For detesting my SIL?

[1wokeuplikethis]

My SIL has been a complete handful from day one. She is a crazy narcissistic miserable selfish boozehag who thrives on drama and negativity. She comes from a very unstable family and has married into a very loving, close and warm family. But rather than be grateful at finally having some loving stability she can't help but bitch and moan about us and make snidey remarks and recently just make up lies about us all.

She keeps telling my brother she doesn't love him and can't be bothered to work at their marriage. They have two very young children together and he really wants things to work out between them because he loves her. But recently she has said terrible things about all of us. She's always been bitchy and every time she has put me down or insulted me I haven't responded so as to keep family bonds strong. But lately she has told my brother she doesn't like my relationship with my mum because we are so close, she thinks I'm superficial, she doesn't like me going to my parents house when they are visiting them because she doesn't want to 'share' their attention. She has said awful things about my parents and I am absolutely furious. I only know because my brother has sought advice/comfort from me and I haven't reacted so as not to break his confidence or cause further rows between them.

But by not having my right to reply and by feeling like a total doormat for several years already I am so so so so angry, I want to give her some home truths and for once have my say and tell her what a horrid spiteful liar she is. I'm angry she's hurting my brother and parents, I'm angry I can't do anything about it, I'm angry at the thought of her once again getting the upper hand over me because I 'can't' respond.

She is complete scum. She is a manipulative, heartless bully and I have given her so many chances I feel like an utter mug. She thinks she can talk to me any way she pleases and say disgusting things about me because she mistakes my loyalty and love for weakness.

So do I finally vent, have my say, strip her down a peg or two and feel an enormous sense of satisfaction at her finally being told what a fool she is. Or do I carry on sucking it up and getting a frickin stomach ulcer from all the rage I have swirling around? [OP edited by MNHQ]

You really don't sound full of 'love and loyalty'.

She may well be awful but your brother needs to deal with his own relationship problems and stop stirring.

Good grief, some of the responses to the OP are beyond belief. You need counselling?? Where on earth did that comment come from? Lord spare us from armchair psychologists.

OP you have come onto MN to vent & that is surely what the site is for. Yanbu to dislike your SIL but ywbu to break your DB confidence & use that information against her. I know I would be tempted to myself, however there are children involved & your DB is trying to keep his family together, just keep supporting him & grit your teeth when SIL is around.

It's not unreasonable to dislike her but having a go at get will achieve nothing.

You need to find a way to deal with your anger. It doesn't sound like her antics are causing a rift in your family so let her get on with it. Your bonds are stronger than her silly insults, no?

Just be there for your brother but don't get emotionally entangled in their mess. It's up to him to shut her down, not you.

Sorry to de-rail the thread but cretin is a negative word which is associated with Congenital Hyprothyroidism back in a time when nothing was known about the condition and sufferers had physical deformities and a child like mental state.
I have a 3 year old daughter with CH.
OP, maybe try a different word instead of 'cretin' next time.
I hate to be a person who shouts about being offended, and I know that people don't always know the origins of a word but it's a word which upsets me.

You seem overly invested in your brother's marriage. People do have marital problems, you know. It doesn't make them bad people.

You sound as if you think she should be very grateful for marrying into such a family. Perhaps she sees it differently. From what you describe, it sounds like a nightmare, you sound a bit scary and you might not be tge only one dishing out home truths. Maybe its a case of someone standing up to all of you at last?

In my experience it never works well when one person in a relationship tells someone in the family about their partner - that person's view of the partner is forever negatively altered even though they've only heard one side of the story. My MIL cannot stand her son in law due to things she has been told by her daughter, but they're still married - quite happily as far as I can tell. Nothing positive has come out of the daughter bitching about her husband to her mum so it would probably have been best for her not to say anything.

You have only heard your brother's side of things and he may not have interpreted everything correctly. You say that one of the things she said is that she doesn't like being at your mum's at the same time as you as she doesn't like to share the attention. From your posts I'm guessing you both have kids. She may find it stressful to have her kids and your kids together at your mum's, or feel it's stressful for your mum to have all the kids together. I know I prefer to have my foster kids at my in laws when other grandkids aren't there too, even though I love my inlaws and all the kids - it's just quite stressful when they're rampaging around together!

