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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To keep wondering whether it's me... Or them

35 replies

BareNecessitiesofLife · 29/09/2014 22:19

I live quite far from my family but have recently come 'home' for a visit with new baby. It's only been a few days and unfortunately that's about all my mother could manage without succumbing to the compulsion to criticize me. What spurred on the inevitable this time was the fact that I had three small glasses of wine tonight and (over the course of an afternoon and evening yesterday) three beers and two wines. I wasn't drunk at any point and this drinking was in the context of family gatherings with lots of food. Apparently (said in front of other family members) my behaviour is completely unnaceptable, I drink too much and I shouldn't drink while Breastfeeding (Which I don't as I'd give expressed milk or formula). I'd find it a bit easier to shrug off this kind of petty criticism but, having suffered years of it as a helpless teen, which was frequently emotionally abusive (being slapped, called awful, damaging names, screamed at) I feel that as an adult I really really owe it to myself not to take any more! It took me years of being away from their 'singular world view' to repair my self esteem and while I like to think their comments come from a well meaning place (kind of!) it really triggers strong waves of upset and distress to encounter any kind if criticism from them. So I took them aside tonight and asked them very calmly to please not criticize me in front of others and then tried to explain that I don't bf when I've had a few, but I couldn't get much further as I got shouted down by both parents "you drink too much that's the end of it!" And told not to be so "hysterical". It seems like such a relatively petty incident and yet it has just brought up waves of pain. Aibu to expect that as an independent self sufficient adult I can go about without being dragged down into feeling torn and sad and a failure?! What has been a nice trip so far just reminds me now of why I stay away :-(

OP posts:

cees · 29/09/2014 22:35

Paragraphs would have made reading this so much easier.

They sound vile, after they attacked I would have gone home at the earliest chance. You tried to have a conversation about it with them and they shouted you down.

You can't win with them because they see nothing wrong with belittling you when the mood takes. Walk away from the shit they cause and don't look back.

ThirdPoliceman · 29/09/2014 22:54

It's awful when parents treat their adult children like this.
I have two adult sons and it is difficult not to tell them how to live their lives, I do try to shut my mouth and be careful how I word advice. It isn't easy but I do try. My mother belittled me in front of family neighbours and even my husband. It was mortifying.

Castlemilk · 29/09/2014 23:06

Leave in the morning.

Seriously.

It is the ONLY way you will get them to sit up and listen - by not taking it.

Not just saying 'don't do that'

but by walking out and simply saying treat me like that again and wave goodbye to me and your grandchild - I'm an adult, and you no more treat me like that than you would any other adult.

SquirrelWearingATrilby · 29/09/2014 23:08

I went nc with my parents because they refused to treat me as an adult despite being married, divorced, new partner and 2 adult dc's. You would think that I am still aged about 6 in the way they talk to me, insult my partner, talk about how well my ex is doing, over-ride what I say and talk about me while I'm in the same room.

TheCowThatLaughs · 29/09/2014 23:15

You might as well get pissed next time, might as well be hung for a sheep as for a lamb. They sound awful. Shouting you down is terrible, just terrible.

WakeyCakey45 · 29/09/2014 23:21

squirrel are you me? We must be living parallel lives!

OP, hard though it is, you will one day reach a place where their approval means far less to you than it does now. Try and put some emotional distance between you - if that needs to be achieved through physical distance too, then don't feel sad about that. You must look after yourself and protect yourself from these attacks on your confidence and self esteem.

BackforGood · 29/09/2014 23:23

2 different points.

Firstly, if you have a tense relationship with your parents anyway, what made you think it was a good idea to stay more than about 3 nights with them ? Any guests can be trying after a couple of days - guests with a new baby, more so. You are presumably tired, and lacking sleep ? (Most new parents are), none of which is going to help. Most parents of tiny babies can get tense and snappy due to lack of sleep, it seems a bit odd to then put yourself in a situation where you will feel vulnerable to criticism.

Secondly - am I the only one who thinks they have a point about the drinking? 3 wines today, 3 beers and 2 wines yesterday? That sounds like a close relationship with alcohol for any of us, but if breast feeding, then I think that's an excessive amount too. Not what you want to hear, I know, but I think YABU.

