Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

aibu to think midwives should not strike.

89 replies

ninjasuperted · 13/10/2014 12:23

I totally understand that they have a point, and i don't blame them, but would they not have more LEGAL clout if they just stuck to their contracted hours, and didn't do unpaid overtime.

surely that way the nhs bosses would notice that more midwives were needed?

OP posts:
cherryhealey · 13/10/2014 13:15

Midwives nurses health visitors and all frontline Nhs staff are totally undervalued and under paid.

They work in appalling conditions and are expected to carry on regardless.

I totally support their actions -

Clarinet9 · 13/10/2014 13:18

ninja
the nhs boss know more midwives are needed

the whole point is that you can't just walk off the job, really would you just leave your child safely crossing the road and just go off for a coffee because all is fine? it is a similar thing

the bosses take advantage of the fact that they know people will stay

and on it goes round and round

(not a MW but I support them working to rule and hope they get the result they want)

Original poster
ninjasuperted · 13/10/2014 13:18

Not being a midwife myself. I would have to concede, that i don't know what im talking about. And don't know what is involved in a midwives role. But would assume paperwork was in there, and patient aftercare ( when no immediate emergency would cause deaths) could be neglected should an emergency arise.

i can also see what a position the midwives are in.

OP posts:
Bigoldsupermoon · 13/10/2014 13:22

I'm currently 10 days overdue and cramping, and I'm still in favour of midwives on strike. Can only echo the pp who said that the problem isn't with the midwives at all - it's with the shits in Government who've made this action necessary.

clam · 13/10/2014 13:23

I fully support their strike. It's outrageous that they are so under-valued by their employers, although not us mums at the chalk-face.

ChippingInLatteLover · 13/10/2014 13:25

Well, at least you admit you don't know what you are talking about, but do you not think getting better informed before stating what other people should or shouldn't do would be a good idea?

BaffledSomeMore · 13/10/2014 13:33

A work to rule for two weeks would increase the public awareness of the problem but not managerial or ministerial awareness. They know there's a problem but political dogma is their cause. The NHS will cost less whatever it takes.
And there's no massive pile of midwives waiting to come in at 2 weeks notice. Yes lots will have left the profession but they'd need training before going back on to wards.

MammaTJ · 13/10/2014 13:35

There is no way the paperwork aspect of the job could ever be ignored. A lot of what MW and Nurses do is about legal documentation. If that gets neglected, they would be in trouble down the line.

Someone has a mishandled (in their eyes) birth and the baby suffers something lifelong as a result, the parent may decide not to sue in the three years they have to do so, the child then decides when 18 that they are going to sue. How would the MW defend herself, or even know anything if the recording has not been done correctly?

goodasitgets · 13/10/2014 13:35

I'm bemused why midwives are getting such focus... I know it's Mumsnet but people were aware the ambulance service was striking too?

Clarinet9 · 13/10/2014 13:36

of course paper work is in there but there are no spare people and the work has to be done so you just have to do it.

what are you suggesting they don't do their paperwork this week? but then it never gets done unless they come in on their own time and do it then

and you can guarantee that the one discharge they don't do will be the one whose wound goes septic, or whose infant gets readmitted, or something else happens and then they will get the blame.

handing stuff over is terrible unsafe, it is where mistakes happen besides how can you hand over writing up resuscitation notes to someone who wasn't there? they don't know what happened, and if you don't do it how does the person coming after you work out what happened and what care they need to provide, remember that memory game where you put things on a tray and try and remember what was there? now wait a week and try and remember in what size order you peeled the carrots 7 days earlier.

see it just doesn't work leaving it does it?

VivaLeBeaver · 13/10/2014 13:36

Yabu.

Its impossible to stick to contracted hours.

What am I supposed to do when my shift finishes, I'm looking after a labouring woman and the midwife in charge says she has no midwife to take over from me? I can't walk out.

That's why I'm striking.

VivaLeBeaver · 13/10/2014 13:37

If I did walk out in such a scenario the nmc would be able to strike me off.

Clarinet9 · 13/10/2014 13:38

OK viva used fewer words Grin

justkeeponsmiling · 13/10/2014 13:42

You have clearly no idea what you are talking about op.
YABVVU

Selks · 13/10/2014 13:42

Thank you for your words of support (not midwife but NHS employed here), it means a lot. Nobody wants to have to strike, but this was considered the least disruptive but most effective way of getting the point across.

