To bloody hate how children's play is so structured these days!

[MrsBramStoker]

Was chatting to my DD (age 6) yesterday and as it's spring/coming into the summer, a bee flew into house and I told her a story of how I remember getting stung by a bee for the first time. She never got stung by a bee.

This got me thinking and almost became a metaphor for how protected children are today. I know it's a good thing of course but play seem much more structured and less physical and altogether less adventurous.

I grew up on a farm, and had a brilliant childhood. Lots of muck, hard work though; carrying buckets of milk and walking in then fields in the rain, picking mushrooms, cut knees from helping out with the hay in the summer.

We live in the city now, my daughter has recently moved schools and has made a few friends, been on a few play dates (which I have to say I detest, all very planned and structured, while I drink coffee with said mother, although nice too, but just no spontaneity and feels very fake) we also recently moved house so don't really know anyone on our road (are renting).

To make it even more unsettling, it that my parents and lots of my sisters and friends live down the country near where I grew up, and I would love to move down to be near, or at least a short drive away. My 3 kids love going down weekend, mucking about with cousins, etc.
Dh keeps saying 'there are no jobs' there but what he really means are 'there are no jobs with a big salary'. We live in a nice, middle class area, but all these means sh** to me if I'm honest. What's the point in being near nice restaurants, etc.
I could buy a much cheaper house near home in the country, but of course my husband might die as it's not near a trendy, posh area near gigs and restaurants we never actually go to.

I feel like my heart not in the way We're living our lives, or not giving the children the best possible childhood. We go to the playground, cinema, shopping centre. All very safe and nice, but all very planned. We buy stuff, pay to watch a movie. The park closes and we got home to watch tv, play a computer game, read a book, and maybe play in our tiny back garden surrounded by noise of traffic and the dog barking next door.

The children are happy but IMO, me and dh don't have the same values and I'm getting more resentful as time goes on. I probably sound like a moan and of course I've tried to be happy and make the best of it, as been in the city for about 10 years. Maybe am not expressing myself well.

Better go as I've to text a mother about a playmate next week. For 2pm on Wednesday:)

honestly? I think you are a) idealising 'the countryside' and b) making things difficult in the city

You don't need to program their lives to the n'th degree - let kids do their own thing

mine play out every night - with mates, the older one goes to town on her own and does her own thing

You had a lovely childhood but it doesn't follow that they would - especially as teens - what is their for teens to do in the middle of nowhere?

relax a bit and enjoy the holidays with your family

oh and more importantly - work on your relationship with your husband - I think that is the key issue x

If you can get to the countryside for the weekends then you have the best of both worlds, like having a second home. You can choose how you spend your time, if planned and structured or commercialised activities aren't your thing, just chill at home.

Well, I grew up in relative countryside - although it's become commuter belt now - with the freedom to head off with a picnic and the dog all day and I look back on it with nostalgia. But at the time, I just took it for granted as a child. And as a teenager, I actively hated it.

I now live in London, and take my dc to visit friends in the countryside/who run farms, etc. And they love it because it's a treat. Their young friends who actually live those lives are always entertained by baffled by their joy in strawbales/sheep/mud/camping in orchards/all day out in the fields/woods, etc, and are happy as larry to sit in front of the tv.

So I'm staying as I am.

Did you grow up in an Enid Blyton book?

I used to feel the same way op.

I grew up in the countryside in the middle of nowhere. Our house was surrounded by fields and woods.

I have lots of happy memories of going off early in the morning and spending all day out either on my own or with friends building dens and exploring the woods.

I've lived in a city with my children for years now and I thought they were missing out on that life.

They are, but theirs is different and also good. Both my children like drama and my youngest loves dancing. There's lots of opportunities in the city I live and both have performed on stage a lot and really enjoy themselves. They wouldn't have had that opportunity where I grew up.

Their lives are very different to mine, but it doesn't mean they're not as good!

I live in the country with my 3 boys under 7 but due to building work am living in a small town for half a year. Life seems more spontaneous here! We can walk to the swimming pool, friends houses, country park behind our house. If the children were older they could play out with friends. In the countryside I have to plan their lives much more.

