to actually feel sorry for the driver of the car? WARNING- upsetting video.

[ToThePark]

Ok, so I've been a wimp and name changed in case I get totally flamed.

www.suffolk.police.uk/newsandevents/newsstories/2014/september/hardhittingvideolaunched.aspx

The motorcyclist was travelling at 100mph past a busy junction. I watched this video and thought, as a car driver, this could easily happen to me. What an horrific thing to have on your conscience.

What if it had been a child crossing?

He had no way to stop, he overtakes at 2:49, at 2:51 you can see the car in the video wanting to turn, and at 2:54 he is dead.

If he is doing a normal speed he would have had more time to react, more time to evade, and a better ability to anticipate other drivers' bad driving, rather than having to concentrate solely on his own bad driving (at that speed it was definitely bad, and would require much more concentration than doing 50 or 60mph).

Both the rider & the driver were at fault , unfortunately one of them lost thier life.

How turning this into a bikers V drivers is in anyway helpful is quite beyond me.

I saw this on the TV news last night. It is appalling for all concerned.

I would say there was fault on both sides, but I fully agree with all of those who have said that the speed of the motorcyclist was a massive contributing factor here. I can't prove it obviously, but I can't help feeling that if he hadn't been going so insanely fast then possibly the whole incident may not have occurred. There would have been far more chance of either the car driver or the motorcyclist (or both) seeing each other in time and both would have had more chance to react accordingly. Also, much more chance that they would not have been anywhere near each other.

Nobody deserves anything like this. Yes, I do have a lot of sympathy for the car driver.

To my mind the message should be aimed equally at both car drivers and motorcyclists. Car drivers obviously should "think once, think twice, think bike" and to pause and make sure they have looked as effectively as possible, and motorcyclists should absolutely take on board just how vulnerable they are, and how dangerous it is to ride at such massive speed.

I am sure most of us who drive cars have experienced how startling it is when suddenly a motorbike appears from behind out of apparently nowhere and comes flying past. It can literally happen that quickly.

I don't care how good that biker was or how bad the driver was.

Both have been punished.

But it's a public road, not a race track. The dead man was not Marc Marquez and should not have been driving at 97mph. That is reckless.

If he'd been recorded on a speed camera instead of dying in an accident, he'd have been flayed in court.

He'd have been banned for a considerable period for his gross speeding, heavily fined and, depending on his previous record, possibly imprisoned.

If it had come up on MN there would have been thread condemning his recklessness. In that case I doubt if they'd have been many, or any defenders.

this is a poor choice of video...It seems to place too much emphasis on being 'bike aware', with minimal mention of the importance of not speeding. His mother's comment about him loving speed almost sounds like she is excusing him.

I completely agree with you OP. I don't blame the biker's mother. I blame the police for their muddled message - I'm not even going to dignify it by calling it a campaign.

If this biker had caused a death by driving at 97 mph instead of dying himself, the police would have quite rightly had his arse on a plate.

Lots of bikers ride like this, you can find so many videos on youtube of similar riding. The bike he was riding does 0-60 in 2.8s, faster than a Porsche 911 or a Ferrari Enzo, people are riding for thrills, which is all good fun, but not when you are sharing the road with others.

Here's another death video

And the news report

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/speeding-biker-who-filmed-death-crash-banned-1702652.html

In that case there were two motorcyclists, and due to excess speed (156mph) the surviving motorcyclist was given a suspended prison sentence.

That the Think Bike campaign, with the idea that accidents involving motorbikes are entirely the fault of car drivers is likely to backfire if this video and the accompanying report are what they are using to support it.

Most drivers watching that will feel as much sympathy for the driver as they would the biker, if not more.

On reflection, I think the harsh sentence the driver received was influenced by the Think Bike campaign too. I'm sure in the past, a driver colliding with a motorbike being driven so recklessly would have been treated in a far more leniently.

How was the sentence harsh???? He wasn't even imprisoned.

