Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think there were better ways to handle this situation?

27 replies

TheStrawberryQueen · 29/09/2014 19:33

This might be long so bear with me.

DD who is 8 and in Yr 4 was very upset when I picked her up from school today. It was obvious she had been crying but wouldn't tell me what was wrong. When we got home she started crying again but still wouldn't tell me what was wrong.

I've been trying to drag it out of her all afternoon but she didn't budge until about an hour ago and now I don't know whether to take this further or not but I am very angry.

A bit of background first. At her school from Year 4 onwards they start doing class activities with some of the younger year groups. They get given a partner in a younger a year group and they do things like reading together, helping with homework, etc. My DD has been paired with a Yr 1 child (let's call her Holly) and another girl from Yr 4 (let's call her Emily). Emily has had a history of bullying DD in the past but it doesn't seem to have been a problem this year yet.

So this afternoon DD, along with Emily and Holly were in the Yr 1 classroom and they had been doing some activities together. My DD found a piece of paper with some simple words written on (I assume it was being used to practice spelling earlier on) and DD shows the paper to Emily and asked her if it's hers to which she said no and the paper was then tossed aside and forgotten about.

A short while later DD was sharpening a pencil at the bin when the year 1 teacher shouted her over and demanded that she got over there immediately. DD said the teacher looked very angry. Holly and Emily were also with the teacher and they were both looking at her too.

When DD got there the teacher started shouting at her, saying that Emily had told her that she had written some very nasty things on the paper about Holly and had also said some nasty things about her. DD didn't have a clue what she was talking about but when she tried explaining this the teacher just cut her off and kept shouting at her. She said that the teacher shouted at her for a very long time and accused her of saying these nasty things about Holly. When the teacher demanded to see this piece of paper Emily said that she had ripped it up and put it in the bin (DD says she hadn't thrown anything in the bin).

When she got back to her own classroom her own teacher told her off although she wasn't as angry as the other teacher had been and by that point dd said she was too upset to put her story across.

Thinking about it though, AIBU to think this could have been handled so much better? Assuming it really did happen like that then I really don't think the teacher should have just jumped in and started shouting at my daughter and accusing her of these things based on another child's word without also listening to my daughter's side first. Couldn't she have just asked dd nicely and calmly what had happened? Or at the very least not just started shouting at her?

This teacher only started last year so I don't know her and my dd never had her. So she doesn't really know my dd or Emily.

Maybe I am overreacting but I don't know whether to go in tomorrow and ask what happened. My DD is going through a lot at the minute and we are in the middle of getting an ASD diagnosis for her so I don't know if I'm being oversensitive.

I just don't think the teacher handled this the best way by going in all guns ablazing without even listening to my DD.

Poor DD is still upset and doesn't want to go to school tomorrow Sad.

OP posts:
Momagain1 · 29/09/2014 19:36

YANBU Sounds astoundingly badly done. Hope the younger child tells someone the truth.

AdmitYouKnowImRight · 29/09/2014 19:38

Shouting? Really? "Shouting for a very long time". I dont believe it, or else every other child would have come home, told their parents and your phone would be on fire.

Exactly why at Y4 helping younger ones? that is post SATS Y6 prerogative.

.

honeysucklejasmine · 29/09/2014 19:45

I would certainly be wanting to speak with the teacher tomorrow to find out her side of the story. Even if its not 100% accurate, something happened which was enough to upset her for a long time. This will not have been an every day ticking off.

Goldmandra · 29/09/2014 19:54

If your DD has ASD, the teacher wouldn't have had to shout loud or long for her to perceive it as such. My 17YO DD has AS and and when a teacher recently balled her out for performing badly in a test (due to sensory processing issues), the shouting caused her severe pain in her ears and head, she was in shock and hysterical afterwards and terrified of encountering this teacher again. When it was investigated, it turns out that the teacher had raised her voice and been quite brutal in her language but not enough for the other staff in the staffroom where it happened to raise a concern.

Your DD's distress is clear and the teacher needs to know that she has caused it. Whether she shouted enough to upset NT children is irrelevant, although it most certainly isn't good practice. She needs to understand that it is not acceptable to shout at your DD.

I would go into school, ask the teacher what happened from her perspective, question why she didn't ask your DD for her account of events and, while acknowledging that your DD's perception of shouting may be different from that of others, explain that she was very distressed by it and is now reluctant to come to school.

The child's perception is as important as the teacher's.

Ron99 · 30/09/2014 08:13

So the bully has made her first move. I'd speak to your daughter's teacher find out what really happened, make quite sure you got your bully concerns over and say dd isn't to be paired with Emily again.

LadyLuck10 · 30/09/2014 08:22

I would speak to the teacher to find out what actually happened. You are hearing the version from an upset child who might have exaggerated the story which is also quite possible. Go in, speak calmly and try to resolve this without accusing anyone of anything.

MidniteScribbler · 30/09/2014 08:35

Exactly why at Y4 helping younger ones? that is post SATS Y6 prerogative.

We pair our year 4s with the preps so that they have a few years at the school with the older student being mentor to them. We find it works very well, rather than just the oldest students only being there for one year before leaving.

Original poster
TheStrawberryQueen · 30/09/2014 09:27

Well DD was still very upset this morning and refused to go to school. I don't know if it was the right thing to do but I have kept her off today as she really was upset and didn't want to go. That is very unusual for her as she loves school and normally begs to go even when ill.

I have made an appointment to see the head this afternoon and the teacher in question will also be there to find out her side.

OP posts:
Original poster
TheStrawberryQueen · 30/09/2014 09:28

Goldmandra I see your point but I did get a phone call this morning from one of the other mums to ask what yesterday was about and why that teacher was so angry at dd.

