AIBU to think about NOT starting dd at school because of toilet issues and shyness

[Itsjustmeagain]

dd is 3 now but will be 4 in August and is due to start reception in September. She is our 4th child the older three have started school with no problems and are happy at the school (they are 9,7 and 5 - dd3 is in reception with the same teacher now).

dd4 has been a total nightmare with toilet training, she is generally ok at home but cant cope outside the house at all. She is currently at nursery and wets herself 5 + times a day - yet at home she will be dry for the whole day. This has been the same at two different nuseries (it was so bad and her anxiety so high at the firs nursery we moved her as we thought there must be something majorly wrong there).

We went for an hour induction at her new school, I stayed the current class was there and so her sister was there - she knew people she wsnt alone. She wouldn't leave my side, she has been wetting herself even at home the last week since that day.

I am totally at my wits end with it - I have taken her to the doctor who said that she has no infection or anything that would be making her unable to use the toilet and tbh she is find at home when she isnt stressed - I know she will have weeks of good behaviour and using the toilet no problem over the summer since I will be at home with her.

I am now a sahm, partly because she was struggling so much at nursery and it was just so stressful for everyone.

AIBU to think about not actually starting her at school this year, most people I speak to in real life say "she will have to grow out of it" or "she needs to get used to it" but I just dont feel I can send her into a classroom when she will literally spend all day crying and wetting herself. Especially when at home she is a happy, smiling and confident 3 year old.

AIBU because everyone I speak to seems to think I am!

The charity ERIC may be of use to you, I found their information very helpful - although my ds's issues are with bowel control, they also deal with bladder incontinence.

I understand the toileting issue, particularly if you feel that extra year will allow you to get it sorted. I would say though ime, in reception they take toileting issues very lightly among the children. In fact there was a pair of favoured pants that dd2's year used to try and get, to the point of pretending they'd wet themselves to try and get them.

However, I'm not sure on the shyness. I'd have thought for a shy child it would be much worse going into a classroom with friendships settled, and having to break into them.

I know of someone who started homeschooling "just for a term or two" for shyness reasons. She's still homeschooling at 14yo, and her dd won't even look off the ground if anyone else addresses her, adult or child and really struggles making any friends, I would say if anything she's worse now than she was at 5yo.

Yanbu
Is it possible for her to start in January?
If you keep up with some 'schoolwork' at home then there is no reason she should be behind. A year or half a year difference is huge! She will probably be perfectly ok to go next year.

As she has 3 older siblings plus all their 'goings on' I doubt she will be short of opportunities to socialise.

Can you not accept her place but not send her in full time?

If it wasn't for the fact that deferring her means she will miss the whole of reception and start in year 1 I would say keep her at home as legally she doesn't have to start school until the term after her 5th birthday. However, personally I think reception is a really important year for them and she may find it hard to settle leaping straight into year 1.

My DS is a late August baby so started school a week after his 4th birthday. Looking back at photos now it looks like I am sending a toddler to school and DH really did want to him to defer but he was really ready. I think though I would have had reservations in your shoes. DS was fine re going to the toilet when he started school but then it all went pear shaped and he started pooing his pants almost every day - until about year 2 - was very frustrating.

Maybe speak to the school and ask how flexible they are willing to be on her attendance? Maybe mornings only and see how it goes. If they are not going to allow that then maybe deferring her is best - can you do it just till say after Christmas or even if she starts reception after Easter so at least she gets a term in plus it gives you more time to try and get something sorted?

Your plan sounds fine, it's July now, her confidence will suffer with frequent wetting incidents, maybe review at Christmas? See if she is ok to start in January? If not next September.

I think I agree with Goblin.

My eldest was having frequent accidents at nursery - and I was really worried as she was a late Aug birthday and very shy.

However she did massively improve over the summer – and the school had a prolonged part-time introduction. She had frequent but not everyday accidents - she wasn't only one. Thing is she absolutely bloomed at school which was a pleasant surprise after nursery.

She had the occasional issue in yr 1 and even later and the school have just dealt with it and made it ok with her peers.

My youngest is in reception now and I know several other parents who DC have had wetting problems throughout the year. One very small young DC the school did suggest that they make pt - however parents were against this due to work and feeling it was goig backwards. He's settled though it took most of the year till this last term in fact but he looks set for going into yr 1 completely happy.

It will really depend on how the school handles the problem - some like my DC school are really matter of fact other I understand are no where near as good.

I belive you can defer till later in the year - but if she is the only one it might well make it harder for a shy DC to start - trying to break into existing friendship groups.

I think in your shoes I'd try - see how it goes and see how the school handle the problem all the while knowing I had HE option if things didn't look they they were working out.

I would definitely defer. I think we start school at a ridiculously low age in England.

