To think colleague is pushing it a bit with this excuse!

[butterytoastandmarmalade]

She's had her wrists slapped (mild rebuke) over timekeeping.

'She (our supervisor) hasn't got kids!' she thundered.

a) they aren't 'hers', they are stepchildren - she lives with their parent.
b) they are aged 14, 11 and 5 - hardly babies!

AIBU and a bitch!? Or is that a really naff excuse!

If I read Blessed's post and was about to employ a parent I'd think again. Luckily I've employed many parents and not one of them has behaved in this way.

We are lucky to be able to be flexible with start times and finish times pome times and where possible I have granted flexibility. I would be appalled if a member of staff felt it was acceptable to be consistently late and other colleagues pick up their slack without prior arrangement (I'm not talking about those occasional emergencies that arise without warning)

If I was this woman's manager I would be having a discussion about their obvious difficulty in starting on time and suggesting that if they are unable to do so we need to consider a way forward.

I have a couple of members of staff with a horse. Mothers may feel children trump horses but in actual fact a horse cannot disappear or be ignored any more easily than a child. The members of staff with the horses get given as much slack as a parent in my organisation. If they expected to come in late regularly because of a stabling issue I'd be suggesting they look at their arrangements. If there is a vet related crisis I'd try and cover for them whilst they resolved it. Ditto for a parent

I have done the years of juggling work and three children and it's a tough time. I have every sympathy. I don't think it's unreasonable for any employer to expect a father to share some of that child related impact on work and if there is a SAHP I would be very surprised if the working parent felt they needed to be consistently late.

Mexican these children have a SAHP so childcare shouldn't be an issue. As a single parent I find it staggering that you can have a second adult to care for children and still find arriving at work for contracted hours difficult.

Some m

Before I had DCs I had a friend who would trot out the "well you don't have children" or "Well it's different when you've got kids" line as a response to just about EVERYTHING. It did very well to shut me up, especially when I was longing for children, was heartbroken after a miscarriage, and thinking I'd never had children.

Example:

Me: Gosh you don't get your dinner till 9pm? I'd be starving!

Her: Oh well when you've got KIDS that's just what it's like
Me: Oh < abashed, feeling like a greedy wimp to need to eat something by 7.30 >
(turned out she had a sandwich when she got home from work to keep her going btw)

There were others but I want to be truthful and I can't remember them exactly so won't repeat them, but the gist was that I had no idea about ANYTHING in life, and had no right to have an opinion, because I didn't have children. It was a sort of trump card. I joke but a bit like "I don't like baked beans" "Well when you've got kids you have to eat them all the time." (That one isn't true because I do in fact like baked beans but it was a bit like that.)

FF 20 years and I have 3 kids. I have never been late to work, or waited till 9pm for my dinner because of my DCs.

I notice no one has mentioned the utter insensitivity of the co-worker's comment to the OP, assuming that she knows her history

YANBU OP I have a 4 year old. I've worked since he was a baby. I can count the number of times I've been late in over 3 years and it's always been because if a train and not my DS. Your colleague needs to be more organised, as simple as that. And yes I've been up all night with DS on numerous occasions I've still made it into work on time, probably too tired to function brilliantly and therefore had a very average day but I was still there on time.

Your colleague gives working parents a bad name behaving like this.

Balloonslayer some people can do it about anything. A couple of years ago I was in work in the evening in the changing rooms getting changed into my bike gear next to my colleague who was doing the same. We peered out into the dark rainy early evening and I went "oh god, almost wish I was staying late now" and she harrumphed at me and went "well I wish I had the option but I have a 2 year old waiting on me" and off she went. "Yeah, and I have just had my third miscarriage so I can sit in here all bloody night until the rain goes off and nobody will give a shit, thanks for reminding me", I didn't call out to her rapidly retreating figure.

