AIBU to be upset with nursery and if not how do i deal with this?

[bopoityboo3]

So to give some back ground DS has been at nursery for the last 8 weeks and he is just over 6 months old. The last couple of weeks nursery has been saying that he cries a lot during the day and is hard to get to sleep (he's not a great sleeper at home either I'm up with him ever few hours through the night) before that though he has been really happy at nursery which he is normally at home.

So just picked him up today and was going through the normal hand over stuff about how his day has been and again they mention that he hasn't been the happiest chap and fairly tearful and shouty and getting bored/ annoyed after playing with things for about 10 minutes this all said as if it's surprising a 6 month old doesn't want to play with the same stuff for longer then that (am I wrong to assume that little babies don't have a great attention span?).

It then turned out that whilst trying to get him to sleep they have left him in a swing chair screaming for 45 minutes until he finally fell asleep. Am I being unreasonable to not want them to leave my baby to scream for 45 minutes until he cries himself to sleep and how do I talk to them about this without being seen to be the stroppy OTT mother. This is the same nursery we used for DD and she loved it and we were really happy with them hence using them again this time round. It has left me feeling real upset to think that he has been left screaming and crying for all that time.

So collective power of mumsnet set me straight am I being to precious second baby or should I have a word and how should I go about having that word?

Sorry this is so long.

Ask for a change in key worker to one you feel comfortable with too. Key workers are for the parent and the child. I however would move him. I wouldn't put up with anyone calling my child spoilt. Also, there's nothing wrong with him falling asleep feeding from you. My DD did that for 16 months but adapted when other people looked after her. They know they only get breast milk from their mummy.

We had always planned to started some gentle sleep training this week (I'm on half term so if I get even less sleep it's not the end of the world) I have thought about moving him but we are moving area at Christmas so by the time we'd given the months notice it would be December and then it's only two weeks until the end of term. unfortunately we can't afford to pay for him to be attending somewhere else or a child mind and what we would owe on the contract with the current nursery. Think I might have to talk to the manager if things don't improve

Not ok and not good practice, the nurseries I've worked with wouldn't leave a baby crying and would not approve of one that would. If Ofsted or the Local Authority early years team saw that they'd be pointing it out clearly as something to work on and to look at the staff working with the baby group.

I'd talk to the manager straight away - I don't mean to storm in and complain but to say honestly you heard this, you're very worried and you do not want your baby left to cry, to the point you're having to think about whether he can stay with them, and what is the policy on this? It's their job to have a good relationship with you and to work with you to get care right for your child - any good manager is going to be keen to get this straightened out ASAP for you.

I don't think you can or indeed should sound reasonable about this?

I cant imagine the stress and terror a 6 month old would feel being left un attended for 45 mins?

It would seem like years at that age, children have totally different time concepts to us.

I would go ballistic. Its also clear he does not want to sleep so why force him. Its not even controlled crying.

I think you should perhaps look to moving him.

And in the mean time try and pop in or get your dh too do spot checks and make sure he is ok.

appalling.

I'm a manager and I agree with rumbles post
I would never leave any child to cry themselves to sleep and would not accept that practice in my nursery
Some children do cry as they go to sleep but not for 45 mins and we would always be with them till theyvwere asleep
I've rocked plenty of toddlers to sleep as well as patted and stroked
We would never let a child sleep in a bouncer or even a pram or pushchair unless the parent explicitly expressed this wish and they would need to sign a permission and disclaimer form
We also have sleep checks which have yo be filled in every 10 minutes. I wonder if your nursery has any sleep charts op.

He is normal rocked to sleep or falls asleep on the boob (he's mixed feed now at nursery) Then once he's out he goes down in his cot.

Well, he's not going to get that at nursery, is he. He obviously can't self-settle as he's never had to do it. I would move him to a nursery where there is 1 : 1 care.

Going to talk to the manager about it all just to find out their practice with this is and to discuss my concerns.
Arabella obviously he's not going to get the boob at nursery but rocking him to sleep shouldn't be such a big issue for them if he actually wants to sleep it doesn't take long at all to get him to nod off in that way and as I said above we are starting some sleep training this week. Also as I mentioned above we can't afford to be paying for two lots of child care before we move at Christmas.

RRe those saying nurseries are not good for babies, I think this is not always correct.

