to get angry about benefit cuts not cheats

[bigmouthstrikesagain]

I have been volunteering at the CAB for the last few months - a very rewarding interesting experience and informative about the level of hidden poverty in Britain.

man dies after benefits cut

We get calls from people regularly who are have had their benefits suspended for a minor issue - often related to not getting to interviews (a rural area with very poor and expensive public transport) - they have no food and in one case recently the emergency food parcel was no use as it was all food that needed to be heated/ cooked and the individual had no money for the electricity meter. Vulnerable people who have just left an abusive relationship and have no idea how to access the benefits they are entitled to, people with learning difficulties stressed and depressed as they struggle to understand the complex benefits system. These are people coming in or ringing the CAB office daily.

This makes me angry and so I find it hard to raise the same level of ire for the benefit cheats - though I suppose I should - it is not the benefit cheats that are maintaining the cycle of poverty and low expectations.

If the question about working and attending interviews at the jobcentre was directed at me you can work some hours and claim JSA. At that time (several years ago) I was working 8 hours a week over various days and so was allowed to claim JSA as I was working under 16 hours a week. However, I was still required to attend to sign on and attend any interviews they lined up for me as well as those I had obtained through applying for work.

Not everyone claiming JSA is totally unemployed. And the job I was doing, 8 hours, was found for me by the jobcentre as it was relevant to the field I wanted to work in.

I see why that grates tick, I don't think that benefits are too generous but I think the minimum wage is too low and that people should be paid a living wage.

Sanctions against chronically ill and disabled people have risen by 580% in a year, according to The Guardian.

Mrs DV is right, it's the government's narrative, not reality.

I can think of 2 people in the last couple of weeks who got sanctioned. one who was on a course arranged by job centre , but guy didn't write it down, another who got called into job centre while at work.

I know someone who sits on social security tribunals. She absolutely hates the way they deal with sickness benefits. For people with very complex mental health problems, for instance, they don't do the sensible thing and get reports from the experienced psychiatrists who have been dealing with the person for, sometimes, years, and know precisely what they're talking about. They don't even bother to get copies of medical notes. What they do is get some nurse with zero experience of mental health work to assess whether the person is fit to work by doing a tick-box exercise.

What makes it even worse is that it is circular. If the patient is lucky, he gets help with appealing against the refusal of benefits and succeeds. But three months later he gets called back for assessment, meets another inexperienced nurse, and the whole thing starts again. It's utterly ridiculous, because the expense of running tribunals outweighs any financial savings made.

How on earth did we reach a point when this was thought to be a sensible or humane way to run the system?

veritata that's what happened to my friend who had cancer. She had to appeal twice after being told to work on the days she wasn't having treatment. Whilst waiting for one appeal was sent another assessment And got money as by then she was within six months of dying. Then was sent a form shortly after celebrating having survived past the six months she was given. She was then told following assessment she could work and died two weeks later with nothing, terrified and facing homelessness.

People, especially CAB, kept telling her not to worry and she would get the money back on appeal but the point was she would be dead by then and sadly that's what happened.

I wonder how many people don't appeal because of the stress of doing so? Or like my friend don't have the time left to do so? (Appeals here take almost a year).

Yes it sucks BUT we are lucky to have benefits even if the system needs improving

YANBU. All these shitty little programmes like benefit street when this is the real scandal.

I don't understand either why people look down the way lay the blame for their money issues with low pay etc. Look up the way to those with power (and money).

Waffle, it isn't laying blame. It isn't saying 'hey this is YOUR fault,' because of course it isn't.

But just as you would (surely) feel frustrated if you were doing double the hours as someone else at work, and yet were not seeing the financial rewards for it, sometimes I see frustration and annoyance around me.

What doesn't help is that many of the people I meet in my line of work are reliant on benefits and while the majority are nice and respectful of what we do, you do get the odd one that treats you like absolute shit. Then I hear colleagues say things like 'ffs, my taxes pay for them to sit there and speak to me like that!' (Obviously out of hearing of the person in question!)

I do think there's a sense of entitlement in the country and I don't think that's a good thing.

Personally I would prefer sickness and disability to be completely separate. No one chooses this! Something like a pension or even a salary scheme. After all, if I got too unwell to work I'd hope I could access enough money to live from reasonably comfortably.

As it is though I'm up at the crack of dawn, in gone 11 some nights, work weekends, anti social hours, dealing with blood and sweat and tears - for £7 an hour, sometimes it would be easier to stay in bed!

Although I never would.

Purple. I doubt those relying on food banks are feeling too lucky.

It was even considered to put jobseekers on the Cambridge Diet.

welfarenewsservice.com/ids-considered-putting-overweight-jobseekers-celebrity-diets/

I think tick sums up the frustration a lot of people feel about benefits. I think most people don't begrudge have a temporary safety net. What people don't like is watching people who work less with better outcomes.

for example, benefits are a function of the neighbourhood someone already lives in. If you happen to live in an expensive neighbourhood, you are entitled to more benefits so you can stay in that neighbourhood. there is no such protection for people not entitled to benefits are people not in council housing. if their rent goes up they have to find cheaper accommodation.

I do think there's a sense of entitlement

What do you mean by this?

If I should be unlucky enough ever to be out of a job then yes I would feel entitled to benefits that are enough to live on. Everyone should have enough to live on even if they are 'feckless, lazy and entitled'. If there are not enough jobs paying enough money to live on then what difference does it make to me or you whether it's the same people on benefits for years or people taking it in turns for 6 months a time. The benefits bill is the same.

written but why are the people who can't stay in their area because they can't get benefits (and being on benefits is no guarantee) annoyed at people on benefits? It's not their fault. They don't have the power. Look up, not down for fault.

