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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think having New Year's Eve off is not a fair compensation for working Christmas Day

113 replies

Vintagejazz · 08/10/2014 15:14

Once again my SIL will not be able to join us for Christmas day because she ends up working on this day every year. Her crime? She doesn't have children and so the managers in the organisation for which she works have deemed it fair that those with young children get Christmas Eve and Day off so they can be with their children, and those without get New Year's Eve and Day off so they can go out and celebrate.
My SIL is 45 and does not have any desire to spend NYE out clubbing and pubbing and getting home at 5am. However, she would like to be able to spend Christmas Day with her parents, nieces and nephews, significant other etc. as she has worked on this day for the past 3 years.

AIBU to think this is a rubbish arrangement and to have suggested she and others in a similar position approach management and outline the unfairness of the arrangement and ask that it be reviewed?

OP posts:

Tinpin · 08/10/2014 16:18

It's only bothering her pigwitch because she always has to do it! No rotas should be organised so that one group of people never ever do Christmas and one group always does.Very unfair.

windchime · 08/10/2014 16:18

"Its not just unfair its clear cut discrimination. If they said that everyone with children had to work Christmas Day and anyone without didn't, that would be obvious discrimination. The reverse is also true.

I agree. What next? Maternity leave for those without children because it's just not fair?

PetulaGordino · 08/10/2014 16:23

i always feel bad that i have to ask for time off in school holidays when i don't have children. i do feel that my colleagues who are parents of school-aged children should take priority. but my dp is a (state school) teacher, and i would never have any time off with him if i didn't request school holidays too. i feel bad that i am "competing" for holiday time with parents of school-aged children, but i do have to put myself first sometimes

PandaNot · 08/10/2014 16:23

grocklebox family status is not a protected characteristic. The only ones covered by equality legislation are
age;
disability;
gender reassignment;
marriage and civil partnership;
pregnancy and maternity;
race;
religion or belief;
sex;
sexual orientation.

CPtart · 08/10/2014 16:25

Very unfair and I have seen both sides. As a nurse without DC it infuriated me that It was almost expected I would prefer NY off and not want any leave in the school holidays. Now with DC, I am immensely grateful to those colleagues that accommodate my preferences to have Xmas day off and take leave when schools are shut.
I still think having DC shouldn't give you first pick though.

aprilanne · 08/10/2014 16:27

.i think its unfair to have to work every year .every other year is fair .those who say it is unfair on children .well this lady is someone.s child .i would be very sad not to be with my three sons on this day .adults/teenagers there are still MY baby,s no matter what age .even with small children .you cannot take that job then expect special treatment .your sister has every right to be miffed .

SoonToBeSix · 08/10/2014 16:29

Flogging but they are thinking if employees children not random
children. The op SIL could celebrate with family on new year it's not like she believes in Santa.

squoosh · 08/10/2014 16:31

Working Christmas Day for three years running when you haven't volunteered to do so indicates an unfair system is in place.

selsigfach · 08/10/2014 16:31

I think that's lovely, MsRinky!

PetulaGordino · 08/10/2014 16:35

i have to say some of my best christmas memories as a child are of going with my dad to do a ward round on christmas day. it must have been a PITA for the nursing staff but they were lovely, and the patients' families were very welcoming. it wasn't a specialty where people were very ill, though

cowbiscuits · 08/10/2014 16:41

Oh YANBU.

I hate the thing about giving people with kids priority. It is really unfair and I say that as a parent. I worked last christmas day and missed seeing my son open his presents. But I volunteered to do it because it was "my turn". That's how it works. I will be pissed off if I'm made to work it this year though.

People without kids have family/friends/loved-ones too. I know some younger people without kids or partners whose families live a long way away. If they work Christmas they then have to go back to an empty flat by themselves- at least those of us with family nearby can go back to a warmed up dinner and see the people we love.

Where I work they let you request your shifts over christmas. It's expected that everyone will work at least one of the bank holidays. Not everyone is guaranteed their request. Priority for days off goes to who worked last year. So if you are off one christmas you can expect to work it the next. Some people who don't mind working it, or who don't celebrate christmas will routinely volunteer to work christmas day.

Having said that, they are not necessarily fair- one bloke was counted as having had the previous christmas off when he'd been on compassionate leave because of a bereavement. Someone else was given a 14h shift on christmas day despite requesting it off. But apart from that it seems as fair as it can be.

It's totally wrong that the same people are being made to work christmas every year.

NotGoingOut17 · 08/10/2014 16:51

soontobesix As has already been pointed out, employers should be thinking of how to treat their own employees fairly before they worry about the needs of their employees' families. Yes SIl could celebrate it another day and I am sure she is happy to do so on her turn, but having to do it every year is unfair. She is not responsible for the life choices of her colleagues.

Having a parent work Christmas day is easy enough to work around - let's not forget that unlike adults, children get 2 weeks off at Christmas, so there is plenty of time for them to spend time with their parent. I highly doubt the parent would be out of the house for all 24 hours - as I said, my dad worked in the emergency services. If he worked a day shift we had our christmas dinner when he got home, if he was on a night shift we would wait until boxing day because he didn't want to go and work a night shift on a big dinner. My Christmas' were no less happy because my Dad often worked on the day. The only shift of his that I didn't like is when he'd been on nights on Christmas eve because we weren't allowed to open our presents until he got home (only 10am but we'd been up from about 5am with excitement). I don't have children so this is just my own opinion, but I think you could well be overestimating how much children can't bare to be parted from their parents - for me the excitement of christmas day was my presents, the Queen could've been there and I wouldn't have paid much attention, but that's just me being a spolit brat.

