say “I’ll talk to him,” and BIL will promise to behave, but still I’m not happy.
BIL will be alone at Christmas if he doesn’t come here; underneath the drugs and booze he can be a kind and decent person and we used to get on well.

WIBU to insist he stay away at Christmas?

Thanks

Yikes, hadn't much thought about the trouble we could get into for having drugs around... but yes could be another issue!

Last time we (whole family) saw BIL was during a visit to MILs late summer. One of the younger DCs said she heard people shouting. Not good: not a nice memory of a summer visit to grandmas.

Yes, diddl MIL will come alone if I insist. DH would collect her (6 hour round trip) bid farewell to BIL leaving him alone in house just before Christmas. Will be awkward, but yes, I shouldn't feel bad.
Grrr, families

I'll take that as a 'no' skylark

Perhaps your husband could drive down one afternoon. spend an evening with BIL & MIL & drive back with MIL the next day & poss the same when returning MIL so that he gets some time with his brother?
(if he wants)

Sorry DC trump middle aged aggressive addict.

Send him round a dinner, but don't let him over the threshold.

It's your BIL who should feel bad - not you.

Why would any parent invite someone to their home that is a confirmed user and has stated they would supply drugs to their kids?

You just wouldn't do it would you? So why is it expected because someone is family?

He's not fit to be around kids - especially a vulnerable teenager like your DD.

YANBU, especially as it's a week you're talking about. Your children are your priority.

But just to look at it another way. Suppose your dd doesn't manage to overcome her MH issues completely, and 25 years from now it's still a battle for her. Either you or your DH isn't around for whatever reason, the one of you that's left isn't in the greatest of health, and your other children either have children of their own or plans to spend Christmas day with friends or abroad. Your dd with the mental illnesses will be alone if she can't be with her parent and siblings.

Wouldn't you hope that one of your other children would step up and show some kindness and some family loyalty for Christmas?

In your position, I'd shorten the length of the visit drastically, but I couldn't enjoy my Christmas knowing a very troubled close family member was home alone because of me.

Alas, you're right, WooWoo, that's what makes it so difficult, and makes me feel like I am being the tiniest bit U. And despite everything I am a little bit fond of him.

A shorter visit is a good idea, but DH will have to go get them (6 hour round trip not including any rest, sit down, coffee etc when he arrives) and then take them back (same again) so that's two days out of his Christmas leave time, and two long drives he doesn't want to have to do too close together.

I guess I knew you sensible people would tell me I'm NBU, but its good to have a little bit of a bolster to my resolve and a few more ideas on what to say to DH. Thank you all.

He won't be home alone because of the OP. He'll be home alone because he cannot be trusted to not supply the OP's vulnerable DD with drugs. He will be alone because the OP's younger children should not be exposed to his drinking and taking drugs and any resultant unpleasant behaviour.

Ultimately he is 49 years of age. He has to take responsibility for his own choices and behaviour. The OP's children have to come first.

Why does Dh have to drive 3 hours to pick them up? Is it because DMIL has early Dementia and BIL can't be trusted to get them both on a train?

Well it seems to me that the OP has been thinking of her BIL for the last few years & has had enough.

Anyway, her husband is free to spend Christmas with his brother if he wishes.

Blimey, I won't even have DH's near-alcoholic in the house for one day, let alone have him to stay!
But then he did have a fight with DH in MIL's house while DS1 and I were there (DS1 was under 2 at the time) - police were called and they sorted out an apprehended violence order (AVO), which is Aussie equivalent of a restraining order against him, so that he wasn't allowed on our property, or anywhere near us or DS1 if he had been partaking of alcohol. The following year, he came over to our house just as the AVO ran out and had another alcohol-fuelled fight with DH which resulted in him ripping off our metal gates and hurling one down the path - it must have gone about 15' - while DS1 and I were in the house. Another AVO put in place.
MIL seemed to think that it was somehow MY fault that I wouldn't have him over to ours for Christmas Day, and wouldn't go to hers because he would be there - I was the one "splitting up the family". Yeah, right.

Your BIL doesn't have the form for violence, but if he gets very aggressive when drunk, I wouldn't have him near a 5 or an 8yo. The drug thing and your DD - too risky as well, especially if he's staying over.

Have the discussion with your DH and if he wavers over it, tell him he can have Christmas with his mother and brother and you'll keep the children safe at home with you.