I'm no fan at all of summer born children going into school and wish they could just have another year in nursery, but equally have seen how hard it's been for children who didn't do reception then had to start school in year one. Reception is the transition year from learning through play to formal learning, friendship groups start from there and as a social time it's an opportunity children don't get again. The expectations in year one are also a big jump from nursery, particularly for the younger ones, and reception classes work on easing them gradually towards those expectations so it isn't a shock when it comes.

I've never yet met a reception teacher who would leave any child of theirs wet or crying, any decent school would support your dd and want her to be comfortable and happy before they work on any other goals for her. It's very unlikely she will be the only child in the group who has toileting issues or emotional needs, the school will have strategies to help with this and will have supported many other children with similar needs. There is also no need to rush into full time until she's ready, she can be part time all year if need be and get the play and social experience without pressuring her past coping. I've also seen many children where everyone involved with the child was panicking and preparing for issues and the child just took to the new routine like a duck to water and never looked back.

I would really suggest giving the induction period a try and seeing how the school are willing to support dd and you. You lose nothing at all by trying it out, your other options are all still on the table if you're still not happy after she's had a few weeks of short sessions but by then you'll have more of the information you need to know which decision you want to go with.

wow thanks for all the replies!

The school is really great with my older ones and her teacher next year is the same teacher my 5 year old dd has now, she is lovely. I have no concerns about the school or teacher I know they will go out of their way to help. My ds has learning problems and the amount of support he has had from school has been totally amazing I couldnt ask for better.

The reception teacher has been asking my older dd what sort of things she likes and what sort of games she likes to play so I do feel like she will be in the best hands there and that any problems she does have wont be down to the school itself or the teacher if you see what I mean.

Goblin - this is what I have been worried about, she isnt actually the youngest child I also have a 2.5 year old (who is toilet trained better than the 3 year old! and loved her nursery when I was working!) but I see what you mean although I think her level of anxiety is so so clear I just dont see how she can be deliberately causing a fuss to this level.

I think what we will do is firstly see how the induction goes next week, she will be 3 hours on her own and so it will just give a small idea of how worried she is. With the others I tend to try and breeze in drop them off and leave when they are worried so I am hoping that that will work.

Once the new year starts I think we will do the first week part time as the school says and see where we are at after that, if she needs longer part time then we will try that.

If by November she is still having major issues then I think we will rethink the whole thing. DH and I were talking last night and we both decided we would rather keep her home than deal with the shaking and crying and wetting on a daily basis. Nursery has been awful but we had no choice as I was working, I am now a sahm again and so we do have a degree of choice we may as well use it if we need to.

You know your child best, go with your instinct.

I'm still not sure about this 'anxiety' y'know.
She was totally happy chatting to GP, and wandering around talking to the other adults in the clinic? But yet, when you visited the school and were there with her, and her sister was there, and lots of people she knew, she wouldn't leave your side?

It's all a bit odd, tbh.

I do understand your frustration though. I spent so long laundering ds1s wet stuff that I honestly thought I was going crazy. He is also an atypical 'anxious' child. And would traditionally have more accidents at home the week before school was due to start every year etc etc.

These kids are a conundrum. To be honest, I would probably just send her and deal with it. It's not really any different to sending her to nursery and dealing with it, which you are already doing. To not do it is almost a retrograde step. (And yes, we have considered homeschooling ds before. Pretty much until he was 10. We couldn't afford to, otherwise I'm pretty sure we would have. Now that we are more or less out the other side at 12, he's a keen school advocate.)

Every child is different but my ds went into Year 2 and had no problems with not having been in a school environment before or with formal learning. He also dealt with the social side of school so so much better than he had in those few weeks of Reception. However, he isn't shy, it was more a case of getting used to social norms and boundaries.

OP, it sounds like the school you ahve are really good and will support her, I think that has also made the difference to my ds - it's half his maturity, and half support from the school. His teacher now tells him to go to the toilet at regular intervals and a TA goes with him to make sure he sits there and does go. There is no way he'd be left dirty and sore and smelly as he was in the school he briefly started 2 years previously. I think having a supportive school and a nuirturing environment is half the battle.

My eldest dd didnt start school till she was 5.4 dd2 was 4.6 when she started because of dd2s bithday I could and should have deferred her till the next AUGUST sending essentially toddlers to school is ridiculous imo

OP, you might want to ask to have your last post deleted as you gave your DD's name.

If all the wetting was happening at nursery, that might have been the problem. Some nurseries are just not up to scratch. Was it a private nursery?

oops you are right I didnt mean to type her name it just slipped out! I will ask for it to be removed

OP, have a look at the ERIC website.

Perhaps something like this would be a solution to the problem?

If she doesn't do reception she will start in year one which I think will be more of a shock plus friendship groups will be made.

I get confused with English system, easier to hold back here.

i just think it can totally affect their schooling if they start a year too soon for them - they will always be the one slowest/behind.

i speak as a feb birthday in scotland - (end of Feb is the cut off date here as Aug is down south)