If your husband wants his relationship to work he needs to talk to her not you. I expect she would be very hurt if she knew he was running to you to complain about her. I have on occasion said something to my husband that I wouldn't want him to repeat. I love all my inlaws but the odd thing has happened that I have moaned to him about - I would be furious if he had 'told on' me!

She doesn't love your brother anymore & it sounds as if she finds you all too much.

that's just unfortunate tbh, doesn't make her horrible.

Just to add another point of view. My DP never gets to spend time with his parents 1:1. The minute we visit SIL turns up too. She's lovely and er want to spend time with her but their family don't see any benefit in 1:1 contact. My DP never said anything to her because it would only be seen as us not wanting her there. I often wondered if I should have said something but reading your post I'm glad I didn't cos it would have been taken entirely the wrong way.

And now I watch my son not get his grandma's attention too for any part of the visit. People are different. You don't sound very empathetic tbh.

Well I don't think you sound like you need counselling but on here, people love to assume the OP is in the wrong

But although its nice that your brother can talk to you, I do agree with others that you need to tell him to stop repeating what his wife has apparently said about you and your family.

I would also stop visiting your parents when sil and her family are there - give them space.

Do not get involved in their marriage though - because they may well stay together and then you will be the bad guy.

Avoid her-cool it completely but don't say anything-your brother needs to sort the relationship out for himself.
This is one of those threads where no-one knows the people involved so can't truly tell if YABU-and lots of people will project there own stuff on to it.
It is not unreasonable not to like someone but it would be unreasonable to have a big showdown with her.
Let go of the need to win.

Yes, very angry and I understand people thinking I sound unhinged but there's not enough space in this little comment box to go into enough detail on her and her relationship with all of us. I do actually feel like I've snapped, straw that broke the camels back sort of thing. My frustration is from her saying things about me and me being unable to respond- it's everyone's natural instinct to defend themselves.

She really is awful and we really are a lovely family who do anything for those we love. I'm just feeling very bent out of shape from the hurt and frustration that has built up.

I think you should tell your DB you don't want to hear insults from SIL, as you will repeat any future ones he tells you back to her and ask if she really said that.

He's stirring, his DW has said nasty things in private to him and he's repeated it to the person she's insulted. He is ensuring that you don't get on with her. Normal people would not do that. Loving people wouldn't do that, he would realise that it would hurt you and so not say it. He would realise he was ruining the chances of you and SIL being friends. Why is he telling you this???

Think about what you've written here, how happy would you be if your DP just told your SIL what you wrote about her? That's what your DB has done to her.

Step back - tell your DB you can't be the one he complains to if he wants you to all be happy families. You can't support him through his marriage problems, you are too close.

Don't offer help or spend more time than you need with SIL. Tell your DB it's impossible since he has told you what she's said about you in the past and perhaps he should have thought it through.

Your family aren't loving and caring, this is bitchy behaviour, normal families don't go running to each other to tell them what someone else has said behind their back. Couples are discreet in normal circumstances.

And yes, if your Parents are visiting your DB and SIL (or the other way round), then you shouldnt go round unless you have been asked - it's actually rather rude of you to think you need to be part of every family relationship.

Honestly, you really need to detach, just step away from her.

Do not retaliate - it won't help. Just avoid contact with her and tell your brother that you're not the best person to confide in with regards to her as you find it hurtful to hear what she thinks of you all.

And yes what Mary says about your brother repeating insults about you to you - who does that??

YANBU to detest her. People can dislike whomever they want and from your POV it sounds like you have reason.

But do you want to alienate your brother? Ultimately he's the only one who can do something about her and if you kick off at her then could she be the kind of person that insists he break away from you all? Or that you don't get to see their kids?

