To think if Yotam Ottolenghi is going to complain about authenticity of olive oil in hummus, he shouldn't put out nonsense like Thai lentil soup

[AgaPanthers]

Seriously mate, if Mary Berry wants olive oil in her hummus it's up to her.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2789159/yotam-ottolenghi-attacks-great-british-bake-star-s-mary-berry-s-recipe-hummus-inclusion-olive-oil.html

You won't find any lentils in Thailand either.
www.westernlivingmagazine.com/2014/10/08/thai-red-lentil-soup/

Cote - if I lived in a Mediterranean country (or Poland, Bulgaria or Romania, all of which have fab tomatoes) I don't suppose I'd use tinned either. But people here were talking about British tomatoes, which is fair enough, largely woolly, sour, don't ripen properly. There is little point in making a tomato sauce with Tesco's tomatoes as it will taste sour and insipid, and will be a pale orange colour instead of deep red. If you grow your own, you will probably have more success.

You are coming across as being a bit up your own arse, you know.

Fgs, it's not even possible to say "I expect recipe books to give recipes from basic ingredients although I sometimes use canned stuff myself" around here without being insulted anymore

What seems to be the problem with the above statement?

You cook how you like and I will cook the way I like, how about that? There is no need for foul-mouthed personal attacks.

BIWI - "But why, Cote?"

I expect recipes to start from basic ingredients because I might want to cook them myself when I have the time, and I would want to know what to do then. Specifically re chickpeas, how long to soak and how long to cook them. When I don't have the time, I can substitute tinned chickpeas, no problem.

And I like to cook them myself because (1) I think they have better texture & taste, and (2) they are more nutritious.

You cook entirely with tinned ingredients, if you like. I am only telling you that personally I prefer to use fresh produce when I have the time, which is why I expect recipe books to start with basic fresh ingredients.

Btw, I just checked my Ottolenghi book and it does for example start with dry lentils and says "Wash the lentils in plenty of cold water. Place in a large saucepan with the water, bring to a boil, and simmer for 35 minutes until soft. Skim off any scum that rises to the surface during cooking". I think it's a good thing that he doesn't just say "Open a can of lentils". Fine if you disagree, though. It is not like we will ever end up in the same kitchen and argue about how to cook the lentils

I also checked the one English cooking book I have, and Jamie Oliver indeed uses tinned tomatoes for ragù, but fresh tomatoes for some other dishes. He also starts with dry lentils ("Simmer for 20-25 minutes (topping up with water if necessary) until the lentils are tender but holding their shape") and ears of sweet corn ("stand each corn up tall and carefully run a knife down the cob to cut off the kernels. Drop the corn kernels into the pan, add the thyme and stock, and simmer for 20 minutes"). Sure, I would use tinned corn most of the time, but personally like to have the recipe tell me what to do if I have corn cobs one day.

Um, fresh lentils don't exist.

Dry lentils are not fresh.

You seem to think that is news.

Maybe recipe books should give both alternatives, Cote.

I agree with you, actually, that people should know/be taught how to do these things. But I don't agree that where there are perfectly good alternatives that these shouldn't also be indicated.

Let's not fall into a bunfight... unless you have to hand some freshly baked buns, still slightly steaming and fragrant from the oven, created with the finest stoneground flour, agave nectar, fairly traded 80% cocoa chocolate, chickpeas hand churned Jersey butter, and organic free range eggs...

peace'n'love'n'oliveoil

That was hardly a "foul mouthed personal attack". I was just pointing out how you were coming across to me (and clearly to some others as well). If I was going to make a foul mouthed personal attack I'd just have called you a cunt, and I have no intention of doing that.

It is very unlikely that a cook book aimed at the Brits will tell you to make your own tomato sauce with fresh tomatoes, because, as I said, our tomatoes are not tasty enough to make a well flavoured, appetisingly coloured sauce. This is why they tell you to use tinned tomatoes. If you want to learn how to make a tomato sauce from your bright red, deliciously tasty tomatoes, use a French or Italian cookery book aimed at that audience.

Re chickpeas, if you are using dried, a recipe will often say "cook according to the instructions on the packet."

I do, actually, Ellen, except my loaf uses maple syrup instead of agave nectar, and I am eating it with Brittany butter with salt crystals.

When tinned stuff isn't mentioned in recipe books, I don't take it to mean that we are forbidden to substitute tinned ingredients for fresh ones.

Stop picking on Ottam.

I've got the horn a massive soft spot for him him being gay isn't an issue . Love his recipes, authentic or otherwise.

So do we all grind our own flour too?

As a novice cook, I like simple recipes that you don't have to look in specialist shops for ingredients.

These recipes that makes doing cooking easier is for the target audience.

Cote Most people, including myself don't have the time and inclination to cook pulses like chick peas and kidney beans from scratch. They need to be soaked and cooked for ages. On the other hand I am happy to cook dried pulses like moong dal or all types of lentil from scratch because they don't need several hours for soaking and cooking.

Do I need to don a hard hat then MrsS? (No reflection on your cooking, of course )

Bunbaker - You are acting like I have said "Nobody must ever use tinned products, we must all cook everything from scratch".

Quite the contrary, I have said (several times now) that I also use tinned products when I don't have the time to cook entirely from scratch.

What exactly is the problem here?

MrsSchadenfreude - I do feel that "up your arse" is a foul-mouthed phrase. Feel free to disagree.

Let bygones be bygones and all that.

Feel the love people, feel the love

Who knew a few puréed chickpeas could be so incendiary.

My personal opinion is yotam and his recipes are a bit dullsville. I bought a Mary Berry book recently and would say she is a bit 70s stylee but dependable. Nothing groundbreaking in her books. I find her use of soy sauce in tomato sauces makes my teeth itch.

Personally I loathe tahini. It's overpowering and has the texture of oily putty.

I also don't have much time for Yottam. His recipes are unnecessarily complicated, and - IMVHO - aren't that great once cooked. On the basis of the very small number I have actually cooked but it's enough to put me off cooking any more.

I am neutral on the subject of both cooks, but I am ardent in the defence of tinned chickpeas.
And shop bought flour.

I don't have much room for him, either. Not practical, his stuff, hard to source ingredients, expensive.

I put sesame oil in hummus.

BIWI - I dare you to make this and find it "not great"

Yes, he does use a lot of obscure herbs and spices, I agree with you on that.