TheCowThatLaughs · 29/09/2014 23:28

Op said she expresses or gives formula if she's drinking

Batmam · 29/09/2014 23:40

??Backforgood she said it was in the context of a family gathering, that isn't too much too drink.

MrsWembley · 29/09/2014 23:43

I'd say leave in the morning, too.

On the alcohol question, do you drink that much at home? Did you feel the need more when around these people. Please don't think I'm being judgemental - I drink like a fish and am trying to cut down, but when I was BFing, I had one or two glasses a week. And that was with my DP giving a bottle of expressed milk so that I could.

But no, you sound like you need to go NC, or at least threaten it.

SquirrelWearingATrilby · 29/09/2014 23:43

wakeycakey I knew I had a twin somewhere!

Goldmandra · 30/09/2014 00:03

I think you'd need to give a lot of formula or expressed feeds to avoid passing on alcohol when you're drinking that much so perhaps your parents are concerned and have a point.

Is this your normal level of alcohol intake or have you upped it to cope with being at your parents?

I have a family member who is never allowed to be asked to justify any action or decision, no matter how extreme and she goes off on one about always being criticised by everyone if anyone ever dares to express a concern, no matter how carefully or gently worded. You need to consider whether you are just being defensive of an unreasonably high alcohol intake.

If you're sure that the alcohol really isn't the problem, that this is a continuation of emotional abuse and isn't ever going to stop, you need to walk away because, with the arrival of a baby, it is only likely to get worse.

Only you will know deep down which is the correct scenario.

Original poster

BareNecessitiesofLife · 30/09/2014 05:21

Hello, thank you for all the replies, they've given me genuine things to think about.

I don't normally drink that much, at home it'd be nothing or one drink. It was in the context of a get together and I bf just before starting then gave expressed / ff until the next day. I'm actually now not sure, with that issue, whether I should even be doing that. I'd read on here that the alcohol leaves your system after a few hours per unit ingested, so thought I was safe :-(

I'm also actually physically staying with my brother and his family & Kids rather than the parents... They live a few streets away and I've been popping round . We are quite close though my brother has always been the favourite he tends to take their ways with much more of a roll of the eye, but was not subjected to the same level of criticism growing up. I guess as I don't really see the parents now more than a few times a year that somehow my skin would have thickened as day to day I rarely stop to think about them or their unpleasant ways and this little dig of theirs really caught me off guard and knocked the stuffing out of me a bit.

OP posts:

Doingakatereddy · 30/09/2014 06:03

I'm not condoning your DM's behaviour but your alcohol consumption does sound very high.

Most mums I know limit to one glass of wine while b'feeding and if I ever had more if pump & dump.

Also, when my two were newborn I stayed sober incase I needed to drive anywhere, e.g. Walk in centre etc.

Been pissed or tipsy in charge of a baby is pretty awful.

rootypig · 30/09/2014 06:11

Doing you can drink enough not to be fit to drive, and yet not be drunk. Many, many people who don't have driving licences have children - does this make them unfit parents?

That said, OP it does sound like you're drinking a lot for BF and your last post makes you sound pretty uninformed - were you dumping the milk you expressed? for an entire day?

YANBU to expect not to be criticised in front of an audience though - if they were really concerned about your drinking and your baby, there would have been a conversation in private. Sounds like they relished sticking the boot in.

I agree with very calmly and politely leaving - say all your goodbyes, lovely to see yous, and if asked why you're off, clearly say that you're leaving because you don't want to be spoken to like you're a child. No drama, just leave. I did this to my family once and their jaws hit the floor, it was priceless

ChasedByBees · 30/09/2014 06:31

I agree that they shouldn't have spoken to you like that, but also like the others, that is a lot of alcohol - in terms of units it would be classed as a binge (it takes surprisingly little to be classed as binge drinking, anything more than about 4-5 units (from memory) which is easy to do at a party/gathering). While BF, even with expressing, this seems excessive to me if I'm honest. They had no right to speak to you like that though.

fruitpastille · 30/09/2014 06:33

ANot really the point, but info about alcohok and bf here is interesting
m.facebook.com/DrJackNewman/posts/237837423033978

ChasedByBees · 30/09/2014 06:36

Sorry - binge drinking is more than 6 units.