I have got ds in lovely nursery. I feel much safer with him there in rooms with all other babies (he is smallest at 8 months but they are all under 18months) than with cm who has toddlers and/or infant school kids crashing about.

Re op, I agree they shouldn't be letting him scream. But yabu not to have tried to get him into a routine where he can go down for a nap pre nursery. It is not fair on him to be feeding to sleep on boob at home and being required to do something quite different at nursery.

but yanbu re attention span!

I wouldn't be happy at that approach. Both of mine were in busy nurseries and I'm sure they cried sometimes but apart from the obvious distress to your child if they are left to cry the other babies won't sleep either!!

Op what area are you from is the nursery nurse you spoke too who said he shouted from the same or different area.

I am from manchester and would use the expression he shouted a bit before he went off in my arms. Meaning he moaned, protested a bit but didn't cry as in tears. No parent has ever questioned me about my meaning of it and I wondered if it's a regional thing.

I definitely don't think that they should have let your DC to cry for 45 mins but I'd also query if this is the most appropriate setting for a young child who does need help getting to sleep. The ratio at that age is 1:3 and, realistically, it won't be possible for a career to spend 30 mins or so rocking and shushing your DC to sleep when there may be another of her children who needs a feed and the third who needs a nappy change or simply entertaining. At the nursery my DC go to, there are up to 15 children in the baby room (goes up to about 20 mths) so 5 or 6 key workers meaning that one or two can lead group activities whilst others give 1:1 attention. However, they only ever have one baby of less than 8 mths at a time as they find that, otherwise, the ratios don't work. They currently have a 5mo who has just started and whilst it spends a lot of the time in the baby room, I have also seen the child in a sling on the chest of a carer in the preschool room and the toddler room as, at that age, it doesn't do much but watch and it enjoys and learns from the change of scene in the same way that most babies who are at home at that age get a change of scene from going to the supermarket or to a toddler group with an older sibling. Another thing to bear in mind is that not all nursery workers will have much - if any - experience of children as young as your DS as most people are fortunate enough to be able to take a longer maternity leave & so don't need childcare that early. A 9mo or 12mo is very different to a 6mo in terms of attention span, what they can do by themselves etc.
I'm also not sure that "shouting" is definitely negative. I have used it about DC and had people say it about my DC and it doesn't mean that they are upset, just making some noise as they do at that sort of age.

Are you absolutely sure they said he was left for forty-five minutes and not four to five?
I cant imagine how any nursery worker would blatantly admit to forty-five minutes as if it was ok.

She defiantly said 45 I checked when I went back and talked to her. That is a good point about the term 'shouting' I'm not originally from this area where as key worker clearerly os (distinct accents that gives it away) so maybe I'm miss understanding a local terminology thing with that. The baby room goes up to about 12/14 months depending of the child's development I.e. if they are walking sooner they may get moved up slightly sooner. On the days dS is in there is never more than 5 babies in the room including him.

When he first went to nursery at 4 months he settled really well and there were no issues at all it's only recently that this has seemed to change.

Aghast really. Awful attitude from this key worker who sounds deeply unprofessional, and quite ignorant about baby care. Is she in fact qualified?

You need to let the manager know exactly the sorts of conversations you've been having. If the manager is suitably concerned i would persevere (depending on her action plan) but if she sees no problem with this key worker's choice of words and attitude, then you need to move your baby.

No child should be miserable all day and no parent needs to hear such a sad update about their baby's day, and certainly not how "hard" it was for the nursery worker.

I'm so sorry you've had this experience.

Well pp who have suggested that nursery isn't the place for young babies that need rocking to sleep in my experience are talking nonsense.
It's all down to the nursery.
DS has been at nursery since he was 8 months old, not a good sleeper unless cuddled and that's what they did. They'd cuddle him to sleep. Ratios might be 1:3 but the nursery mine goes to had 1:2 in the baby room because that's what they felt was best and then it's not impossible to cuddle 2 babies to sleep at the same time if necessary.
Never had any issues and he was never left to cry and was never unhappy.
I'd be looking for a new nursery if I were you. It's hard enough having to leave them when you go to work without worrying about the way they are cared for.

I think you have to remove him.
Anyone who leaves a child upset for so long is not fit for the job and it cant have gone unnoticed by the other staff, yet they did nothing to stop it?