I hear what you are saying but I also think that for older children ie tweens/teens (and although yours are young now it comes around very quickly!) it could be quite boring living "in the middle of nowhere" and until your children are old enough to drive it would be very "structured" for YOU as you would have to drive them to see friends etc as bus services are notoriously poor in the countryside.

To be honest, I think you have the best of both worlds at the moment ie living where you do with all the opportunities it has to offer and having family that you can visit at the weekends/school holidays I wish I did

I hope you feel happier about it all soon

I agree with blue. Your children's childhood is different to yours but still good.

We live in the country, my DDs have just left for uni. I think they had a childhood out of an Enid Blyton novel- endless bike rides, picnics, playing in streams, lots of imagination used. However I being a town girl, used to wish we could move so the children could be more independent in their teens. We had to take them everywhere as no public transport.
My DDs do look back and say they truly loved their childhood but they have both said they wouldn't want to bring their teens up in the countryside as they think there are so many more opportunities when living in a city.

I think you should stop worrying about the children. I would ask though, do you want to live near your relatives anyway, maybe that's the issue, not the children?

This isn't about where you live [flowers?

You sound quite bitter, and very dismissive of the reasons your husband wants to live in the city.

FWIW I live in the city (live in London zone 3). Prior to living here we lived in a barn conversion in the countryside, next to a stables and a farm. I love where I live now and feel like moving out of the country was an escape from prison. I hated that I needed the car for everything. Sure, you could go for a nice spontaneous walk but other than that, shopping, seeing friends etc would all require much more planning and faff than they do here. It is not about being near 'trendy restaurants and gigs' but the practicality to decide that we'll decide at the school gates to have the kids friends round after school, or grab a pint of milk when I'm walking past the shop anyway.

'Playdates' in our house mean that the kids run around the house and/or garden, jump on the trampoline, dig in the mud, make up imaginary games, make up and put on 'shows', draw and write stories together, play with cars/trains etc. None of this is supervised by me beyond making sure that no-one is injured.....I don't really get this worry that playdates are too structured.

All of our family love getting out to the country at weekends or in the holidays, but that doesn't mean we'd love to live there. It sounds like you have the best of both worlds with somewhere to visit where the kids can enjoy it, but with the convenience of living in town.

You should perhaps have considered the difference in values and aspirations when you married or decided to have children. Or has this wave of nostalgia only hit you since you had children? Did you enjoy city facilities before that?

You and your husband do need to do some talking about your future, what it's all about and what you want out of life.

Countryside can be fab as a child, crap and very isolating as a teenager. For parents, it involves being a part-time taxi service, to take children and teens to all their social activities! You won't have thought about all the work your parents had to put into it as a child.

The brilliant things about cities include facilities like theatres, art galleries, sports facilities and all the child and youth activities these places run. So much choice. So much opportunity to indulge and nurture any interest.

Also, the ability to walk to places and to friends' houses makes children much more independent and free to develop their own social lives when they're a bit older.

Yabu, your childhood sounds like my idea of hell; lots of obligation to help and out in the middle of nowhere.

I grew up in London, but at one point was shipped out to live in the countryside and hated it. I had all the freedom you have described living in London, with a lot more variety of things to do. I, like all my friends, were sent off for the day and not expected home until tea time. We had lots of outdoor play and adventures.

I remember going Blackberry and Strawberry picking, trying to build a tree house, building a swing across a little river, spending entire days playing in the park or local woods, catching little animals to play with etc. Ok there was no hay or milk to carry, but we also had lots of places to go when it was raining, not a tv in sight.

Its not the location, its more the style, nowadays people just don't send their kids off like that.

My DC have lots of 'unstructured' play, and I can tell you from experience that they manage to get stung in our garden in zone 2 quite enough without being sent out to do the same in a field.

There can be many different ways of having a happy childhood. I can appreciate that it's hard for you living in a city if you're a country person but it can still be great for your DCs. My 3 DCs have all been raised in London and I'm pretty sure they've had a happy childhood and they've done things they wouldn't have if we'd lived somewhere rural. Teenagers actually tend to have more freedom in cities than the country because they aren't reliant on their parents driving them everywhere. Also, teenagers don't want to picnic and romp in the woods, they want cinemas and shopping centres and swimming pools.
My Dsis lives in the middle of nowhere with her DCs and they're very happy but they love visiting us and seeing the red buses and city stuff just like mine love seeing sheep and cows when we visit her.
There is more than one way to have a happy childhood.

