To consider moving to Sydney and uproot my DH and two DC for two years...

[MrsDe]

Hi all, I've just been told that there is now a real opportunity for me to embark on a secondment in Sydney for two years starting January. Amazing opportunity and we're seriously considering it (currently live in London).

I'm chatting to HR about further details but to be honest they seem pretty clueless and I've never done anything like this before. I'm trying to be objective and work out whether it is something that is good for the family overall or whether I'm being totally unreasonable and selfish in thinking about it.

I have two children six and four and DH is a teacher so will not work initially but would like to eventually if he can. He says he's up for it and fully supports me but I do feel guilty uprooting him.

Am I mad to even consider this with a young family? My job is quite full on and so potentially long hours (which I do in the UK anyway). But what level of salary will this be achiveable on one salary alone?

We will rent out our current house which will cover our UK mortgage/letting fees etc and we're not big spenders or have any other debt and currently manage in the UK with private school fees etc so think we can do this on one salary but I could be just totally naive? Aware of the school fees for professionals on visas etc.

Gosh, sorry about the length of this post! I'm just not sure whether I'm being unreasonable in thinking this is a great opportunity - or am I being selfish and focussing on my career ahead of my family?

Dcs are 6 and 4.

I lived abroad for 5 years over two countries when I was younger. Came back to UK in time to start secondary school. Do it, I wouldn't change my experience for the world.

This is one of those things that you'll regret if you don't, be ready to compromise and your children can only benefit from the experience

Best of all your DH is on board

Grab it with both hands

Amazing. Thanks all! Need to do some research on what constitutes a "good" package and start negotiating with HR I think!

I would have leapt at it when our children were that age. Now with A levels and GCSE's looming it is no longer a possibility. Perhaps when they are all out of 2ndary dh and I can alone.

I also moved my kids to America at 6, 4 and 2. It was a really good time to move them, much better than secondary school age.

Sounds like a fabulous opportunity if the package is right.
An expat package usually gets the home holidays and state holidays in the new location. If you have 25 says here, plus bank hols; then the norm I have seen is 25 days plus local state hols.
Test what happens if they ask you to stay an extra yr or two or convert you to a local contract and sponsor you to emigrate
Think about conditions which might force a return sooner than expected. Write them in so you get the cost of return if a parent is terminally ill for example
Maternity - no intention of more kids but just in case
Housing costs in Sydney are astronomical. Do your research !

V v jealous.

Go for it! Your kids are a great age to do it and it will be an amazing experience for you all.

Do think about what you will do after this secondment. Are there returned expats in your 'home' company? What has happened for them careerwise?

We had the chance and took it to move to Europe as expats. No regrets about the move but I do wish I had thought more about the return. Sadly I dont think it did my career as much good as I would have hoped.

View any verbal promises by your home employer with extreme caution. Remember that policies change. Only believe what you have in writing.

If I had the chance I would do it again but I would be a lot less trusting.

We did this when DD1 was 5 and DS 3, when we lived in Adelaide for a year. Academically it did the children no harm at all and I really loved the Australian system for them. Socially it was a little bit tricky for DD1 who found her friends had moved on a bit while she was gone, but she settled back in quite quickly.
However, the benefits for us as a family were that we all became very close as we had no family to rely on. We also did lots of tremendous travelling and have very happy memories. This was 10-11 yrs ago and we regularly talk about it still now.
Anything you want to ask; fire away! But I would go for it.

To be honest, I think you'd be bonkers not to jump at the chance.

Check salary - Sydney is expensive. Rent, eating out, groceries etc. Dont know what you do (and I'm basing this on Melbourne which is equally as stupid) but at minimum you'd want $160k...and that's minimum.

Insurance. Get good health cover and be aware a trip to the GP will cost $80. Insurance pays for a chunk but you're still left with an out of pocket.

Cars are expensive, petrol is expensive.

Supermarkets don't do stuff like Tesco Finest or M&S ready meals.

Internet is slow. Customer service is terrible.

People are more positive. Sun shines. It's less materialistic. It's outdoorsy. Lots of sporty stuff.

Go with an open mind. Also remember things change and 'two years' sometimes does too. I worked overseas for a year...eight years and two continents later and I've never made it back.

Why? Have family there. £10 pom. Chose your area carefully as been told some ares are very dangerous. I have cousins who born there who say theres limited culture and just the surfing, drinking culture. Go on holiday for a month or two first to see if you get on. Do you know anyone who lives there. What job?

Do it. Don't count on saving any money though.

IME Sydney is more expensive than London.

