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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To not want to pay for another scrounger?

500 replies

weatherall · 08/09/2014 10:38

Poor Kate's with child again.

When will these scroungers stop pumping out sprogs they expect all the rest of us to pay for?

OP posts:
MNHQ
YetAnotherHelenMumsnet · 09/09/2014 12:51

Hello all, can we remind you please of the MN Talk Guidelines?

emotionsecho · 09/09/2014 12:56

written just out of interest what President model do you want?

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 12:56

Likewise
Let's just look carefully at the facts.
Harry has been to Afghanistan twice. On the first occasion there was a news blackout, and no-one knew he was there. When it was discovered, he was very quickly removed - and only then did it break in the press.
Don't get this confused with his second tour four years later.
On this occasion we knew he was there, and as a highly qualified Apache pilot he was exposed to the same risks as his colleagues. On this occasion he completed his tour, although he did provide a target for the Taliban, who on one occasion breached the perimeter fence of Bastion.
They are masters of propoganda (although we're not so bad ourselves) and said that Harry was their target, although the feeling of the professionals on the ground was that they would always attack if they felt that had a chance of causing harm to anyone.

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 13:39

When it was discovered he was there..... that was bound to happen. So really it would have been better for all concerned if he hadn't been there.In the battlefield you should never have such dilemmas as that.

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 13:57

I suppose it was - but he did complete 11 weeks of his four month deployment. Interestingly, it was the German and Australian press that broke the media blackout.

Would it have been better if he hadn't gone? That would have been an awful waste of the money spent in training, and he did work in air control at Helmand - a pretty useful job!

Missunreasonable · 09/09/2014 14:03

Do we actually know for certain how many times Harry has been deployed?
The media have reported two occasions but can we be fully certain that there are only two occasions? If the foreign media hadn't announced his deployment last time we might never have known about it.
Of course it might really be just the two occasions but seeing as I am not attached to Harry by an umbilical cord or similar I really don't know.

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 14:05

Well you just said it....that would have been an awful waste of training.....so really when you consider how much the training costs, is it worth it when you consider what will always happen when Harry is in a war. It's not worth the training. There are many useful roles jobs in life Harry could do but I don't think being in the military in war zones is one of them.

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 14:56

Twice as far as I know Miss. Having been open with the situation on the second tour, I can't imagine anyone would choose to try and hide a third tour.

what will always happen when Harry is in a war is that he will do a job - like the other servicemen there, who have also been trained.

His first deployment he was an air traffic controller in Helmand, and secondly a highly qualified Apache pilot. Both pretty serious contributions to the war effort I would have thought!

Are you saying no servicemen's training is worth it, as there are many other jobs they could do?

IsThisOneTaken · 09/09/2014 15:01

Because, Maisy, I haven't stated anything that isn't factually correct. If you take a look at your post from 09:13 it is full of factual inaccuracy and things that you simply cannot know to be true... But are presenting as fact anyway.

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 15:19

is that he will do a job......but only to a certain degree, I'm not saying he wouldn't want to carry a job through, it probably does frustrate him when he isn't allowed to carry it through, but the fact remains he won't ever be allowed to do so,,,therefore my point about his whole role in the army still stands. if he isn't able to do all the things he's trained for because of restrictions then he should consider another role in life

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 15:26

isthisonetaken....... In my post at 09.13 I stated that it's a well known fact that Harry was pulled back. That isn't my opinion, it is a well known fact and at the time was well documented by all the major news channels.

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 15:34

But he can do the things that he has been trained to do Maisy - he's done them!

Rumour has it that he would have loved to trial for the SAS, but realised that he would never be allowed on operations, so it wouldn't be a good thing to do. Rumour though - not fact!

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 15:37

I give up.

IsThisOneTaken · 09/09/2014 15:37

Maisy... Your post of this morning says....

It's a well known fact that Harry was never allowed to be in any danger in Afganistan. rubbush He was pulled back at the first sign of trouble. yup Him being there often made his troop more of a target. you can't know this There is no insult to Harry, the insult is to all the brave service men and women who didn't get special treatment and weren't whisked away when it was thought their lives were in danger. you don't speak for my DH when you say this. He wasn't insulted To even suggest that at any time Harry's life was in any real danger in Afganistan is laughable. rubbish It just wouldn't happen.

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 15:38

Your complete statement in the 09.13 post reads It's a well known fact that Harry was never allowed to be in any danger in Afganistan. He was pulled back at the first sign of trouble. Him being there often made his troop more of a target.

In his first tour he was withdrawn after 11 weeks, when the German and Australian press broke the media blackout. He had 11 weeks worth of trouble to contend with, and a further 4 months in his second tour.

That simply does not equate with being pulled back at the first sign of trouble.

IsThisOneTaken · 09/09/2014 15:39

He was pulled back on the second tour, I believe, when Bastion was breeched.

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 15:49

I didn't know that IsThis - I thought he completed the tour, although I did know that he was taken to safety when Bastion was breeched.

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 16:01

Up until then he was in no real danger. I stand by what I said.aghand

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 16:17

He was serving in Afghanistan and not in danger.

That's really good to hear - perhaps you could pass that fact on to the families of other servicemen - I bet they'll sleep better tonight.

I do think you should take your own advice Maisy - and give up! Smile

CariadsDarling · 09/09/2014 16:53

He was flying an Apache helicopter and he wasn't in danger?

Right ohHmm

IsThisOneTaken · 09/09/2014 16:57

Bangs head on table

Of course he was in danger, Maisy. He was in bloody Afghanistan!!'

It is widely known that Bastion, where he was based is relatively secure when compared with FOBs and patrols, but it's not safe by any means.

Ain't no bodyguard team in the world that can stop a mortar landing on your head or indirect fire hitting you. Or small arms fire hitting you as you land/take off from the runway.

Aj... He completed the tour after the breech but I believe he was moved back to a place of relative safety within Bastion at the time of the incident. Sure, no other member of the Forces was afforded that 'luxury'... But no other person's capture or death could have given the same PR victory to the Taliban.

I have no problem with the protection Harry was afforded. And I say that as a military wife whose husband has completed 4 tours of Afghanistan (and who was mortared in... Yup you guessed it... Bastion!!) And - more importantly to me, neither does DH.

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 17:14

Prince Harry was in Afghanistan, so he was obviously in danger. I walk found town, I might get run over by a bus. The odds of it happening are pretty remote......Harry was unable to complete his tour of duty because it was perceived he was in serious danger....what on earth is so hard to understand about that. Do we have to argue black is white just to win an argument?

ajandjjmum · 09/09/2014 17:27

Maisy
16.01 Up until then he was in no real danger That is what you said!

You cannot seriously compare the dangers of being in Afghanistan with the possibility of being hit by a bus as you walk around town.

Although he didn't complete his first tour, he did his second, as confirmed by IsThisOneTaken - who clearly knows an awful lot more about conflict than you or I.

I'm actually arguing that black's black and white's white! I'm not bothered about winning, just about the facts being correct.

Maisyblue · 09/09/2014 17:43

ajand.....are you deliberately trying to misconstrue the point I'm making. I was using the bus scenario as an analogy, of course there is no comparison. The facts are correct......he was pulled back when it was deemed too dangerous for him to continue. Why does that bother you so much?

LalaLeona · 09/09/2014 17:44

So many royalist sycophants on this site..it's so predictable. Wake up people! For what it's worth I agree OP, although the way you worded it was a little blunt!