I think your OP is about two separate things: whether children's play is over-controlled these days, and city vs. country. FWIW I agree that children shouldn't have excess parental involvement in their play. But that could happen in the city - why is the other parent hovering around your house during the play date? Tell him/her to come back in 2 hours! As long as she/he returns the favour, of course.

I grew up in the countryside and yes it was an amazing childhood int eras of freedom and being ale to explore safely up until I went to secondary school at 13. Then tbh it was a prison sentence. All my friend's lived in the town 7 miles away, no buses outside of the school bus and my parents were too busy to drive us anywhere.

I have never chosen to go back to live in the countryside and I wouldn't even for my son. He has lots more to do growing up in a town and as a teenager he will have much more freedom to go out as he can walk into town if he wants.

I think you're really idealising your childhood and need to have a careful think about what it was really like. Your kids get to go to the countryside for weekends with your family so they get the best of both worlds as far as I can see.

I'm a city person, maybe i'm spoiled, but i need all of it -- a variety of shops, restaurants and entertainment and other things to do. Also the choices for children's schools and activities.
I couldn't live in a small town or a farm. I'd be bored to death.
To each their own i guess.

FWIW OP I agree with much of what you say but I think you are missing the obvious about why you are unhappy. I think having your family near and seeing your DCs grow up with their cousins is important to you and you are sad you are missing that. You sound unhappy with your DH and angry that he is 'keeping' you from your family. I think you are viewing your childhood with such longing just now because what you have around you is not making you feel unhappy or fulfilled, and you sound lonely in your new community.

However, what you say about structured play dates is also true. I think our kids are missing out on real opportunities to be creative, explore, take risks and learn to trust their own judgements when everything is arranged, timetabled and organised. Lots of mums agree with you, so be the one who does something about it. If the park is the only countryside you have just now then 'arrange' your play dates there and let the kids roam as much as they can. Take blankets and help them make dens, take bikes, let them creat their own games and props. Teach them to be urban explorers with maps etc. Be spontaneous, buy a day ticket and start hopping buses and exploring. Look for local groups like Sustrans.org or Free Range Kids where you may find activities which fit your values. If your husband is against changing job or commuting then you need to make the best of what you have and find activities your kids will enjoy (which may not be the same as you enjoyed) and which you can share together.

Btw, if you want your DC to have opportunities to play in mud and water and encounter insects, look up nature reserves in your area. The Wildlife Trusts particularly have a lot of them, all over the place (try local authorities too) and run Wildlife Watch clubs, volunteer days and all sorts of activities.

If that's too structured, just go and explore them yourselves. Take a picnic.

Oh, also look up the National Trust's 50 things to do before you're 11 3/4. It addresses exactly the point you're making (getting stung is not one though!).

I love londond but id not want to live there

we live in the country on a farm near the coast and my kids have a lot of the same things you did when you were little. Lots of outside time making dens and exploring and lots of time on the beach too.

I don't think it is about 'these days', but about the way you have chosen to bring up your children /where you live.

We live in the London suburbs, I love being near town and my children spend most weekends rambling round nearby woods, making dens getting mucky etc. It's not where you live it's what you choose to do.

Depends......obviously your childhood involved alot of freedom and space and potential to explore. We moved to the middle of nowhere when I was 13. It was DEATHLY boring and incredibly lonely. There was nothing for miles around except fields which belonged to farmers so you weren't allowed to go on them. You had to drive to get anywhere which my parents weren't inclined to do for us or walk 4 miles to the bus stop. I would never, in a million years move my DD out to somewhere like that. We are in the middle of a small city and my Dd has more freedom here at 11 than I had at 14 or 15. She can walk to her friends, has the shops, Arts' Centre, parks, school, music lessons on her doorstep. We walk everywhere because it is all close by.

I actually teach in a very rural setting and many of my class have the kind of childhood you describe so I do know what you mean, but I don't think either group are necessarily deprived or more lucky than the other. Obviously that's only my opinion and you clearly feel differently. Why wont your husband consider your idea of moving to a town nearer to your folks? It's a shame because you could easily compromise on this, it doesn't have to be one or the other.