Original poster

Vintagejazz · 08/10/2014 17:13

Soontobesix why do you have to believe in Santa to want to spend Christmas day with family and significant others?

OP posts:

Original poster

Vintagejazz · 08/10/2014 17:16

In any event, it is not up to employers and managers to decide whose private life is more 'deserving' or Christmas day off than another's. They should draw up a fair rota and allow staff to swap amongst themselves if they so wish. They should not be involving themselves in prioritising staff's family circumstances.

OP posts:

springlamb · 08/10/2014 17:24

When I worked at OOH dd's (obviously a 365 days a year job), no one was allowed leave on Xmas Day. Shift durations were cut to 3 or 4 hours but everyone had to work at least one shift. You could swap shifts, or you could get someone to cover your shift but even if Xmas Day fell in the middle of your 2 weeks annual holiday and you were abroad, you still had to get your 4 hour shift covered (and obviously this day was not deducted from your leave allowance). Certain people, such as young single blokes, found themselves much in demand and made loads of money.

I would be really upset if my older sister who has no children repeatedly missed Xmas Day with the family.

springlamb · 08/10/2014 17:25

Even if she actually WANTED to miss Xmas Day with us!

revealall · 08/10/2014 17:32

She should join a church and stake her claim on Christmas as a religious right.

I can't believe people are suggesting she leave her job based on one day where her employers are being crap.

Ruebarb · 08/10/2014 17:36

my dd has changed roles within her department this year and is on new holiday rota. she has no dc but her dp only gets the 2 weeks off over Christmas as guaranteed holiday during the year - he is technically self-employed and the industry closes down over Christmas. She asked if she could have 1 or 2 days off other than the set bank holidays over Christmas and was told they were all booked up -by people who had booked off both weeks. She asked about getting some time off next year and was told that it was already booked up with the same people who had it this year - apparently they ALWAYS have the 2 weeks over Christmas. Her manager realised they had a problem and has promised that they will try and sort it so people can either book week before or week after Christmas but not both. Most of these people do not have dcs but the attitude is 'we have always had it'.

flowery · 08/10/2014 17:41

"Actually. Family status is a protected characteristic, it works both ways. You don't seem to understand how discrimination works at all. She most certainly has a legal claim here."

I spent several hours last week writing a detailed employment guide to the Equality Act for HR consultants. Just think how surprised they'll be to discover I don't understand how it works...

Thisvehicleisreversing · 08/10/2014 17:46

Wellnow I'm in the same situation this year.

This Xmas will be my mum's last. I'm on the rota to work Xmas eve night, Boxing Day all day, New Year's Eve and New Year's Day all day. Management didn't listen to reason when I asked nicely, so I've had to tell them that I will do Xmas Eve or Boxing Day, not both. I want to spend as much time with my family as possible this year. If they get funny with me they can stick the fucking job.

ADishBestEatenCold · 08/10/2014 18:03

"Unfortunately being childless is not a protected characteristic under the Equality Act"

versus

"The employer of course needs to ensure that parents are not discriminated against"

Sorry I'm picking on your post, NotGoingOut17, I'm just rather randomly borrowing your sentences, to ask the thread is being a parent a protected characteristic under the Equality Act, then?

youmedancing · 08/10/2014 18:05

Vintagejazz I like to think I am fair, I was just pointing out that giving the option to people it has always fallen on those lines. I don't decide, I let people choose. I would question whether your SIL actually mentioned she was unhappy working christmas last year. If she didn't I would suggest her employer thinks everything is A-OK.

rota09 · 08/10/2014 18:10

I work in the nhs. We are given a blank Rota where we write our requests but the rules are if you worked Xmas day last year then you have it off this year(unless you choose to request to work that shift)and you either work Xmas day and new years eve or boxing day and new years day. Xmas eve is hit and miss.

The only issue we have is that we used to do short shifts so one really minded working 7-3 on Xmas day but now we do 7-7pm plus we have such a high turn over of staff in the last year that a lot of us senior staff are facing having to work Xmas day on their "year off" which is fostering some major resentment among the staff.

rota09 · 08/10/2014 18:14

Ps-my 10 year old understands that I may not be at home on Xmas day and that's how my job works.

Dd2 who is only 18 months is a bit young to understand at the moment but the plans are Xmas day may be moved so presents and roast on Xmas eve or boxing day depending what I'm working. It's only one day of the bloody year and its not going to kill my kids to wait an extra day.

But rotas should be done fairly by looking at the previous years and working it out fairly.

iliketea · 08/10/2014 18:21

YANBU - I'm also work in a 24/7 service, and the Christmas rota is worked out on a fair basis, irrespective of your dc or not. I could see a that if both parents were working Christmas Day, that could be a problem (where do you get child are on Christmas Day?) but otherwise, everyone is expected to do their bit.

I remember the first year I was a member of staff, there was a big hoo has about those with children working Christmas, and there were a fair few of us who's families were all far away, that we'd also have partners who were alone on Christmas Day and our families were just as important as theirs.

Your SIL may not be able to get it changed this year, but she should definitely bring it up for future - if you work for a service that works on Christmas Day, you're generally aware of that before you take the job, children or not.

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