AIBU to think that actually, yes parents can be partly held responsible for this?

[realitygone]

There has been a very sad murder in the city I live in, the person murdered was very young and was brutally beaten and murdered by people who are much younger (teens) I grew up in the area and it has actually made me feel quite sick about what the world is coming to

I posted a link to the story and a tribute to the person on my Facebook page, with a comment that something needs to be done about this yob culture we seem to be living in. My friend replied that she knew the person and the families of the murderers and that the families were awful in the area, I replied saying that the parents need to have some responsibility for their children who have murdered someone as something has gone seriously wrong with their upbringing.

Well, someone I know from school commented saying parents can't be responsible as some kids just go off the rails and they have no control over them.

It started to decend into a bit of a back and forth where she believed she was 100% right in what she was saying, and also commented that the murderers families probably feel just as devastated as the victims family, I deleted the whole post when she put this as its a bit of an insult to compare the two.

so aibu to think she is wrong, parents do have responsibility for their children and their upbringing?

Some parents have responsibility, some don't. I know a boy adopted aged 3 who was already irreparably damaged. His parents from 3-18 really tried their best but damage had been done.

I do think sometimes it is nature.

That said if my 1yo grows up to commit atrocious acts I know I will still blame myself.

But not feel worse than the victim - that's ridiculous!

Of course it is the parents responsibility to do something about it, some dc do have problems or go off the rails but you get it sorted, either by parenting or getting help from outside agencies if you are incapable of doing it yourself.
You can't just wash your hands off your responsibilities and say you have no control, its up to parents to have and be the person in control.
Oh, don't get me started OP .......

Yanbu to think that in SOME cases lazy parenting produces feral children.
YABU to be having a slanging match via FB

I know wonderful parents that have one wonderful child and one who isn't. You can only do so much and that's hard to admit.

I didn't have a slanging match, I deleted it before it went there as it was disrespectful where it was going.

morethan that's pretty much what I said

I know somebody who was sent to prison as a teenager in similar circumstances.

When you look at his upbringing it's a wonder how it didn't happen earlier.

I'm not sure that it's that black and white in all cases though. What about parents who just aren't physically or mentally equipped to deal with it? What if serious mental health issues are a factor? What if you bring your child up in a respectable happy middle class home and they become a hopeless drug addict? There's not a whole heap you can do about that.

I think any parent would feel complete shame and guilt if their child committed such an awful crime. What do you think should happen to them that would be worse than that?

Sometimes the help from outside agencies isnt always forthcoming or slow to set in motion and then sometimes by then its too late, damage is done.

There are plenty of people brought up in terrible families who never murder or are violent to anyone

I know a family that had three children. Two of them turned out fabulous adults, one a drug addict who would sell his own Granny for a fix. That cannot be the parents fault as they all had the same upbringing.

A family where all the children go the same bad way, maybe not so clear cut.

You can't generalise though. Some people go off the rails even with the best most supportive parents.

Sometimes parents can play a part, others nothing they do will change things

Er go read the teens threads? You'll see there that when dc 'go off the rails' and become strangers to us....despite what we do.... It's got very very little to do with us as parents!

Something doesn't have to have 'gone very wrong' with their upbringing

Who are these magical agencies who can sort this?? Where are they?

And 'something needs to be done'.... Like?

Oh I see the sensible posters turned up!

One of the things that is striking if you read in depth books about serial killers, is that most of them, had pretty ordinary childhoods. Often these books end up talking about the impact of quite ordinary events most children experience, such as the death of a grandparent. It is rare, although it occasionally happens, that a serial killer has a nightmare family background.

You set up a page about someone you don't know. You also do not know the alleged perpetrators or their families so you cannot comment about what happened or who should take responsibility.

YABU.

Yabu. You have no right to make that comment if you do not know the family of the perpetrators. I hope that your kids never commit an atrocity, I think it's hard for both families in different ways.

Unfortunately, kids will turn out how they turn out. Parents don't have as much control over their children as everyone thinks.

Some kids turn out to be amazing and generous people despite an abusive background.

Some kids turn out to be criminals despite a nice upbringing.

If you read up on the Sandy Hook shootings, Adam's father has some interesting stuff to say on how he's handled it. He was pretty devastated to find out his child could do something like that.

commented that the murderers families probably feel just as devastated as the victims family,

'Just as' is wrong here. However, I'm just trying to imagine finding out my child had taken the life of another human being. I'd be devastated. Not 'just as' (how is it possible to compare?), but I'd be devastated. Wouldn't you be devastated?

I'm not prepared to say 'but that, of course, would never happen, because I am a good parent.' I can hope, I can work my arse off to try to steer them right. I cannot guarantee that things won't go wrong, because life isn't tidy enough to reward the 'good' with 'easiness'.

I'm sorry if you think that's disrespectful. It's not meant that way.

neverthebride where did I say I set up a page? I didn't I posted the link to the news story.

midnight my friend knows the family of the person who was killed, she told me what happened exactly to the person and how they went about it. Details of which I have not reiterated to anyone else

If parenting made no difference at all, we wouldn't be trying so hard. But some people will turn out bad despite their upbringing, and some people will turn out good despite their upbringing.

And people aren't the same throughout their lives.

I knew a mothers who's son killed someone, accidently through dangerous driving rather than a murder not that it makes it better. She was so torn up with guilt that she ended her own life a few years later, her family was harassed, her only son in prison, people blamed her and she couldn't handle it. I would say the families suffer an awful lot in some situations.

I've worked with the families of victims and the families of perpetrators of serious crime. I have also been a victim myself.

I hate this attitude of those guilty and their families being 'other' oh, that would never happen to US, or MINE etc- usually they're not 'other'. Usually they're not very different to any of us and even if they are it doesn't mean they're evil, useless, crap parents etc and actually, what if they are? How did it happen?.Just random was it?.

And the families of people who have done terrible things DO suffer and usually, the perpetrator themselves do too. It's ridiculous to suggest otherwise.

But hey ho, carry on talking about those yobs or chavs or whatever and their shitty families and then we don't have to think about the causes too much because its THEM - those shitty people over there that just randomly appear - and nothing about our society contributes to it.

Or be sensible and compassionate.

i think every situation is different, every person is different and people react to upbringings differently. also people who have been unable to bring up their children properly are also very likely to have had a bad upbringing themselves so the blame goes even further back.

it isn't as easy and placing blame on the parents. i know as many people who have gone off the rails that had great upbringings as those who went off the rails after poor upbringings.

either way i think the whole conversation is moot. someone is dead and the person who killed them is to blame. arguing about it doesn't change what happened.

Reality - Sorry, I thought you'd made a page as you 'posted a link to the story, a tribute to the person and a comment about yob culture. ..'. Tribute sounded like it was a page.

My apologies.