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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why there are no sanctions being placed on Israel?

93 replies

NeonDoll · 03/08/2014 10:42

Sorry if I sound a bit thick, but I genuinely don't understand this? They are placing sanctions on Russia following the Mh17 attack, and that's a good thing, but Israel are repeatedly attacking and persecuting another group of people, killing children and no one is doing anything about it? I don't understand why? Some of the photos of the poor child victims of this conflict keep appearing on my Twitter and Facebook feeds and they are just too horrific for words, the hospitals have now run out of mortuary space and they are storing bodies in ice cream freezers in shops. It's so, so terrible.

Why are the world letting them get away with this? It's making me so bloody angry.

OP posts:
kernowmissvyghen · 03/08/2014 21:48

Oh, and I'm going to buy this cookbook for several people (and a copy for me).

I can't directly go and stop a well-equipped modern army trying to wipe out an entire population, but I can make sure that their food culture isn't wiped out or falsely made out to be "Israeli". Food is a really important part of identity- I will cook Gazan food for people and remember their awful suffering.

pudding25 · 03/08/2014 21:51

The blatant anti-semitism on this thread is digusting. How about getting your facts straight and not just listening to the media reports of what is happening in Israel?
Hamas are a terrorist organisation. Israel left Gaza with a ton of resources. They are still sending in resources throughout this entire crisis. They are treating the people of Gaza in their hospitals, including the child of the leader of Hamas.

Hamas' plan is to end the State of Israel and to kill all Israelis living there. They want to manipulate world opinion by ruthlessly engineering the maximum possible death toll among their own civilian population, especially their children.

Israel is constantly being attacked by Hamas with rockets fired daily (and terrorist attacks have been happening for years). Hamas has refused cease fire after cease fire. Five ceasefires have thus far been proposed, where Israel agreed to all of them, but Hamas steadfastly refused, including two humanitarian ceasefires broken by Hamas and today’s humanitarian ceasefire which Hamas exploited in order to kidnap an Israeli soldier, killing another two in the process.

Two of many Hamas and Islamic Jihad rockets which misfired, one which hit the Shifa hospital killing 16 and the other hitting a playground in the Shati refugee camp killing 10 children. An Italian journalist has confirmed that it was a misfired Hamas mortar shell which hit the UN school killing another 17 and injuring countless others. This was blamed on Israel.

For the record, the Iron Dome anti-missile system came about through a combination of Israeli creativity, Israeli expertise, Israeli technical excellence and a desperate need and determination to protect Israeli citizens, Jews, Muslims, Christians and all; from harm.

In addition to the Iron Dome, the main reason that there have been so few Israeli casualties from Hamas is that currently, under fire from Hamas, around 3,000,000 Israelis are living in underground bunkers or reinforced concrete safe rooms. Since 2001 there have been over 15,000 rockets fired into Israel from Gaza.

You mention US funding of Israel. I fear you neglected to mention the billions in US, UN and European funds donated to the Palestinians in Gaza, which were not used as intended, to build schools and hospitals and create jobs, but rather were added to the considerable funding from Iran, Qatar and others in order to purchase and manufacture rockets as well as other weapons; and to build a massive underground terror infrastructure.

The concrete, cement and steel allowed into Gaza by the Israelis under great pressure from the international community were not in fact used to build and improve the lives of ordinary Gazans, but were in actual fact used to build, underground bunkers for the storage and manufacture of rockets and weapons along with apparently hundreds of kilometres of terror tunnels for the purpose of infiltrating Israel in order to kill Israeli civilians and in times of conflict, hide and protect Hamas fighters and leaders.

Surely if Hamas wanted to shield its women and children from the fighting, just as Israel does; Hamas could indeed provide refuge for its civilians in the vast array of underground bunkers and tunnels. Such safety however appears to be available solely to Hamas leaders and fighters and importantly its weapons.

What about the three UN schools in which, by the UN’s own admission, rockets have been stored or the fact that throughout the conflict rockets have been stored and fired from a selection of homes, schools, mosques and other civilian locations, in fact wherever Hamas could guarantee a civilian presence and consequently civilian casualties, apparently illegal under international law.

It has been stated that there a shortage of medical supplies and medicines in Gaza. However, there have been ample funds donated to Gaza for those very things, but that the money was misappropriated by Hamas to fund rockets and weapons. As I previously mentioned before, Israel is constantly treating anyone from Gaza who needs treatment.

For those of you wanting to boycott Israeli products, have a read of the article below and start thinking of all the things you will need to avoid...

www.takeapen.org/Takeapen/Templates/showpage.asp?DBID=1&TMID=84&LNGID=1&FID=583&PID=877
This is the side of the conflict that is not being shown daily in the media.

pudding25 · 03/08/2014 22:04

And for those of you stating this is genocide and comparing it to the Holocaust-if Israel wanted to wipe out Gaza, they would have done so easily. Instead, read all of my above post plus what other country would drop leaflets in civilian areas to warn them of any potential attacks?

Genocide is precisely what Hamas wants. Their stated aim is to kill all the Jews. It is in their charter.