I remember at the public sector strike to protect their pensions. Someone said 'I don't get a pension at my job, why should you?' Why is the answer her employer's lack of pension benefits to take a pension away from PS workers?

Waffly its the "ive been mugged so my neighbour should be mugged too" attitude.

I just want people who are fairly entitled to benefits to get them in an orderly and timely manner, and for the whole 'sanctions' system to be reviewed because people being sanctioned and losing JSA because they are at a job interview instead of at the job centre is bonkers.

I deplore IDS. The man is witless. Not the first witless cabinet minister, but jeez, what does he have on Cameron that means he continued to stay in post despite the havoc he is wreaking?

Programmes such as 'Benefits Street' (very misleading title surprise surprise) are the modern day equivalent of the medieval practice of putting beggars in stocks and throwing rubbish at them.
Skewed programming aimed at feeding those who wish to sit in an armchair and moan about 'scroungers'. Yawn. C4 can do so much better.

I do think there's a sense of entitlement in the country and I don't think that's a good thing.

So, here I am, it's 4.a.m. I'm shattered. I have been sorting disabled dh out for the last hour. Am currently downstairs hoping his meds are going to kick in so that I can get a bit of sleep before I have to be up for seven.
I did get up to turn dd at two, she's been sailing this weekend, so she's battered and bruised and unlikely to wake up unless woken.
At seven I'll be up doing breakfasts and organising folk for school.
I won't be able to catch up on sleep but hey, I'm used to it, most days are like this. I get 60 quid a week for this. I work 18 hours a day, seven days a week, etc. We lost a respite care in cutbacks about 18 months ago. I want a full time wage and extra help. I won't get it. Sense of entitlement? Too fucking right because without it I wouldn't even get the sodding carers allowance.

Stubborn yes, that's a problem alright. None of it is an excuse for doing nothing to sort it out on all fronts though.

dawndonna. Carers allowance is pitiful and of course without the carer, the disabled person would be costing the state ££££ more.

I don't know why you're swearing at me dawn. I've already said I think sickness and disability are a separate thing.

Later I have to visit a family deemed at risk - not ill, but unable to care for their children. I have to clean up mouse droppings and check they have food in, offer support with shopping and other tasks. One of these is mopping the lounge and kitchen floor (laminate) - we aren't allowed to empty the dirty water into the toilet or sink so we are made to go outside. Problem is it's a flat on the fourth floor.

That's what I am talking about with entitlement - the attitude that I'm entitled to this money, you OWE me this,I'll treat you like my personal slave because I'm ENTITLED to a visit!

On the contrary there are others who are just lovely and so very grateful.

You can't generalise but yeah - it stings a bit.

Tick
What exactly is it that you resent?
You have a job. Many people would love to have a job and get off benefits and not fear sanctions and the repercussions of sanctions.
I am shocked that you think having a child would improve your income. Single parents (or unemployed couples) also get sanctioned for silly things. Single parents (or couples) have to pay for childcare, the whole cost isn't covered by benefits. They also have to feed their children and clothe them.
By all means be angry at a system that leaves you struggling financially but don't blame people who your perceive to have a cushy life courtesy of benefits when you really have no idea of the ins and outs.
Be angry at the cost of living vs minimum wage.

I with you, ticktickboomtick

I understand what you are saying.
And you are right that some people are arguing from a position of privilege and just don't 'get' it.

Others, when I give them factual examples, they just do not want to believe them. Or go suddenly very quiet.

Miss, I'm doing 60 hours a week this week as we are so short staffed.

Some people who are unwell would doubtless love to have my job because it would mean they were able bodied, but I'm not talking about those people.

I also haven't said I think it's a cushy life - I think it's the same life as me! sometimes with a few extras thrown in.

I would ironically be much better off if I had a child but I just can't. I have thought about it in darker times - but it's explaining myself when the child is a teen.

I sometimes think everyone should do a week in my life and a week in the life of someone reliant on state benefits (not DLA or the equivalent - ESA) and see which is preferable; I should, too!

I bet most would conclude both are pretty miserable! But it would be interesting to see which is worse.

I bet most would conclude both are pretty miserable! But it would be interesting to see which is worse.
Are you serious?
I honestly think you may need to see someone about that build up of resentment you have there.

Below is the current list of DWP 0800 telephone numbers that claimants can use to call the DWP for free from a mobile.
List of abbreviations:
NISSA Northern Ireland Social Security Agency
TPS The Pension Service
PDCS Pensions, Disability & Carers Service
MOPR Method of Payment Reform
0800220674 NISSA Benefit Enquiry Line for AA, DLA, Carer's Allowance & Carer's Credit
0800882200 DLA / AA Main Benefit Enquiry Line
0800991234 Pension Credit Application Line – TPS
08000121888 JCP First Contact New Claims - Welsh
08000224250 Customer First Line
08000327952 JCP New Claims Crisis Loans - English
08000328355 JCP New Claims Crisis Loan - Welsh
08000556688 JCP First Contact New Claims
08000856318 NI ESA Fresh Claims
08000856528 Customer Payment Centre - Shared Services
08000857075 PDCS TPS Method of Payment Refor - MOPR
08000857102 Customer Payment Centre - Shared Services
08006783682 DWP Emergency Line - English
08006783696 DWP Emergency Line - Welsh
08006783717 JCP New Claims Crisis Loans
08007314811 PDCS TPS Pension Credit
08007317898 PDCS TPS State Pension New Claims
08007317936 PDCS TPS State Pension New Claims - Welsh
08081002658 NISSA State Pension New Claims
08081006165 NISSA Pension Credit New Claims
08001690096 NISSA IB (IS) Re-assessment
08000121573 NISSA PIP Fresh Claims (not operational until PIP goes live in NI)
08009172222 PIP New Claims Service Line
08006783675 JCP Emergency