To think that it is very unfair, to pick someone up on spelling or grammar, just because you disagree with what they are saying.

[smokepole]

I posted recently on a ongoing topic in this section, I was picked up for my "appalling" grammar, my use of punctuation and for my sentence construction. I noticed that when my opinion changed , strangely enough my grammar or incorrect use of exclamation marks was not picked up upon. I have noticed that this happened on other threads as well. I think this is wrong for two reasons, the first being that it is a kind of bullying, intimating that because someone struggles with spelling, punctuation or correct sentence construction, that there are thick, therefore their argument or view point does not stand up. The other point it is very unfair to pick people up who have not benefited from higher education, or in my case not even education post GCSE'S, people need to realise this and accept that they have been fortunate to have been able to access higher education, but they need to give people like me some slack over my poor grammar or sentence construction.

There speaks a mathematician, kim.

Ah, that I do agree with

I'll add one more complication. MN is a UK site so in many ways the default is British English. I do see a lot of US usage, and those posters of course are happy with that. But then we see usage best described as "international English". If we accept US usage, to be friendly and all that, what's wrong with international English? Nothing, it seems to me.

Sometimes I want to reply in German or something, just to make the point that language is relative, folks. Move to another language and a lot of the time, the issue we are all solemnly debating doesn't exist.

What's international English?

There is a German-speaking thread, or there was.

It's the English spoken by folk who learned it say in India, or Greece, or China, often at an international school. It doesn't necessarily try to be British English, and it's the little phrases that stick out. You get it a lot with international students. They put us to shame, of course, given our average ability with other languages.

German language thread isn't the point, really, it's more when you get people very hung up on one bit of English usage who see to have forgotten that other languages exist and are just as valid. Like people who forget that the bible is a translation and solemnly debate the meaning of each word.

But I do love a good franglais thread. C'est le meilleur antidote possible au pedantry and it sends my autocorrect into orbit.

You are not being unreasonable OP. The egotistical posters that do this have no business doing it. They all have this in common; nothing of interest to say and egos the size of a planet. Best ignored - or teased if you can be bothered.

It is rude , childish,unintelligent and done by people who can't muster a sound argument.

Beast you can have seperate auto corrects in different languages :)

YY, I agree beast. I love the quirks of different people's language.

I know German language isn't the point, was just mentioning it in case you wanted it.

How did I not see this thread sooner!

I love this thread and I totally agree with the OP.

People criticising another poster for their spelling and grammar rather than their posts are small minded wankers.

But not in franglais, sadly.

If ikea is your local, you must speak swedish. I was there the other weekend and had a lovely time trying to understand the language. It was fun.

Thanks, LRD, appreciated! I also love languages, there's something so unnecessary and generous and ridiculous about the variety on offer.

I do speak Swedish, it is a fabulously simple language in terms of spelling, I only started to learn Swedish 3 years ago but I'm probably better at spelling in Swedish than I am in English

Were you hear when we had the unseasonably scorching weathers? I'm glad you have fun, Sweden is in many ways a fabulous country and a Swede who speaks perfect English is never far away!

LRD Next time you start to judge someone else for making the same error multiple times, you might remember that we all do it

I think then it must be an auto correct. However you miss my point. Which is that correcting very basic spelling and grammar mistakes is not wrong. I simply cannot bear to see commonly used words spelled wrongly, or no paragraphs, or (I admit a very personal bugbear) misused capitalisation. Theres no excuse for constantly misspelling commonly used words.

I don't actually tend to criticise others' spelling, but I do think inwardly that the writer must be a bit off somehow, and it can and does detract from their argument.

I think the whole attitude results from bad teaching in this country of SPAG rules, which is a bit pathetic really as native English speakers have an innate advantage.

I have never knowingly quibbled. Its not a word I use, in any sense.

As always, SN, disabilities and dyslexia etc excluded. Those who have no excuse are not.

It was 20 and sunny. Don't tell me that wasn't typical, I am smitten and keep planning to move there.

I managed quite well with my German, not trying to talk to people as they all speak English, but eavesdropping on the train....

I expect it is an autocorrect.

I don't miss your point - I just disagree with it. There's no reason to correct people, unless you know they welcome it. And as you demonstrate, people can fly off the handle and become very upset by corrections, perhaps even when they think they'd welcome them.

It is much better just to wince and move past it (if wince you must). Honestly.

I really don't understand this attitude that people who've lower intelligence or poorer education somehow have 'no excuse'. What do people get out of criticizing someone who's probably already feeling insecure?

If you correct my spelling I will assume you are a twat.

There is no excuse for such appalling bad manners.

Did we all notice the error in chelsy's last post? Just shows that it is easily done.

I didn't, though I did notice from another thread that it's actually perfectly possible to use bold and still use full stops. I admit, I wouldn't have known anyway.

May is a really unpredictable month, we had 30+ for almost a week, but it snowed less than a month ago the summer tends to be a lot more predictable than the UK summer and the winter is also predictable ( cold, dark with a high chance of snow) the winter seems to be more manageable than UK winters because there are very often lovely crisp bright sunny days, so despite the lack of daylight hours and the cold it doesn't feel as damp and miserable.

I'm impressed that you could understand Swedish bassed on knowing German, we went to Germany last year and both dp ( who is a native Swedish speaker) and myself really struggled, I actually found Dutch easier to guess at.

Yep, its an auto correct.

The bold and full stops have consistently not worked for me.

So whats the verdict on "gotten"?

Affectation or "American English". Its surely closer to middle English, with the prefix wrongly removed. Which is why its always better to say "have".

kim147 Does it add to the debate if, instead of debating with people, you only point out errors?

A quid pro quo if you struggle to read a post or understand the meaning due to SPAG errors, how does that aid debate?

How many times does a poster comment that they can't read the OP, because it doesn't contain any of that simple device known as paragraphs?

It seems to be pefectly standard in US English, I think? I've read proper books that have it in.

The only time it really annoys me (this is dead highbrow) is when I read fanfic supposedly set in England and US teenagers pepper it with 'gotten'. ARGH!

She wrote theres no excuse instead of there's no excuse.

As I say, not something to mention unless the poster is correcting others. But I can be a savage pedant in the right circumstances

Swedish - I loved that toys are lekr. Lecker is German for "yummy". And one teen was saying how something was "ekel" meaning horrible, as in ekelhaft in German. And born for kids, as in bairn. Obviously I have no clue how anything is spelled in Swedish