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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Does anyone ever think they themselves are the "toxic" one?

58 replies

ClockWatchingLady · 13/06/2014 12:11

Just wondering. This is not about any particular thread, by the way, just a general question.

I always think it's quite possible that two family members, who each considered the other "toxic", could independently post on MN from their own perspectives, and have the world agree that the other person is the source of the problem.

OP posts:

missorinoco · 13/06/2014 13:57

I suspect to get to the point where you think you are the toxic one, you will have reflected on your own behaviour, and acknowledging you are not always right. The act of doing that is likely to modify your behaviousr, if it has been unreasonable and shows a degree of empathy that is less likely to make you toxic.

That doesn't mean your (one's) behaviour has always been exemplary, but there is a big difference between reacting suboptimally to a situation, or frankly just cocking it up, and being toxic.

LetsFaceTheMusicAndDance · 13/06/2014 14:00

Yes I do wonder. Fairly frequently.

LivinLaVidaLocal · 13/06/2014 14:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ithoughtofitfirst · 13/06/2014 14:11

I think my mother in law has some kind of passive aggressive/NPD. I know, I know. Shock horror.

I am a people pleaser and a self blamer and have bent over backwards to try and please her and no, surprise surprise, it was never good enough for her.

I have had a relapse with my depression and am just suffering from debilitating low self esteem right now so have decided to stop seeing her but I can't help wondering...

... am I actually the one in the wrong??

YouAreMyFavouriteWasteOfTime · 13/06/2014 14:17

no... you are just both different people and we all have our own issues.

CallMeExhausted · 13/06/2014 14:21

To risk using a hideous cliche, it takes two to tango.

My relationship with my mother is horrendously toxic. She has issues, my issues lie in refusing to deal with her issues any more.

My relationship with others is not toxic, but I am inclined to think if I met another person like my mother, the same result would likely occur.

Bleach is toxic, ammonia is toxic... put them together, and the resulting chlorine gas is deadly.

wafflyversatile · 13/06/2014 14:30

I think in case of someone being NPD for instance they are simply not going to post on here. They have no need to ask for advice as they are in the right and it's all fine for them; they are getting their own way. They don't have a problem. Also they are not interested in possible dissenting opinions, but surround themselves with yes wo/men who won't challenge them.

In other cases of course it could be less clear cut. Most of us have had friends who have disagreed and it's a bit of both when we hear each side.

LadySybilLikesCake · 13/06/2014 14:50

I don't know. Ex and his family are vile. The ex went off with someone else when I was in premature labour. I found out from a friend who'd seen them together in a nightclub. I tried to do the right thing for ds and supported contact but it wasn't easy, I also had to move house to stop him from using my home as a doss house when he needed somewhere to sleep after a 6 hour piss up every few days. After a few years he left the UK (because he was bored) and didn't see ds for the first 3 years. Contact afterwards was practically non existent. His mother used to help a bit but took it upon herself to go into my son's school and tell the head that ds's father had just got married and I was jealous, and could she have a copy of ds's school report. She then lied about it. I've seen her slap her granddaugher across the legs for dragging a brolly but she lied about it to me (even though I saw her). She's nagged to loan a book which ds was busy reading and left in a strop when I said not yet as ds was using it

The last time ds saw his father he was 11 (4 years ago), it was another spur of the moment 'you must drop everything' demand which resulted in ds leaving his friend in a shop so he could see his father. Ds was worried about getting back to his friend but his father shouted and swore in his face (short temper. He always yelled and swore when things didn't go his way). I tried to explain to granny why ds was upset but all she could say was 'he should have let you know he was coming' What sort of person ignores this? I had to take him to court for maintenance, I also have MS and not once have any of them asked how ds is or if there's anything they can do. Ds chooses not to see his father now. Ds isn't allowed to see his grandfather as they won't tell us where he is. If we want to contact him we have to send them a card to pass to him, and they have made it clear we'll never get a reply (he had a stroke).

They all refuse to speak to me now, nor do they return emails or text messages. It makes me wonder whether there's something wrong with me to make a whole family behave this way towards me and a child.

Original poster

ClockWatchingLady · 13/06/2014 15:04

Really interesting reading everyone's posts.

I think we (i.e., people) all have a tendency to believe our own stories about things. And the stories/accounts we construct are generally the ones which most stroke our egos - in that way I think narcissism is part of the human condition.

What worries me a bit is that when we post on MN about some issue, we (myself definitely included) get other people hearing only our particular accounts of things, and we can include everyone else in our own "truths". This then reinforces our idea that our own account/story is more than just an account/story - that it's actually true (and more true than other people's perspectives).

Personally, I think sometimes it's a relief when I can let go of a story which has me as the victim/heroine/nicest one, and realise that sometimes I'm a total arse, and that's OK too . But only sometimes...

OP posts:

LadySybilLikesCake · 13/06/2014 15:06

I tend to say when I've been an arse No harm in admitting you've been a numpty. I do about people who just keep going though. I've seen threads where almost everyone has said 'you're wrong' but they still didn't admit it. It's odd.

Original poster

ClockWatchingLady · 13/06/2014 15:09

The ex went off with someone else when I was in premature labour

OK, it's pretty difficult to come up with alternatives to him being a total twat, LadySybil.