Morloth you're not wrong! The Economist just ranked Sydney and Melbourne in the top 5 most expensive cities in the world this year. Apparently the Australian dollar just keeps appreciating. I was shocked myself - DH had just had an offer to work in Melbourne which we were considering. It would be fun but we are in a really good position where we are currently living so we can't justify the move right now. Maybe in a few more years.

It is worth keeping in mind that we all complain about the cost of living whilst living in big houses, driving cars and for the most part eating meat.

But yes, the same 'lifestyle' costs more in Sydney than it did in London.

When will your 4yo be 5? Presumably before July 31st, otherwise they can't start school in Sydney in January and you'd need to look for preschools. Places can be pretty tough to find so try to get on waitlists now.

If your 4 yo is 5 soon then good. Bear in mind that most kids with a birthday between March and july get held back and start school rising 6. Especially boys and especially in affluent areas.

My kids are similar age to yours and I live in a nice spot in Sydney so feel free to pm me.

Oh and most hr relocation depts are rubbish so don't let them put you off. Try to get them to find you another person over here on a secondment to talk to. They will be your best point of comparable info. Good luck!

we moved back and fore with a primary school child...they are very adaptable .

And don';t worry about the hols- you usually get something to compensate for not being eligible for Long Service Leave...I got 6.4 days per year. As it happened I managed to take my LSL as my 2 year posting overran a bit.

Its a great adventure and as long as the package is good (accom is V expensive) go for it.

Look at domain.com.au for rentals. Look at Coles and Aldi online for sample food prices. Australia is quite a car focused society so even living in inner city Sydney if that is what you decide, you will need a car.
Look at eastern suburbs and northern beaches for lovely places to live.
Go for it - brilliant ages to move DC.

I agree with others that your children are probably good ages to be able to cope with a move, and that two years is OK for resettling, but I did want to add a slight air of caution about assuming it will be 'good for them'. We moved to the States when our two were slightly older, almost 8 and 6 and ds (the older one) found it very hard to give up his friendships and start again. He was just that bit too young to hold onto his UK friends and he struggled to break into friendship groups at school and found that very very hard.

The other thing I'd say is don't count on them remembering much - my two have very little recall of England now (we have settled permanently in Canada now).

That's not to say don't go, but don't do it for the children IYSWIM. they may get great benefits or they may struggle, probably a bit of both.

On a more positive note my sister recently returned from I think four years in Melbourne and her children (now 15 and 12) settled back into life in the UK very well even though they aren't in the same area they left. The older one went down the IB route which made the transition easier but the younger one was at an 'ordinary' Australian school and hasn't had any real issues.

Do it! I love Sydney. Everyone I know who's gone to Australia for work has never come back!

Londonrach

Chose your area carefully as been told some ares are very dangerous.

Unlike London? If she's going to a professional type job on a good income she is very unlikely to ever visit, let along accidentally live in a dangerous area!

I have cousins who born there who say theres limited culture and just the surfing, drinking culture.

I think your cousins need to leave the pub and get out and see some opera, visit some museums and galleries, get into some of the wonderful art/cultural/performance festivals that are on in Sydney very year.

I think you may have been given a rather unbalanced view of what Sydney is like.

Check out the Living Overseas board to get a good perspective from expats over in Au/Sydney.

Sydney is a fabulous, hot, cosmopolitan, buzzy, beachy, stylish city, great for adults and for kids. I think you'd be crazy not to go!

I love Sydney. All I'll say is don't suckered into the 'have to live in eastern Sydney' trap that so many expats seem to do under the misunderstanding that Western Sydney is a dangerous badlands of NESB immigrants. It's incredibly expensive in the east. We know one expat who has not been able to save a penny. I live in the Parramatta district and it's an awesome and relatively inexpensive place to bring up a family.

Do it!! We are ten months into a two year secondment in Sydney, living on the North Shore.

Life is great out here for littlies, so many parks, beaches, outdoor activities. Playgroups are a life saver for an expat like me, I have met and made friends (mostly other expats and Aussies who have lived in the UK) so quickly and easily.

Seriously considering not returning to dreary England!!

What an opportunity. I can't believe you're even asking us. Go, woman! You'll regret it for the rest of your life if you don't.

Sydney is lovely. My friend worked there for a couple of years and had a ball.

Your children are still very young and will adapt and settle in wonderfully. As a teacher, your DH will also presumably be able to pick up work, visa permitting.

Do it!!! We moved abroad 18 months ago with a 3 and 4.5 year old, best thing we ever did. So many experiences and adventures and we are all so so happy.