Feck, that should say "near-alcoholic brother "

Yes, exactly msrisotto DMIL does drive, but hasn't driven here for a couple of years, and really its not safe for her to drive anywhere (hence my "whole nuther post" comment!)
We are both in quite out of the way locations, so there would be a taxi or drive to their local station (there are no buses) and then two trains to get to ours. Then we'd collect them from station. It would take much longer than the drive and MIL would get tired and confused. I guess its possible, though.

Oh my god a week! Noooooo no!

And he was me earlier not looking forward to fil coming on Christmas day as he's a pain in the ass when he's a drink. That's only for a few hours then I can relax.

A week and I'd have to put my foot down and say no.

Yikes Thumb, sorry you've had that to contend with, especially with young DC.
Horrendous what alcohol can do to people who could otherwise have been OK.

YANBU. A day is borderline; a week is completely ridiculous.

I was thinking that DH could go up the week-end before Christmas to see MIL and BIL, there one day back the next, exchange presents and have a meal with them, then at least he will have seen them and if MIL won't come to yours without BIL, it solves the problem of him being on his own. Not much fun for MIL being with him unless she's happy to come to yours without him.

I'm normally the first one to say but it's Christmas and call for some peace and love round the family fire! but in this case I think you have to make a stand. Because your DH HAS to see that the current situation is not tenable. He can't leave a vulnerable woman alone to see out the rest of her days with an alcoholic and unpredictable man.

I'm not saying that to pile pressure on you. But the bigger picture has to be looked at here and it sounds to me like DH's head is completely in the sand about it. Which is understandable. He loves his brother. But he can't continue to enable his brother's behaviour to the detriment of his wife's peace of mind, his daughter's mental health and, ultimately, his own mother's safety and security.

Sorry .

Is there anyway you could meet half way for xmas lunch (lasting a few hours) - not sure about transporting though

The main thing for me is that you think BIL is a risk to the children's safety. That would make it a no no for me

Talk to DH. If he doesn't suggest picking up his DM and bringing her, and only her, back to yours for Christmas book a hotel for yourself and the 3DCs and let DH have a lovely week with his mum and brother.

There is/was a drug user in my family who I was very close to growing up. They don't even know I have children. That is how much of NO this scenario is.

No no no way. You have young chikdren about, and your vulnerable dd. He can spend Xhristmas or part of Christmas away from the home with his Brother if he wants but don't you bring him back to the house.

Absolutely no way. And with regards to this:

He says he wouldn’t ever give her anything at her age but, sorry, will if she wants when she’s 18 as she’ll be an adult.

If he deals drugs to your DC, call the police. This for me is the real problem. He sees nothing wrong with being a drug addict and he'll help your DD to follow a similar path. Protect your DC from both him and having a terrible Christmas with an aggressive drunk.

LonnyVonny you've hit the nail on the head of the broader issue precisely. The AIBU that I didn't post was "... to think my DH is in denial about MIL's condition" with BIL being part of the problem. And DHs denial about BILs capability to look after her. It was too depressing. But you're right: I'm next in line and must exert pressure. She needs to move near us. And BIL needs to stay away from her and our DCs... and get help. DH knows this really but is sort of hoping things tick along acceptably.

ChasedByBees yes, you'd think we'd try to protect our younger family members from our own bad habits, wouldn't you? Even if they're adults (which she isn't) even if they're legal (which it isn't). His problems have robbed him of a family of his own, a career, long term relationships, his health, education... you'd think he'd want better for his nieces and nephew, and believe me, he does actually love our DC. You're right: he must think addiction and benefits is an acceptable way of life.

I'd rather not the halfway meeting... what a faff at Christmas (getting selfish here blush) and we have a stack of friends coming round to ours for Christmas morning breakfast/ mulled wine toast (village tradition - our turn).

Go ahead and ban him. Don't waver.

My BIL is also an alcoholic, has often taken drugs too, and is aggressive with it. He has been like that for much or the nearly 30 years I have known him, and we too have limited our children's exposure to him whenever he is known to have fallen off the wagon (which is frequent).

I am somewhat fortunate insofar as my husband is not in denial about the behaviour of his brother, and generally wants to distance himself from it.

Your BIL has virtually stated that he will supply your vulnerable daughter with drugs when she turns 18. That would earn him a lifetime ban from my house.

I know what you mean about how lovely they can be when sober and clean of drugs. My BIL is a totally different person then, charming, funny and very likeable. It makes you feel mean, or just plain sad that the good times never seem to last long.

Try not to feel too guilty (easy to say, I know). You will have a much better Christmas without having to worry about your BIL, who sounds much like a 49 year old child.