Pasteurella · 13/10/2014 14:03

YABVVU - I'm a professional working in a different sector of the NHS and I don't think anyone working here hasn't felt the pressure over the last few years.

We pay more in pensions (for less), most pay more in tax, and our actual pay has been frozen for years, so the pressure is on financially, but also re-shuffles have meant that we regularly face redundancy and at the moment we are only managing because we have so many (expensive) agency staff and because the non-agency staff have put in a lot of work outside their contracted hours - largely unpaid.

Qualified staff are being booted out in preference to unqualified staff to save money, with the quality of the work we do getting worse as a result. Not so many people have the knowledge now to pick up on a mistake - expect more lawsuits, draining the NHS of more much needed funds!

We can only strike about basic pay and conditions, but it's actually about a lot more.

Original poster
ninjasuperted · 13/10/2014 14:17

Well i was unaware of the midwives work to rule for the next 4 days, which would support their case even more i feel.

i don't oppose their strike, and feel the government undervalues every effort these special people make to keep what they do running.

my first thinking was. Why strike when you could work what your paid to do. ( for a time) and no more. But it appears that's what they're doing as well. I was also unaware that in their contract you cant leave on time in certain situations.

so i would agree my first post was bu. And have learnt something today, on a big story.

OP posts:
Letthemtalk · 13/10/2014 14:24

The bosses know that more midwives are needed. They know that more nurses are needed, more OTs, physios, community nurses, doctors, more everyone really. But where do you think NHS "bosses" are going to get the money to pay all three extra staff? NHS budgets need a complete over haul, and NHS bosses can't do that without gov support.

I support the strike 100%, until the public put pressure on the government nothing will change.

firefly78 · 13/10/2014 14:24

im a social worker. very different i know but i do unpaid overtime as my loyalties are to my clients not my managers. yes i shouldn't do it but I would be letting my clients down.

Letthemtalk · 13/10/2014 14:25

I don't think unpaid overtime is part of their contract, but may be to do with registration and goodwill.

mrsminiverscharlady · 13/10/2014 14:28

Midwives (and the same applies to all other registered health professionals) have a 'legal duty of care'. This means that you can't just not do overtime by leaving at the end of your shift regardless, because if this leaves a woman at risk you could be struck off. At least with a strike then it can be planned for and the risk to women and their babies minimised.

Clarinet9 · 13/10/2014 14:30

Good on ya ninja!

in some cases you have a kind of catch 22 some staff are told it is 'illegal' for them to work more than a certain number of hours yet nothing is done to help them achieve that.
then you get the manager speak 'you are not allowed to work those hours but of course if you choose to then we can't stop you'

of course again no effort is made to allow them to 'choose' not to, no additional staff are employed no effort made to allow for annual leave etc

SassySugarCane · 13/10/2014 14:30

I don't understand why anyone is striking, you knew full well when you applied for the job what was involved and how much you were gonna get paid. To those striking today, I do not support you.

milkwagon · 13/10/2014 14:34

Nope you're not being unreasonable. I don't think any medics working for the NHS or any emergency services should be allowed to strike including ambulance staff. Police aren't allowed to strike so why should doctors/nurses/paramedics etc? They've chosen a career path where patient care should come first and foremost above anything else.

Clarinet9 · 13/10/2014 14:37

Sassy for a lot of people that is absolutely rubbish, you can never really appreciate the full ins and outs of a job until you have done it.

Do you really think it is spelled out to people fresh out of training that they are going to have to work extra hours to cover for their colleagues who take annual leave or planned and unplanned sick leave because the managers have no intention of allowing for that in their staffing numbers (or they don't have the budget to do so)?
Do you think they have any idea what that means in reality?
Or when they trained they were working with a ration of 1:2 or 1:5 or whatever depending on the place but now it is 1:4 or worse they are the only qualified nurse on the ward? are they all psychic? should they have seen that coming? Does it make it OK for people to strike who have been employed for years but not if you are relatively new?

Most NHS staff who have been working for a few years will have signed a contract with the government stating certain things, do you think it is now OK that the government has decided to unilaterally break the conditions in that that no longer suit them?

Swipe left for the next trending thread