For those of you comparing Israel's attacks to the Holocaust, you might want to do some serious reading up about what Hitler and his cronies did during WW11.

nevereverpost · 03/08/2014 22:10

Kernow gi's a break!

afaik Jeremy Hardy is very pro Palestinian (and not at all anti Semitic) but he takes a rather more measured view of their cuisine than you do here (towards the end if you want to skip to it, where he talks about cultural fetishism)
in this brilliant vignette

Mumblepot26 · 03/08/2014 22:13

You are not powerless observers...Desmond tutu said a few days ago that the way we react to what is happening in Gaza defines our view of humanity.
Don't be complicit in this genocide

  1. Email your MP
  2. Demonstrate (see stop the war for info)
3 boycott Israeli products see BDS website for more info
  1. Use social media to raise awareness about the truth behind what is going on
Backinthering · 03/08/2014 22:18

pudding there has been one post which I agree was anti-Semitic. If you can point out any others, I'd be interested to see.
Given that the deputy speaker of the Knesset appears to want to see Gaza ethnically cleansed, it's a bit of a cheek pointing out Hamas' charter.
Report here

I've said this before but I'll judge on what's happened, not some fantasy of what might be. The reality is that 1800 Palestinians are dead, their homes and infrastructure in ruins. Yet I'm meant to get more upset about what Hamas might do in an alternative universe, than what Israel has done in this one?

YouTheCat · 03/08/2014 22:22

Yes, pudding, Hamas are a terrorist organisation. That doesn't mean that every man, woman and child in Palestine is a member or supporter of Hamas though. So why do they deserve to die?

Hating the Israeli government does not make me anti-semitic. It makes me human.

SqueakySqueak · 03/08/2014 22:26

Instead, read all of my above post plus what other country would drop leaflets in civilian areas to warn them of any potential attacks?

Awesome. "Hey guys, we know you have exactly zero places to go, but we're going to avoid responsibility of our actions because we dropped some papers saying we were going to kill you before we killed you".

What next? Domestic partners are good guys because they threaten their ex before breaking into her home and killing her?

If these were US troops, they'd be being brought up on war crimes right now and the US would be outraged at their conduct. We give them enough money and technology to refine their techniques to something more sophisticated than "burn down the whole forest" approach.

NotSuchASmugMarriedNow · 03/08/2014 22:26

Hamas are vile. They use human shields and fire from hospitals and childrens schools.

Not that I support Israel, mind you.

Shockingundercrackers · 03/08/2014 22:29

Pudding, do you really believe that? Truly? Yes Hamas fire off rockets into Israel, yes that's shit, but baring in mind that those rockets haven't yet actuslly killed a single Israeli, is it really proportionate to kill 1,750 people, most of whom are civilians, hundreds of whom are small children, to avenge this terror?

Cant you see that it would be like if the Brits shelled the bejesus out of Dublin at the height of the troubles because IRA leaders lived there. Of course terrorists are a scourge. But numbers simply do not add up.

Springheeled · 03/08/2014 22:30

ONE antisemitic comment, from one poster, called out immediately, deleted straight away. Is that what you're referring to pudding?

Anyhow, as other have said:
Write to MP, MEP, Philip Hamond (or phone or email)
Sign online petitions
Attend demo in London next Sat
Read up
Email/ ring customer services ( don't expect an unpathetic response from Tesco or Sainsbury though)
Tweet
Talk
Boycott (download buycott app)
Join the PSC

SilenceMeansTrouble · 03/08/2014 23:19

Israel left Gaza with a ton of resources. . Really? Was it the greenhouses that they destroyed due to nothing but hate? Well I think you need to find out a bit more, Israeli settlers were happy to damage and dismantle everything they could, nothing was left out of the goodness of their hearts. Then a Jewish businessman stepped in and raised funds to purchase the greenhouses for the Palestinians. They were not trashed immediately, the Palestinians grew cash crops for export, no rockets were being thrown into Israel and Gaza at the time seemed to have real hope for the future and a shot at freedom and peace. However, they soon learned they could not get their crops across the border, rather than being a wonderful gift they were a poison chalice costing thousands every day. Israel was never going to allow the Palestinians a real chance, it is absolute evil what they did and what they are doing. The violence started again when the Palestinians realised what was going on, they could not export their goods, develop their economy and Israel was still building in the West Bank. It was due to this that Hamas was elected and the violence started full force. IT WAS AND IS ISRAELS FAULT.

Yes, Israel could destroy every last Palestinian tomorrow, but they could not spin what they did and they would face universal condemnation and lose the backing of the US. Israel is committing genocide, it may be slow but the end result will be the same, this way they think they can get away with it.

The only choice the Palestinians have is to die on their feet or exist on their knees, it is no choice and no life. All Israel cares about is the land and it will do anything to get it. Israel is a terrorist nation and history will look back at Israel in horror and disgust for its actions and be revolted at the nations that stood back and let it happen.

TheLovelyBoots · 04/08/2014 07:27

Thank God Tony Blair has arrived to help with the situation. (eye roll)

TheLovelyBoots · 04/08/2014 07:36

And for those of you stating this is genocide and comparing it to the Holocaust-if Israel wanted to wipe out Gaza, they would have done so easily.

What is Gaza if not wiped out?

DogCalledRudis · 04/08/2014 08:11

Sanctions to Israel would hurt big corporations. Simple as that...

indigo18 · 04/08/2014 09:38

Can anyone reference a book/article that I could read to try and further my understanding of this conflict, please?

halfdrunkcoffee · 04/08/2014 10:18

indigo18 - I enjoyed Martin Gilbert's Israel: A History, though unless he's put out a new edition it only goes up to about 1997. Eugene Rogan's The Arabs also has a chapter on Palestine. I'm also enjoying Ari Shavit's My Promised Land: The Triumph and Tragedy of Israel at the moment, although I note that Norman Finkelstein has put out a rebuttal.
For the history you could start with Wikipedia although some people say it is not completely neutral.

I also like reading the +972 magazine online. Jewish Voice for Peace has a short video and some information on their website.

indigo18 · 04/08/2014 11:46

Thank you Half.

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