There is still a pile more work involved in looking after little kids than I imagined though. But you try and tell people without kids, they just start to glaze over. I've got friends who're trying to decide whether to have kids or not, who'll go "I can't imagine what it is like" and I'm like "well let me tell you/show you" and they don't want to know, it's too boring. Also I have two year old twins whose main hobbies are screaming, painting their own feet and jumping up and down on the sofa. I don't think many people envision that as they're trailing around the John Lewis baby department looking at babygros with ducks on them.

Wow
The op has been, I feel, unfairly treated on this thread.
Having kids does not mean you can swan into work when you want, and not expect to be pulled up about it.

I have had colleagues who are off when they are sick, when the kids are sick, and when the child minder sick. It has a massive impact. Obviously not everyone is like this thankfully

I have a colleague now who is often late, there is always a reason - traffic, wife ill, dog ill, young adult daughter has a cold and has to go to doctor they go to doctors for every little thing. It drives us mad. Then there's the need to leave early for all the above reasons - always an emergency when on a certain shift.

Anyway. Op yanbu. And I am sorry to see some of the responses.

Lordy suffolk! I'm tired just reading that!

In fairness she (colleague) didn't say it to me but about our supervisor, in general sort of bitching and moaning terms.

I think some people have reacted far more strongly than I did to the comment! I shrugged it off finding it mildly amusing if anything as (sorry) to me it is SUCH a daft excuse that two teenagers and a key stage one child would be making you late with a SAHP and children that have two parents moreover they live with - but evidently some still think I am BU.

I only mentioned about my boy because I found some of the 'have you got kids' posts surprising. Mumsnet is usually pretty good about being sensitive about such issues as such a lot of us have had losses and fertility issues. Unfortunately you get them such a lot in "real life" you become a little hardened to them.

YANBU

People are late for all sorts of reasons sometimes you just have to suck up the telling off

Weirdly last night I didn't eat dinner til 9pm because of my ds1 (that's looking at colleges though so not a regular occurrence )

I do have kids - two teenagers. Mostly they don't make any difference to me being on time for work. Sometimes there will be a period of time where everything seems to go wrong, where they lose one thing after another, where they never have clean uniform, where if I don't sort it out they're going to mess up completely on something important (like GCSE controlled assessments). Yes, there have been weeks when I've been late for work most days because my kids have screwed up their lives and I'm not heartless enough to say "your problem, you fix it" and get in the car on time.

If you don't have kids, you won't get that. To be honest, if you have a baby, or a toddler, on any child young enough that you take responsibility for everything in their life you won't get that. Being the safetynet for an older child is sometimes much more difficult than doing everything for them in the first place would be.

So yes, sorry, YABU. I'm sorry you lost your little boy, but I think "have you got kids?" is a perfectly valid question to ask someone who's spouting nonsense about how easy it is to look after them.

buttery you didn't seem mildly amused last night. You seemed angry and judgemental. Also, your own situation wasn't clear from the first.

Again, I am sorry for upsetting you by asking if you had kids, but it was just a question, not the loaded criticism you took it for.

I wasn't angry! I've read my posts and I honestly can't see where you got that impression - I said in my OP it was a naff excuse which is hardly violent, loaded language, it's akin (here) to 'daft, silly'.

I only mentioned my situation to prevent endless 'have you got kids' posts and if I'm honest I'd prefer it if it wasn't brought up any more as we're approaching the one year anniversary and I really don't want to talk about it - sorry.

And I'm sorry to split hairs but by asking someone if they have kids what you are meaning is that you are deciding whether they are worthy of judgement of a parent, and my post wasn't about me. But i have been forced, I feel, to reveal something I prefer to keep quiet

I don't have kids because that word suggests living, noisy, breathing people running all over the house.

I am still a parent.

But that is by the by and I'd really rather not get into all that as it is very painful.

But I assure you I am not remotely angry - mildly put out is about the extent of it. I'm honestly baffled as to how you read fierce anger into my posts!

But i have been forced, I feel, to reveal something I prefer to keep quiet

Nobody did this, you volunteered the information, and although sad, it's not really relevant.

I'd prefer it if it wasn't brought up any more

Then stop referring to it.