As you spread it out with food and over the course of an afternoon/evening, it's probably not be classed as that, but it is in excess of recommended daily units for women not BF.

Original poster

BareNecessitiesofLife · 30/09/2014 06:37

I expressed before having a drink, then bfed, then had drinks, then gave the expressed feed and then next feed was formula. By then more than seven hours had passed since my last drink. This behaviour is an exception as normally I do not go out drinking, and I honestly don't see the problem in an occasional letting down of hair! It's hard enough being a new mum and I was looking fwd to a chance to unwind for a few hours and felt I'd adequately prepared for it by expressing the next feed and having formula until any alcohol left my system.

@Rootypig
From what the nhs and kellymom sites say, pumping and dumping only serves to release pressure it doesn't remove alcohol from your breasts.

From today though I'm back to usual consumption which is one drink every few days, and never again in front of parents though I'm sure they'll find something else to pull me up on no doubt!

OP posts:

rootypig · 30/09/2014 06:58

Pumping and dumping doesn't just relieve pressure (worthwhile as it is!) it will also stimulate supply in the absence of the baby suckling. As far as I understand it, alcohol in breastmilk is metabolised just as it is in the blood - it takes as long as it takes.

Anyway I agree, the chance to let your hair down as a new parent is much needed for many of us, especially at the end of a long pregnancy.

How old is your LO? are you still at your parents'?

GnomeDePlume · 30/09/2014 07:14

Across the course of an afternoon/evening this is in no way excessive drinking.

YANBU

Your parents sound like boundary overstepping bullies. What do you get out of this relationship? Do they value your opinions? Do they shower you with love? Do you feel enveloped by their warmth and affection? Do you feel able to ask their opinions but that they will respect your decisions?

If your parents dont add to your life then you can reduce the level of contact to all but nothing. it is allowed!

NoodleOodle · 30/09/2014 07:28

I agree with Back that there are two issues here: your relationship between with your parents, and your relationship with alcohol. From what you've posted, I think you'll have to do a little soul searching and find a way to balance these things in your life in a way that is healthy and for your happiness.

There's a broad range of approaches and attitudes towards alcohol in this country, and you're free to do what's right for you.

wigglylines · 30/09/2014 07:36

There's no real need to give formula if you've had a drink. The amount of alcohol in your breast milk after drinking is about the same as the amount of alcohol in your blood. It has already been processed by your body. Even if you were really drunk, the abv would be something like 0.01% IIRC

Or to put it another way, if you drank the blood of a drunk person, that wouldn't get you drunk would it?! Drinking your breastmilk will not get your baby drunk.

All the stuff about pumping and dumping is based on myths too, no scientific basis at all for that.

The biggest risk to a baby of her /his mum being drunk is being dropped or otherwise accidently hurt by their mum because she's pissed. That's a real risk and not to be dismissed lightly. But your milk? That'll be fine, they're talking nonsense. Widely believed nonsense (as this thread shows) but nonsense all the same!

As you were drinking with food, and weren't drunk, i don't see anything wrong with the amount you drank personally. Obviously if it was all the time that'd be an issue, but no where have you said that.

wigglylines · 30/09/2014 07:44

"That said, OP it does sound like you're drinking a lot for BF and your last post makes you sound pretty uninformed - were you dumping the milk you expressed? for an entire day?"

This is actually uninformed IMO. Where are you getting your info from? There is no need to pump and dump for a whole day (or at all)!

rootypig · 30/09/2014 07:47

All the stuff about pumping and dumping is based on myths too, no scientific basis at all for that.

Pumping and dumping is based on: 1) knowing that if you drink alcohol is present in breastmilk; 2) not wanting your baby to consume alcohol; 3) wanting to relieve the pressure in your breasts; 4) wanting to mimic your baby feeding to maintain supply.

The second is a matter of opinion, but it is not based on myth, the evidence for the effect on babies is inconclusive.

The idea that pumping will remove alcohol from your body is nonsense, I never suggested this but getting rid of milk you know has alcohol in it seems perfectly defensible to me, as much as not drinking, or restricting drinking.

Not that I ever pumped and dumped!

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