I don't think the sentence was harsh, but a driving ban on someone who lives in that part of norfolk, would have a bigger impact than if he lived in Birmingham or London, you need to drive when you live somewhere like that.

I think the driver lost his job as a result. Not sure if driving was part of his job? if so, then that would have a bigger impact.

The sentence does reflect that the car driver was at fault though. So not harsh IMO.

I think it was a harsh sentence. He was disqualified for 18 months (as well as fine and unpaid community work - which I don't think were undue).

He didn't make a conscious decision to drive dangerously. He didn't drink before driving, he wasn't messing with his phone, he wasn't choosing to drive above the speed limit - which any reasonable person could assume could lead to an accident.

He either had a lapse of concentration or made a poor judgement - which I accept are punishable, but I think loss of licence (with the impact it had for him) was harsh.

He killed someone. That's a serious thing. It's about consequences as well as intent.

If you kill someone and you are to blame, a driving bad should be inevitable.

ban.

"He killed someone. That's a serious thing. It's about consequences as well as intent."

Well, that's an interesting point. I see people driving irresponsibly all the time: using their mobiles, breaking the speed limit, pulling out in front of other cars, and all the rest, and they never get punished, even though they are knowingly driving carelessly, because they are lucky enough that they haven't had an accident.

The driver in this case, however, seems at worst to have been guilty of a moment's inattention, and ended up in a collision that resulted in another person's death. I'm not really sure that the conclusion we should draw from that is that he is more deserving of punishment.

Maryz I'm struggling with that too. The driver could have checked, saw the car and correctly judged that he could make the turn before the car reached the junction. He then has to be checking both the road he is crossing and the road he is turning into, he didn't collide with the car. He collided with a bike that wasn't visible at the point when he made the decision to turn.

In that situation if a car had suddenly decided to overtake at over 90 miles an hour, there would probably still have been a collision because there simply wasn't time for either party to take evasive action when one was driving at that speed.

I think this was a tragedy for everyone involved but as a campaign, it's poor. It's simply reinforcing the stereotypes that bikes drive recklessly and at speed, and that car drivers don't even see them.

Very good point hackmum. People do far worse every day, yet (thankfully) nothing awful happens, most of the time.

Yes of course, there are fights in pubs every weekend, tens of thousands of people get a slap on the wrist for an unlucky few the punch kills the person they are fighting with and suddenly they are up on a murder charge. That's just how it works.

A car is much more of a deadly weapon than a fist, and a moment's inattention should not be acceptable, the reality is cars are very dangerous, people don't seem to get that cases aren't all in fun and games, they are also instruments of death and destruction.

I haven't read the whole thread, but I was thinking of the video as I drove today (as well as concentrating obviously!). My knee-jerk reaction was to feel sorry for the family of the biker (as I still do) , but when you consider the facts, that was a very fast speed to be going and any decent person is going to feel extremely sorry for the person who has had their life destroyed from killing another person by mistake.

Well motorcyclists are much more likely to kill themselves than others. The death rate is 30 times higher for motorcyclists than car drivers (per mile). They can of course kill others, but for me the message as a car driver is that there are motorcyclists doing insane speeds out there and riding on the roads like a race track, so you need to be prepared for that. I do NOT want to kill a motorcyclist, and the fact that they are riding like cunts in many cases isn't much of a comfort.

I don't understand this campaign at all. let's pretend the collision was between two cars. one who made the mistake of turning and the other who came out from behind another car at a huge speed way over the limit. would anyone then blame the other driver. people make minor mistakes all the time while driving but if you are going at a sensible speed ao leave enough distance between cars then a momentary lapse of judgment shouldn't end in a fatal accident.

I think the video used doesn't really help their message. it's basically saying if you drive a car the rules of the road apply to you and you should also have xray vision and expect motorbikes to come but you at speed at any given time. if you drive a motorbike the rules of the road don't apply and any consequence of you breaking the law will be the fault of the other driver.

I honestly think if motorbikes were only invented today they would never make it into production.