To get the rage every time I hear / read anything by Will Self

[WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid]

Every time he comes on radio 4 or I stumble across anything he's written I just end up angry.

Obviously he has his fans but to me he just sounds like a pompous arse who has swallowed a dictionary.

Grrrr

Oh the George Orwell piece irritated me immensely.

I like Orwell's writing. I prefer it to Self's.

He's upset you by describing George Orwell as a mediocrity, hasn't he?

I admit that's what tipped me over the edge this morning

So glad it's not just me.

Cock and bull is a great story! About people growing genitalia behind their knees and the horror that ensues.

You see, you describe that as a great story. I read that one sentence summary and think "What a wanker".

I quite like him.I heard him speak at the Edinburgh Book Festival a couple of times and he was very entertaining. I prefer him as a speaker than a writer.

On the other hand the expression "get the rage" is very irritating. Does anyone say this?

I sometimes say "oh I hate that, it gives me the rage"

Nice come back phaedral - he's not annoying, you are

I like Will Self the 'persona' - haven't read any of his books. I quite like Orwell too but Self's view that he's mediocre had me laughing and because I've also got a thing about 'mediocrity' being pervasively 'in charge and acceptable' I also thought - you're well right mate, well said.

I am also annoying too.

So far as I'm concerned, he deserves a medal for the way he put that twat Richard Littlejohn down - news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1390395.stm . I love the question "Does it turn into Tolstoy?"

I've seen him live, both at the Edinburgh Festival and at a small town near me. He's the kindest and gentlest of men - that was a big surprise. He's also very bright, very intelligent and very funny. I love him.

^
Are you Mrs Self?

I'd actually agree that, 'Animal Farm' is mediocre - I absolutely detest that book.

Being more likeable than Littlejohn, not really much of an achievement.

I read that transcript Will doesn't come across well either IMO (obviously biased as I've already said I dong like him).

Maybe he is incredibly charming on stage, he probably knows how to turn the charm on when needed.

I've never heard of him, not sure I want to find out about him now.

YANBU. He may have some interesting and valid points to make but the way he speaks and writes just smacks of intellectual snobbery, he really does sound as though he has swallowed a dictionary.

I believe if an idea has any merit it ought to be possible to explain it in a reasonably straightforward manner.

No, SquirrelledAway, I'm not his wife! Love her, though, too.

Eyebags, having a very wide vocabulary doesn't mean the speaker is an intellectual snob. I've heard him explain many, many things in a very straightforward manner, but the fact is that a range of words is there for a reason. Most people don't use a wide enough vocabulary; I hate it when people are slagged off for choosing their words carefully.

It's not the wide vocabulary that's my main problem (although I think the accusation of intellectual snobbery is valid).

It's the fact he never gets to the bloody point. You might be reading a beautiful and poetic argument but all I'm thinking is just get on with it.

By the time he's said what he was trying to say I've either lost interest or I'm furious because I've listened to him waffling on for 10 minutes trying to say what a less intelligent person would take 1 minute to say.

Once again grrr

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid
"By the time he's said what he was trying to say I've either lost interest or I'm furious because I've listened to him waffling on for 10 minutes trying to say what a less intelligent person would take 1 minute to say. "

Absolutely, you hit the nail on the head there.

ImperialBlether
I agree there is nothing wrong with having or using a wide vocabulary, at times. However I think at other times it IS a form if intellectual elitism and snobbery. Will Self is well educated, well read and very intelligent..... not everybody is. By choosing to write and speak the way he does he must be aware that he is excluding a significant number of people from any debate taking place.

I'm not saying everything should be simplified to suit the lowest common denominator, but being inclusive important.

Oh and I don't think choosing to use obscure words that 95% of the population will have to look up in a dictionary can be classed as "choosing words carefully". In my opinion it is just intellectual cock waving - look at me, look at my superior knowledge of the English language. I can't help but think 'do fuck off you pretentious twit'.

@icimol - can't believe I'll appear to be on the side of Littlejohn, I feel dirty already - it is a great put down, but when Littlejohn asks "Well give me a reasoned opinion then. Tell me why it is a recruiting thing for the BNP?" he doesn't get an answer but a put down again. So even in that interview WS comes across as full of himself and eager to denigrate rather than critique; clever, clever rather than intelligent.

I like him, I've never felt the need for a dictionary when listening to him, neither do I find him verbose

YANBU, I find him v annoying, although in the linked interview less so, maybe because he is talking off the cuff and therefore without his dictionary.
I know I have sometimes read his stuff and started thinking actually, I agree and he's been quite perceptive and witty....and then he pisses me off with one of those incredibly obscure words. The thing is, I know I have a good vocabulary myself and enjoy the accurate use of words but in his case I agree it comes across as intellectual cock-waving.

I tried the Book of Dave but it pissed me off massively with it's wilfull incomprehensibility.

I really like Will Self and have enjoyed what I have read of his work. I won't go into details but I also have evidence of him being very kind and helpful to someone in real life.

We have enough people who cultivate a bland public persona. Self is a genius, actually.

I really would encourage people to read his books - The Quantity Theory of Insanity (short stories) was the first one I read. If you like what I seem to remember is the first story in that, read 'How the Dead Live'.

I think he once commented that people are sometimes now reluctant to engage with writing that demands effort from the reader. They don't want to have to work to understand or enjoy something, but why should that be the case? That can be very rewarding and the key to some great experiences. Not, btw, that you'll have to work to enjoy the ones I mentioned above.

I don't understand the problem with obscure words.
If I come across a word or phrase whose meaning (wholly or partially) eludes me I look it up.
It's an opportunity to expand my lexicon.

His arcane vocabulary is one of my favourite things about his writing. I've only read Great Apes, of his- and loved it. Not sure why I haven't read anything else he's done, but this thread has reminded me to remedy that soon.

My own vocabulary is nowhere near Selfian proportions but I often get people sourly commenting on my use of big words, as if I'm being a show-off, when I'm really not - I just like words: I like learning new ones and learning how to deploy them. Quite often I will mispronounce them (I always used to read "tousled" as "tussled" for example, or sometimes I'll want to say "tangential" but end up saying "tangenital instead". There's loads of others I get wrong too), but sounding like a berk doesn't stop me.

Ooh ooh just thought of a word he doesn't know - brevity