I get your brother needs a sounding board but he needs to find another. It doesn't help to say 'X said this, but don't tell her I told you', it only adds to frustration and causes more shit. He needs to speak to a professional who can ask the right questions and help him find what he wants to do. Next tiem he tries to talk to you, you need to tell him how much what he's saying is making you hate her. You need to explain that hearing him hurt, hurts and infuriates you and if he's going to stay with her then for the sake of the children he needs to find someone else and let your remain ignorant and able to be civil. Otherwise if he keeps telling, you'll have to say something and it could cause massive issues.

He should not be telling you, unless he'sl eaving her because you will still have to see and interact, which at present you'd find it hard to do.

Find a middle way between standing up for yourself and a complete venting meltdown. You don't (and probably, shouldn't) put up with being crapped on for the sake of your brother. If she's being awful to you, pull her up on it calmly.

I too think that repeating unkind stuff SIL has said is not a good idea of your brother's. Perhaps ask him not to give you the details and stick to generalities. You can still support him without knowing the gory details.

I think that if he is just venting but doing nothing, then beware of him using his chats with you for catharsis so he doesn't actually have to do anything, if you see what I mean. Try not to judge, just listen, and keep asking him what he thinks and what he intends to do. You can't fix it for him.

Step back a bit, see your parents when your DB and SIL aren't there, accept there is no friendship between you and SIL for whatever reason.

I think you're in a really difficult position and you need to tell your brother you aren't able to listen to him venting about his wife without saying something to her. He's treating you unfairly and letting off steam but expecting you not to do the same. If he continues to want a relationship with his wife he should seek counselling outside the family and stop causing a rift between the two of you.

If she has had an unstable upbringing she hadn't had the experience or teaching of living with positive relationships and how to foster them. She will maybe find it painful to see your relationship with your mum if she has nothing similar.

If I were you if tell your brother to grow some balls and deal with his relationship, if he needs outside help it isn't from you anymore as you can't deal with it.

My husband would probably say I'd married into a very close, supportive family; I know he thinks my family is dysfunctional & distant.

I, on the other hand, think my family is fine and find the closeness of his family suffocating. I can't bear it.

It's all a matter of perspective. But if her family is so awful could that explain why she is the way she is? Sounds like some empathy wouldn't go amiss rather than expecting gratitude that your oh so perfect family has let her into it. (NB I might be projecting here, that's sometimes how my ILs make me feel).

I come from a disjunction all family and married into a " warm and loving one" I get on fine with them all now but they have had to learn to allow me to be myself rather than be absorbed into their happy clan, which I found smothering at times and a bit odd.
If you come from a family where people dislike each other and actively try and screw each other over you assume that's what other families are like and that that they are just hiding it well.
Maybe your SIL just find you all a bit much and too involved in each other's lives, although to be fair she could just be a bitch as well!
I would also like it if I could visit my mil without SIL being there, which is unlikely as she lives 3 doors down - they have all their shared history and talk about people I don't know ( or care about frankly)
I do love my in laws but I am my own person as well

I understand your anger at hearing things your SIL has said about you behind your back. BUT, your brother can have support from you without divulging the personal comments she has made about you and your parents. My SIL is lovely, I'm a nice person (IMO ) but I'm sure she's made a few comments to her DH about me over the years as I have to my DH about her. If either of us found out it would no doubt poison our relationship completely.

Your brother is overstepping the boundaries when asking for your support by sharing stuff other than his relationship problems.

Your SIL isn't the problem, your DB is.

He sounds like he is loving the attention.

I really dislike my SIL who is a truely nasty person but I still wouldn't want her to hear what I have said about her behind her back to my DH. Maybe it's two faced but maintaining polite 'working' relationship works for me.

I think you DB is being very stupid and unkind for telling you what his Wife has been saying.

It's not unusually to, umm, discuss people in unflattering terms behind their backs with your DH.

I'd avoid her as much as possible and be supportive of you DB but tell him to stop telling you what she says about you.

Jeez. The angels of mumsnet are determined to interpret justified anger as nastiness. I'm sure you're all entirely lovely.

YANBU OP. I wouldn't have been able to hold my tongue this long. But I do think it's for you DB to stand up to her with your support.