Dear dog lovers/owners...

[INeedABiggerBoat]

A few tips for 'dog lovers':

• Don't leave your young children to pet a dog while you p* off to the loo or go to buy a pint, without checking with the dog's owners first. Dogs may not find your children as adorable as you do. Some dogs also bite children/when scared and I'm betting you won't be blaming yourself if that happens.
• It is not okay to feed a dog without its owners' permission - especially when you give the dog a small bone that could choke it/splinter in its throat. Unless you're happy for us to pass on the vet bill to you.

And one for dog owners:

• Whistling for your unleashed dog to follow you while you merrily cycle off home does not constitute 'having control' of your dog.

Any other tips to add, MN-ers?

My dog knocked a small child over on the canal towpath the other evening

Oh for gods sake everlong - just try and get it into your head that people do not love your dog and don't necessarily want it approaching them uninvited. Which is their right.

If you really feel it's your moral obligation to train toddlers to grow up not being wary of dogs then you need to make sure that the parents are on board by checking first to make sure they are OK with your dog going up to them and their children.

There is a huge difference in meeting a strange dog on a leash and asking whether we can pat it... and having a strange off-leash dog APPROACH a child who is probably smaller than it.

It's amazing to me that you can't see it from the perspective of the parent: I DON'T KNOW your dog. Really, just sit with that for a second, and think.

I personally have a scar on my face from being bitten by a dog which approached me in a field adjacent to a park. It wasn't barking, it wasn't growling, it didn't have a sign on it that said, I'm one of the bad dogs. Its owner was right there, unconcerned. It looked JUST LIKE YOUR DOG.

I would be a crap parent if I weren't concerned that a dog I DON'T KNOW approached my toddler. If I just let her toddle over to it that would be criminally negligent.

So it's a park that is inundated with dogs off the lead?

Bloody marvellous.

Oh he was ever. Chatting to other dog owner and both dogs decided to have a whizzy round sniff. Toddler got caught in the middle of the leads. He was fine.

I was just being controversial. Tut.

Everlong, you don't see all the people who've given up on that park because you and other dog-owners have thoughtlessly taken it over.

I'm listening to Beethoven right now. Think take the speakers outside and blast the 9th symphony over the neighbourhood. Because I just don't see how anyone could dislike it.

As an aside, has anyone noticed that more and more children seem to be absolutely terrified of dogs? I have owned dogs all my life and yet it seems to be only in recent years that I've noticed many children having the screaming terrors at the sight of one.

I find it really sad that children should be so afraid - where do they learn this response from? Only last week we had some visiting children and just stood and shrieked at the sight of my two placid elderly terriers who were showing no particular interest in them at all, other than a somewhat bemused tail wagging.

And I will not keep my well trained dogs on a lead at all times in public places for fear of offending hysterical parents who seem convinced that dogs are dangerous and dirty killing machines intent on harming their children.

Everlong, we are down at our caravan this weekend and last night, early eve went to a pub for tea/drinks.

It's small inside with a cafe area and conservatory too. Has a paved seated patio area, then grassed seated area, then play park, more grass and sand dunes.

I'd say there were about 200 people (maybe 40 kids) and no exaggerating about 40 dogs.

It was ace. No fights, barks, poos or bites. Lots of kids approached the mutt, but all asked first and DD was in her
Element first playing with 4 JRTs, then 2 Chihuahuas, then a ridiculously slobbery bulldog.

We will be going there much more now.

Dear Dog Owner,
Please keep your dog on a lead instead of shouting "It's okay they won't touch them" in a horrified voice when my kids freak out as a huge labrador comes running toward them.
Please pick up your dog shit as I ended up with it all over my clothes on Friday as my toddler had stood on it then I picked her up. DISGUSTING.
Please try and accept that although your dogs are lovely, not all people see them as the humans in a furry suit as you do.
I do really love dogs but fed up with the dog shit.

And I will not keep my well trained dogs on a lead at all times in public places for fear of offending hysterical parents who seem convinced that dogs are dangerous and dirty killing machines intent on harming their children.

Well, congratulations, because you and people like you have won. I'm sure your park is like the one in my town.

No-one is ranting everlong, don't be silly.

What will a dog do if it approaches my child? Well, how about you read the many threads on here which explain what can and does happen, from the mild irritation caused right through to the bites.

You dog actually doesn't have a right to run off the lead at all - there is nothing in law which says it does. You, on the other hand, have the responsibility to ensure that it's both kept under control at all times and isn't causing someone to be worried that it might injure them. I'm sure you do - you've already explained that your dog doesn't bother anyone, but there are plenty of dog owners who don't.

tompuss that might be because many small dc were run over by dogs. my dc have been. they are (rightly) afraid of dogs bounding up to then off lead. we have also been attacked (as in snarling teeth exposed attacked) by a large dog where it was 1cm between the dog's teeth and my dc's face before the doghandler caught up and tore dog back. I still get flashbacks from that one.

Please don't use the usual mantra: He's soft as grease, wouldn't hurt a fly / Don't worry he's only playing / Ooooo he's never done that before!!!

Or if you do, don't mind me counting them off on my fingers ...

mousmous Oh yes I can understand that, absolutely terrifying and the bounding up thing is completely unacceptable.

I was thinking more of the fear at the very sight of a dog and it's not just the result of a bad experience. It seems to be an irrational fear that is so much more prevalent in recent years.

I'm sure they are not a threat everlong (although you can't be 100% sure of that, no animal owner can) - whether or not they are a PITA when they go up to people to be fussed over we'll never know, as most people are too polite to tell you to take them away. The issue here is not dangerously out of control dogs - the issue is the very excitable dogs who run mad (probably because they aren't taken out as often as they should be), bound up to people, annoying them and taking over a public space.

You might not know that they are safe but I do

That's fair enough where the dog really is well trained of course, but the trouble is that idiot dog owners say the same thing and most of us have no way of knowing whether it's safe or not

At the end of the day they're dogs, usually friendly enough but unpredictable - and to most rational people the interests of humans comes first

There are disabled children and adults who do not understand how to behave around dogs (like trying to grab at them) or may behave unpredictably (like sudden flapping or shrieking). Dog owners should bear this in mind if they their dog to approach or come within touching of anyone.

You might not know that they are safe but I do...

You seem like nice person everlong and I'm sure we'd get along if we met in person.

...but I'm having trouble understanding ... how you're not understanding. You acknowledge that people don't know your dog is safe, and therefore they're justified in feeling nervous if not outright scared when your dog approaches them or their small children. You just... don't care?

SirC, the rules about dogs and where they are allowed to be and what they are allowed to do have been tightening steadily over the years, largely because allowing owners to self-police hasn't worked.
Because dog owners had no problem with dog poo, picking it up became the law.
Because of random biting, the acceptable number of incidents before an animal being seized and destroyed was reduced.
Because of off-leash incidents, the rules about having your dog on a lead in all sorts of places were widened.
Dogs attacking someone on private land, or in the home. That used to be unprosecutable and now it isn't.
Give it another 20 years, and the restrictions on dog ownership will be even stricter. I can wait.
I'd like compulsory training courses, insurance against attacks and damage, licensing so that if you've cocked up owning a dog, you don't ever get the chance again, lots of ways to make owning a dog more than a matter of having the money.