Aibu to be slightly depressed by the Ched Evans debate?

[BinarySolo]

I feel so angry and upset by the debates going on at the moment. Not so much whether he should be able to play football again, but it seems to be still being debated as to whether or not he's guilty and whether his victim was at fault for being drunk and going back to his hotel room.

Really. Who would ever report a rape? It needs so much evidence just to get to court let alone get a conviction, and then when your attacker is convicted you still have your character questioned and people speculating about whether it was really rape.

Not to mention idiots like Judy Finnigan stating that his crime wasn't that bad because it wasn't violent and the victim 'wasn't physically harmed'.

FFS. No wonder we need ad campaigns explaining what rape is.

It was a very valuable prosecution and Ched Evans's conviction heartens me.

The role of the CPS is to consider whether a prosecution is in the public interest and whether there is a reasonable chance of conviction. I'd say the first question definitely passed and the second needed testing and I applaud the CPS person who signed this off for his or her bravery.

Public opinion needs to be tested every now and then, but I can see a different person weighing up at a hopelessly pissed woman who could hardly remember anything and probably wasn't that sympathetic a witness with his or her career, and deciding it wasn't worth it.

Their case was that this woman was too drunk to give consent to either man. The jury considered it and decided that McDonald had a reasonable expectation of consent but that Evans didn't.

I think that's fair, in the circumstances, and I think that makes Evans's conviction stronger.

These were ordinary people with all the prejudices we might have, both for and against drunken women and footballers who flash money and they clearly thought about it very carefully. If not, I suspect they'd have delivered the same verdict on both of them - whether guilty or most probably not guilty.

I think people are doing them a disservice by saying they got it wrong.

Because of this decision to prosecute, and the jury's different decisions in the two cases, we now have a marker laid down that maybe rapists can't get away so easily with raping a hopelessly drunk woman.

The victim blaming has to stop. A young girl here in Scotland killed herself after going to court regarding rape. She was raped as she walked home, in court the prosecution held up her pants as they had a picture of a devil on them. She was so mortified and distressed by this. Why her underwear was relevant I'll never know as they were covered by her fucking jeans and even if they were all she was wearing then she should have been able to walk around safely.

Good article by Grace Dent.

Thanks for linking LeBear

The thing I found most interesting in Grace Dent's article is that the ChedSite is sponsored by his girlfriend's millionaire dad.

I thought it was her doing. Poor decision, but we're all entitled to be deluded by love and limited prospects.

Now, my dad was nowhere near a millionaire. But a pound to a penny, he'd be telling me to run like the wind away from a man who had sex with someone else, let alone raped her.

When I read that, I began to realise why the silly girl is defending her rapist meal-ticket.

Yes, limited it's pretty shocking isn't it?! I read the website about a year ago and was quite surprised by that. Her video is pretty bizarre, too.

I have more time for the sister. It's very difficult for the close relations of anyone convicted of a really serious offence, and I can't bring myself to blame them for being loyal to their own kin.

It worries me that when celebs come out with this sort of bollocks it just becomes excepted as the norm. These views need to be challenged

But she has been challenged OP and she gave an apology. Though I don't agree with her, it worries me more when people say that people who have unpleasant views should have them stifled.

She was challenged by the main presenter, Ruth Langsford. There was also a studio vote and no one backed her. I don't believe that was because no one in the room thought Evans had been badly treated. I think it was because no one was brave enough to put their hand up to defend him. I'm not going to bother looking again but I think the question might have been framed as: 'All those who think he should disappear from the face of the earth say aye, and now let's hear it from the rest of you.'

My feelings on this are mixed.

I think he should be able to renew his job if his employers want him. It's legal for a start. He's not in any kind of position of trust like doctors, teachers, lawyers etc are.

I don't accept the nebulous idea that he is a role model to be held to a higher standard than the rest of us.

I wish that Sheffield Utd thought that having a rapist on the payroll would be a bad thing. But apparently Evans is a good player and therefore popular with the fans and for the club's prospects.

Other clubs have found it acceptable to defend and stand by valuable assets. Liverpool with Suarez's racism and assaults and Chelsea with Terry's alleged racism, of which he was acquitted. Loads of others, but you get the picture. If the FA doesn't want to make Kick It Out count against racists, what chance have women got?

The only thing that would get someone chucked out by a football club would be a conviction for molesting children. And then only under 12. If they were boys.

As I said on another thread: I am more comfortable with the idea that the rapist Ched Evans will be playing football rather than scraping a living as a mini-cab driver.

After all, there would be a lot more witnesses at Sheffield Utd than in the back of a cab.

There was no trace of a date rape drug found in her system I believe, in answer to a previous poster.
It is a difficult one ... A girl was raped, no argument. Someone was convicted. No argument. Served his time ... If he was a plumber/electrician/postman etc ... The discussion wouldn't happen - it's because he is a footballer and in the public eye. Maybe it is the sentencing that needs to be looked at.
I now teach the nephew of the man who raped me at 17 by spiking my drink ....

It's more acceptable to claim your drink was spiked than admit you simply had something or maybe too much to drink. And if that's not true, that's what makes your story sound shaky in court.

I'm sure drink-spiking happens but in the majority of rapes alcohol is easily available and consumed by both parties with no illegal substances needed.

Why would rapists need to slip Rohypnol into your glass than than just buy you another? Or let you buy it yourself if they were particularly cheap

The fact is that men should not stick their dicks in a woman who is borderline comatose or covered in her own sick or even want to.

I'd put someone like that in the recovery position and consider calling 999. I wouldn't text my mate saying I'd got a girl and was at a cheap hotel.

Limited - I think I somehow missed Ruth chalenging her. I blame trying to wrangle 2 toddlers. I'm glad as I like Ruth and would like to believe she's an intelligent woman.

Empire - I find that so shocking. Especially the 'can I have a go' bit. Grim.

I find the girlfriend odd too. At best he was a cheat but she wanted to stand by him and protect him. Like others have said I can understand his sister's unwaivering support more.

Whilst I agree that getting the case to court at all, let alone getting a conviction is positive, I just find the questioning of the verdict and victim blaming depressing.

I'd like Ched/his defenders to explain why it wasn't rape.

They keep saying he wasn't capable of rape. I would like to know how they view this to not be rape.

Had a quick look at the ched Evans website. Seems to be a sanitised version of events. The two things that struck me most were the friend sending a text that said 'words to the effect of "I'm with a girl"' rather than using the actual wording of 'I've got a girl'.

Then rather than asking to 'have a go' they say that he asked to 'join in'.

They also don't seem to be able to make up their mind as to how drunk she was and alternate between her staggering about to walking normally.

On the site it says either ched or his friend asked if he could join in (both men claim it was them asking) and she replied 'yeah'. They also claim she was in control, changing sexual positions, demanding oral sex and rougher sex.

She didn't make an accusation of rape, though. North Wales police did...