On a last note, I hope you're getting some support in dealing with it. I think this may be the real issue for you here. I mean this helpfully and sincerely, please don't take it the wrong way.

Enough now, felix.

How on earth can you say that a still birth is irrelevant to somebody asking if I have children?

There have been some tactless posts on here but I really am shocked at that. What a cruel post.

He's very relevant to whether or not I have children, funny that.

You've had a hard time op
YANBU
Yes, sometimes there is an emergency and kids can cause you to be late, but you've said that yourself. It shouldn't be an ongoing thing, especially when there is another sahp around.

If there is a particular reason why it happens ( eg school run means you will always be 5 mins late) then the employer should be sympathetic and say start and finish 5 mins late. But generally people should organise themselves just the same as everybody else with kids have to,

*"No, I haven't got children. Obviously, I know this means I should never comment on those who do"

I think you need to take your own advice.*

Felix, this is what you posted. I see you have apologised of sorts but that was a nasty, petty and unnecessary remark.

I'm really not being nasty.

I'm really sorry you've read anything I posted as nasty. I obviously am not explaining myself well.

I wholeheartedly, unreservedly apologise for anything I've said that has upset you and I wish you well.

I'm going to leave it there as anything else I say might be misconstrued.

Omg at some of the nasty stuff said to the OP on this thread! why must people stick the boot in like that?! No need at all to make unkind remarks about someone's loss being "irrelevant"! I'm really sorry for your loss OP

YANBU btw. it is a naff excuse. Personally had no trouble getting to work on time with 2 kids. I know of someone who's argument when he was late was "well I've got kids". he wasn't a lone parent and his OH was SAHM. our boss was like

DP has been late for work before when youngest was a poor sleeper as a baby a few times (pure exhaustion) but he took his bollocking on the chin. his boss was sympathetic being a dad himself but ultimately its not his problem is it?

There are threads where people complain that their friends are often late when meeting them at soft play and are told that it's not acceptable and the op is being let down by their disorganised friend.
but when it's just work that's being let down, all of a sudden school aged children are a valid excuse for persistent lateness?
I wonder if the children get to school on time

Felix I can see that you meant my loss was irrelevant to the thread but unfortunately it was you who made it relevant by asking me if I had children - and then making a rather sardonic remark when I confirmed I did not.

I mentioned it in context of 'have you got kids' where I do think the fact I have been pregnant and given birth is relevant!

No it isn't relevant as to whether my colleague has a good excuse as to why she can't get to work on time because apparently two teenagers and a five year old who stay at their Dad's three nights a week keep them up till all hours - I do think she's pushing that one a bit.

'Pushing it a bit' is a gentle way of saying 'trying it on' in this neck of he woods by the way. Hence my surprise at your reading of it all as 'anger.'

Thank you for the kind remarks re DS

Felix I can see that you meant my loss was irrelevant to the thread but unfortunately it was you who made it relevant by asking me if I had children - and then making a rather sardonic remark when I confirmed I did not.

I mentioned it in context of 'have you got kids' where I do think the fact I have been pregnant and given birth is relevant!

No it isn't relevant as to whether my colleague has a good excuse as to why she can't get to work on time because apparently two teenagers and a five year old who stay at their Dad's three nights a week keep them up till all hours - I do think she's pushing that one a bit.

'Pushing it a bit' is a gentle way of saying 'trying it on' in this neck of he woods by the way. Hence my surprise at your reading of it all as 'anger.'

Thank you for the kind remarks re DS

The thing is, anyone on here will find that their personal experience clouds their judgement of how others should or shouldn't cope.

When my current teenagers are still stomping around crashing doors at midnight and then looking for missing homework at dawn, I remind myself that we've managed worse times than this. At one point we had a 10-year-old child staying awake (and needing adult company to avoid self-harm) till midnight, a toddler with night terrors and a bright and breezy middle one who was ready for the day at 5:30. Oh god...

I have kids, am never late. I hate being late for anything. Dh is never late either. It is ridiculous to think having kids is an excuse for persistent lateness.