OP posts:
stillstandingatthebusstop · 30/09/2014 09:34

Is there anyone who can go with you? I always find these situations difficult on my own (and there will be 2 of them).

Goldmandra · 30/09/2014 09:57

If your DD has the rigid thinking usually associated with ASD, undoing this damage and helping her to feel safe in school again could be a long hard process. You're going to have to be patient and insist that the school do the same.

It was probably the right thing not to force her to go in until she knows that the matter has been dealt with and she won't be shouted at again. She needs to hear this from the staff as well as you and she also need to hear that she won't be paired with Emily again. She sounds like she has picked up on your DD's vulnerability and is exploiting it for a bit of entertainment. If it continues. you need to make a real PITA of yourself every time it happens and insist that it is dealt with swiftly and effectively or your DD will be miserable in school.

HappyAgainOneDay · 30/09/2014 13:07

Goldmandra You're good at this sort of thing.

Keep going, OP. Take someone to the appointment with you, as another poster suggested. Get him / her to take notes of the odd bit of information that you are given and that might keep things a bit calmer and worry the school people.

Icimoi · 30/09/2014 13:15

I think one of the questions for the first teacher to answer is whether she tried to check by looking in the bin for the torn up paper - if it wasn't there it would immediately demonstrate the bully was lying, if it was she should be able to tell from relatively few pieces of paper whether anything offensive was written.

The other question is whether that teacher was told about your daughter's SN; if not, why not and what they're going to do about this in future; and if she was told, why she didn't take it into account.

GoblinLittleOwl · 30/09/2014 14:59

Go into school, make an appointment to see the Y1 teacher and ask her what happened. Deal with it then; don't speculate until you have heard what she has to say. Special Needs doesn't come into it.

Original poster
TheStrawberryQueen · 30/09/2014 21:05

Well after meeeting with the head and the Yr 1 teacher I am not sure what to think.

The teacher said that she had just believed Emily's story and had just started shouting at my DD without listening to my DD's side of the story. She also admitted that she hadn't looked through the bin to check to see if anything had been thrown away and that she had shouted at DD for quite a while.

However she didn't agree that she handled it wrong and thinks she was in the right to do that. She also kept bringing up the fact that Holly is only a Yr 1 child and DD should know better Confused and made it clear that she still thinks DD said and wrote those things. Even though she has no evidence to back that up other than what another child told her.

DD insists she never said anything nasty or wrote anything nasty and considering how upset she still is and saying she doesn't want to go to school any more I'm inclined to believe her.

But I'm not crazy to think that this wasn't the best way to handle this, right?

Also I may be being a bit precious but my DS starts reception next year and I'm feeling a bit wary if this teacher is still there by the time he reaches Yr 1. I just don't get a good feeling from her in general Sad.

OP posts:
Goldmandra · 30/09/2014 21:49

That would worry me too.

Did the head have an opinion on whether this was a reasonable response from the teacher?

I think I'd confirm today's conversation exactly as it happened in an email and see if they decide to backtrack once it's in writing.

I would also ask for a copy of the school's behaviour management policy to see if the teacher's behaviour is in line with it. If it's a decent policy, it won't be.

Purplepoodle · 30/09/2014 22:16

What did the principle say?

whois · 30/09/2014 22:17

Wow the teacher is being awful!

Not all teachers are good at their jobs, or nice people. Sometimes they make mistakes, are incompetent and sometimes plain nasty. Looks like you've got one here who is plain nasty.

What did the head say?

Original poster
TheStrawberryQueen · 30/09/2014 22:29

The head actually agreed with me and said no it wasn't the best way to handle this. She seemed annoyed at the teacher so I suppose that's a good thing at least.

OP posts:
FunkyBoldRibena · 30/09/2014 22:32

Teachers shouldn't shout at pupils for a start, let alone shout for 'quite a while'...

I'd also confirm your understanding of the situation in writing and ask what the school is going to do to prevent it from happening again, to prevent teachers from shouting at students for 'quite a while' rather than finding out what actually happened, and what they are going to do to prevent your daughter from being bullied by this girl again.

Mumoftwoyoungkids · 30/09/2014 22:45

Dear Head,

Thank you for meeting with me today. I would like to clarify our understanding of the incident that took place yesterday.

  1. There is significant evidence that Emily has bullied dd in the past.
  1. Dd is currently undergoing tests for ASD.
  1. Emily informed Mrs X thatbdd had written some nasty things about Emily and Hollie and then threw the paper in the bin.
  1. Dd completely denies she did this.
  1. Mrs X did not attempt to verify the story by confirming whether there was paper in the bin.
  1. Mrs X did not attempt to verify the story by asking dd for her side of the story.
  1. Mrs X proceeded to shout at dd for "quite a while" and continued to shout even after dd became very visibly distressed.
  1. Dd is now too frightened to return to school.
  1. Mrs X believes her behaviour was appropriate.

Please could you confirm that you agree with points 1 - 9 and also let me know of the procedure to make a formal complaint about the school.

Yours sincerely

Strawberry

maddening · 30/09/2014 22:52

Mummy's letter is fab - def take this further - what did the teacher say when ht agreed with you? What did the ht say was her next step?

DontWorrryBaldrickHasACunningP · 01/10/2014 02:19

Teacher is an unprofessional loon, go with mumoftwo's letter!

holidaysarenice · 01/10/2014 02:39

I would at to number 7 - mrs x by her own admission states that she proceeded....

And I would add something about the head agreeing it was poor management of the situation.

Altinkum · 01/10/2014 04:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Swipe left for the next trending thread