OP posts:

Original poster

ClockWatchingLady · 13/06/2014 15:12

Thinking again, perhaps I missed the point in my post - probably even more difficult than realising you've been "the bad one" is not placing yourself at the centre of the story at all - just being an "also ran".....

OP posts:

LadySybilLikesCake · 13/06/2014 15:13

Thank you

They do make you wonder though. They seem to think his behaviour (not paying maintenance, shouting and swearing in ds's face, never contacting him) is normal, so I do doubt myself sometimes

Eatriskier · 13/06/2014 15:24

ladysybil I have a friend in a similar situation except her kid is only a toddler. She is always asking what's wrong with her that they have cut her son out. I keep pointing out that it's not her, that their behaviour isn't normal but it must be hard when you're in the middle of it.

Minnieisthedevilmouse · 13/06/2014 15:25

I find it weird how on mn every other person has NPD. Did you all get a memo on new fashionable phrases to spout? Read the same book? Just like the phrase? It sounds so fake. And absolves any idiocy the other person may have contributed to a situation.

For another example suddenly everyone's 'on the spectrum". Not diagnosed. Not often even seen a doctor. Just randomly labelled for some reason, hate to say it but I often wonder if just a piece of behaviour was disliked but this sounds more impressive.

LadySybilLikesCake · 13/06/2014 15:29

Thank you, Eatriskier I hope your friend's OK.

There's a lot of folk with some sort of issue, Minnie. No one should be labelling but it helps to not feel alone, IYSWIM.

CoffeeTea103 · 13/06/2014 15:31

Yanbu, I always want to hear the other side of it.

OutsSelf · 13/06/2014 15:37

Well, in response to your OP, yes, I do, I've learned some shit ways to communicate (I've got a line in, "that's happened to me!" in response to others' in need of sympathy, trying to stop it) and I always feel like I'm trying to do better.

But in response to your thing about reading threads on MN, two things:

My therapist was always on my side, not because he was an idiot blind to my faults but because he recognised that working through things in a friendly way would be more.productive, and if I was acting reasonably and ethically and with healthy expectations, everything else would sort itself out. So that was his goal, rather than trying to help me realise I was wrong and others were right.
On MN, I've seen people.being (often gently) questioned in their assumption that the other person is a dick.

So I recognise your concern but think it's unlikely that it's an actual problem

lynniep · 13/06/2014 15:39

I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say I'm 'toxic' but I am aware that in spite of DHs incredibly annoying and frustrating behaviour, he's not the only one at fault in our relationship. I'm irritable, moody, wouldn't win any awards for tidyness, and probably a huge list of other things I don't want to think about right now. It would be interesting to read what DH would write about me. But he never will. Probably best :)

Amber76 · 13/06/2014 17:31

I don't think I'm toxic but I do find my some of my dhs family really annoying and so can be snippy and abrupt with them sometimes. My mil drives me insane - she might ask the same question 20 different times...she see's this as being concerned and I see it as aaaggggghhhhh so when I "go quiet" I'm seen as the weird one.

And his family often bitch about each other but then are really nice to each others faces - I'm rubbish at putting on a façade so when I have a problem with someone its obvious and I'm seen as a bit of a bitch sometimes I think. I don't care enough to start being really false.

My brothers wife doesn't like any of my family - she thinks we don't care about her son. He's the first born on her side so they made a massive fuss whereas on our side he's the 12th grandchild. He's lovely and I like when I see him but I don't make a big fuss. And she knows nothing about my children. She's seems to see it as all about her.

Its all about perspective. And I second what someone else said about having young children and being really tired and just wanting to moan a lot! I have to reign myself in on that.

ithoughtofitfirst · 13/06/2014 20:48

amber you're just being honest and not playing the victim. Which I like.

It did make think though I think my MIL finds me really irritating because, admittedly, I can be a bit of a wet blanket. But I think she oversteps the mark when she bites my head off. Ooooh check me out speaking my mind!

rinabean · 14/06/2014 13:36

Minnieisthedevilmouse that's because no-one posts to say "my MIL is completely normal. We have a normal relationship. It has its ups and downs but it's mostly good". And few people post "my MIL is my best friend, she's a second mother to me, I love her so much" because it's not a problem they want help with and also it looks like bragging unless it's mother's day or something.

Which is obvious. And I'm not going to pull things out my arse like "every other person here is thick enough to not realise that people mostly post about their problems", but there are a lot of them about.

Xcountry · 14/06/2014 13:46

I can be, depends on what going on. But I have never claimed to be a saint and my relationship is flawed, from both sides but I wouldn't change it, I can be a poisonous venomous cow and he can be a complete bastard but its not like that all the time.

luridshorts · 14/06/2014 14:09

I think I'm the "toxic" one in my family but I don't think I'm a narc. I'm acutely aware that my thinking and the way I see/interpret/experience things is not normal, not like other people's, and is basically unreasonable, fucked and harmful. I've learnt that I can't act on my feelings because none of my relationships would last more than a month or so

Imbroglio · 14/06/2014 17:08

I think sometimes my behaviour is 'toxic', yes. Its because I've had certain experiences and grown up with certain family dynamics that mean that I have 'adapted' and respond to some situations in a way which feels right to me and actually is a bad response.

I think this is true for most people.

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