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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to be a bit embarrassed about having a christening?

78 replies

biggerquestions · 20/03/2014 23:20

We are planning a christening for our new baby. DP wants to do it as he's " a traditionalist" - he's also an atheist. Although he does sometimes go to our local church and sometimes even enjoys it - the sermons, the community. I am not committed enough to be an atheist, I can't bring myself to say there is no God, as I don't know. But I don't believe in it in a 'literal' sense. I go to our local church 1-2 times a month, sometimes less, sometimes more. I've been going more since I had children ( no not just for schools!) I enjoy the services, the sense of community, the time out from the general chaos of life. Gives me a chance to slow down and think about life and how I behave etc. I like the vicar, he knows my name. I realise that if I was born somewhere else or to other parents I could just as easily be going to a synagogue, a temple or a mosque. I don't think Christianity is necessarily the 'right religion' any more than the others. But 'church' is so much more than having to have a literal 100% belief in something that was probably a manmade constuct.

Anyway..... really want to do something special for new baby and christening seems obvious choice. We are regulars at the church so why not? I'm being a bit of a hypocrite if I take the vows absolutely literally but I don't feel I'm disrespecting the church or anyone's faith because I have a big love of the church, particularly our one... I"m just not exactly a Christian. The thing is most of my friends are staunch atheists and christenings don't seem as common anymore ie they are not just 'the done thing'. I'm not sure how to explain why we are doing it to my friends.. it's not like I can say " Because I believe all this stuff and I"m a Christian".
Have looked into Thanksgiving service or Naming Ceremony but they have been dismissed for various reasons. I don't want to abandon idea altogether - can't I just have one out of tradition? Or is that really bad? Am I right to be embarrassed?
Sorry for ramble... I"m tying myself up in knots about this.

OP posts:

Bue · 21/03/2014 18:50

You're regulars at the church. Therefore it seems perfectly acceptable to have a christening. No one will be peering into your soul to check that your beliefs are perfectly aligned with the CofE. "I have no desire to make windows into men's souls"!!!

mycatlikestwiglets · 21/03/2014 18:55

Most churches offer a dedication alternative if the parents aren't comfortable making the promises which a christening involves. Why don't you speak to your vicar/parish office about the options? It sounds as though you really want the "event" rather than the meaning of a baptism and you can get that without making promises you don't intend to keep.

Joysmum · 21/03/2014 19:25

I used the word hipocrasy in my post about myself.

The OP sounds more akin to my DH in her views which is why I told my story.

The OP does sound more doubtful but she's stated her DH is atheist as I am. How does he feel about it? Would he be prepared to make promises that he as an atheist can't keep? If he can then there's no issue, if he can't then maybe he'd be more akin to my attitude on this which is to fully support the OP in her choices but not to be a part if the ceremony myself because I don't believe in god. That's why I posted my story.

MrsTerryPratchett · 21/03/2014 19:41

OP you need to get your DH on here. I simply cannot understand how a Richard Dawkins atheist wants a Christening. Confused doesn't cover it.

soundedbetterinmyhead · 21/03/2014 19:43

Waltonswatcher1 "We adopt Christianity when it suits us .This is always in a cosy , traditional , get together for a nice photo way ."

Perhaps you speak for yourself and the people you know when you write this. I find that in the UK we have a Christianity-based culture and that leads people to turn to the church during celebrations, birth and death. Christmas church services are often full with people who never come at any other time - and that's terrific. It would be lovely if they would come more often, but something's driving them out in cold weather to sing songs and contemplate the birth of a baby who they may or may not believe is the son of God.

If the people who are at church every week don't have an issue with this, I'm not sure you need to get cross. If you don't go to church, you'll never see them anyway, so what's the problem?

Waltonswatcher1 · 21/03/2014 19:54

Soundbetter
I am not cross ! Just chatting on a forum .
If I wasn't so busy I would have added more to back up my points , one thing I would have said is that as I am not a Christian I can't presume to know how they feel about it . So yes , if it doesn't bother the church to have none believers hijacking the celebrations then alls good !

I don't understand it myself . Seems utterly bizarre .

MrsTerryPratchett · 21/03/2014 19:57

if it doesn't bother the church to have none believers hijacking the celebrations then alls good The Church hijacked preexisting celebrations so I don't really see why anyone should mind.

NurseyWursey · 21/03/2014 20:00

If you don't believe then I feel that you are being disrespectful to the church, and the priest.

I'm an atheist so I wont get my children christened. I'd be a massive hypocrite if I did.

Most people do it for the party, I think you should only do it if you truly believe in god and want to bring your child up with that in mind. Although I do think it should be ultimately the child's decision.

JennyWithers · 21/03/2014 20:02

Has anyone mentioned godparents? My dcs were christened -chiefly to shut my mother up- and they have a bunch of slightly random but devoted adults looking out for them. My own godfather (I'm 50 this year, he's late 70s) is still in touch and gets on well with DS1

Martorana · 21/03/2014 20:08

I find the idea of non Christians christening their children repugnant. And doing it in order to get into a school is shockingly immoral.

FairPhyllis · 21/03/2014 20:16

I'm a Christian - if you feel drawn to it, have the christening.

God's grace is for everyone.

HerGraciousMajTheBeardedPotato · 21/03/2014 20:23

I don't think it is hypocritical. You feel drawn to the spiritual and communal aspects of Christianity as practiced in your church. You want to mark your baby's arrival, perhaps also to give thanks. They seem perfectly good reasons to have her Christened. Though, as a PP has mentioned, a Dedication might be appropriate, and fit in the middle ground between 'Christian' and 'spiritual'.

hunreeeal · 21/03/2014 23:09

Isn't there a more positive way to see this than "hijacking"? The church now shares some of the pagan aspects of some festivals at certain times of year. But no present-day Christian was there at the time or made those decisions about the church calendar. Obviously all humans share the different aspects of the seasons of the year. And from the other angle, the C of E is there to serve everyone in its parish and church is there for anyone who'd like to join.

Waltonswatcher1 · 21/03/2014 23:16

I like to think these festivals have ' evolved' . Even in our lifetime they are changing . Materialism and commercial opportunity has crept in and claimed them .

Joysmum · 22/03/2014 08:55

Read the wording of the service you will be attending/having.

Look at the wording of the questions made directly to parents and godparents.

Decide whether you agree with the standard response you are expected to make to that question, look at what you have to promise.

In all honesty, can you say you agree with the scripted responses you have to give to every question? If you don't agree and choose make the declaration of that scripted response then you will be lying.

As a non-believer, I couldn't in all honesty have even given the standard replies that even the main congregation have scripted for them, let alone the questions posed to parents and godparents. I love being witness to a christening, but, as with any church service I go to, I can only sit in respectful silence if being true to myself and not wanting to lie.

cattypussclaw · 22/03/2014 09:01

My DH and I recently became godparents and we have regretted it every moment since. Despite our protestations that we are both atheists and it would be massively hypocritical of us, my brother insisted he wanted us as godparents and caused a huge fuss in the family. We were persuaded just to go along with it and we did, for a quiet life. We now sincerely wish we hadn't. Felt hugely hypocritical standing in church and saying words that meant nothing to is. We were disrespectful and know it. Feel terrible about it and wish you luck with your dilemma OP.

bamboostalks · 22/03/2014 09:31

Just cannot believe that a staunch atheist would ever dream of their child being christened. How totally bizarre! Have you actually read the service? Do you realise the promises that you'll be making? How weird. I certainly couldn't look at my hypocritical myself in the mirror. There are plenty of non religious schools to choose from. How do people expect the stranglehold the churches have over education to lessen whilst they enter into such madness?

007licencetostandonamolehill · 22/03/2014 09:33

Neither of you believe in god so probably best not to have a christening. Have a baby naming ceremony instead?

MrsWinklepicker · 22/03/2014 09:33

Why is it hypocritical for an atheist to be involved in a Christian service? Offensive? Perhaps. Meaningless? Almost certainly. But hypocritical? Dictionary anyone?

CountessOfRule · 22/03/2014 09:43

I suppose it's hypocritical if they're atheist because they think religion is meaningless and religious observance absurd ... and then take part in religious observance.

Sitting quietly and not joining in wouldn't be hypocritical, no. But actively getting involved, or actively choosing a religious route for your family if you believe it's all humbug would be, I'd say.

CountessOfRule · 22/03/2014 09:46

Comma missing after family, sorry. Changes meaning.

manicinsomniac · 22/03/2014 09:47

I don't see why not at all.

The whole point of the church is that it's for everyone; believers, those who are questioning and the community at large. I'm a practising evangelical Christian and think excluding people from the elements of our shared cultural Christianity is damaging to the church and the antithesis of Christian love. I actually chose not to have my children christened but I fully support anyone with any beliefs who wants that.

Jesus said 'let the little children come to me'. That's all the answer I'd need for a justification.

Caitlin17 · 22/03/2014 09:58

Joysmum your post describes my feelings exactly. One goes but sits in respectful silence. If possible I sit at the back to avoid offending anyone who might think I'm not taking part.

I find it extraordinary any parent who doesn't believe in a god could make the responses and promises required at a christening in good conscience.

CountessOfRule · 22/03/2014 10:23

manic I have similar feelings about that part of the Bible, which is why I always recommend a blessing/thanksgiving/dedication if parents aren't sure enough about Christianity for a full baptism. All of those services are "welcome to the church community" services but don't require people to make promises.

Thetallesttower · 22/03/2014 10:31

I suppose it's hypocritical if they're atheist because they think religion is meaningless and religious observance absurd ... and then take part in religious observance.

Not all church-goers believe in God as we typically think of Him- someone else mentioned the 'Sea of Faith' which is written by an atheist who believes there is a very important part for ritual, celebration and so on and that the church (or other religious places) has a very strong role in keeping communities/social norms etc together.

Many people if you look around in a church will be at different stages or times in their religious lives, they might be quite doubting, struggling to feel connected, not sure what they believe.

The idea you have to be certain about these things or you are a 'hypocrite' to take part in them is wrong- sometimes it is the taking part that draws you one way or another.

OP, if you want to have a christening, and it sounds like you do, have one, don't worry what your friends think (are you sure they are all staunch atheists, quite a few of my friends have a quiet faith or go to church occasionally, they don't all define themselves by this or go on about it). Your partner can decide if he wants to be involved (or is happy for you to go ahead).

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