To tell Dog owners control you fecking dogs!

[Wishfulmakeupping]

I'll get flamed I don't care. I'm fed up of people letting their dogs run wild just had another dog clamour all over me when I'm walking down the street with a 'sorry' from the owner again this happens to often. Last week a dog off its lead stuck its head near my child pram.
Its simple if you can't control your dog off its lead then keep it on its lead until you get to the park.
I think I'm going to go nuclear next time :(

I was hoping to do the school run in september with my dog , but worry that he will scare children as he is so big , a lot of mums take their much smaller and prettier dogs , but mine looks like a beast in comparison . He doesn't jump or lunge or lick though , but he is still large . I have never left him tied up anywhere so not sure how he would feel about being left across the road , obviously wouldn't take him into the playground , but could loiter outside the school fence , possibly detering the selfish gits who insist on parking on the road instead of using the massive car park on the other side of the road

How dare that nasty man object to your out of control dog chasing him and barking at him? Doesn't he realise that dogs have rights?

Ffs.

Couldn't agree more, OP. Go nuclear; sometimes it's all anyone understands. ('Anyone' being the dog owner, not the dog of course.)

I'm all for 'live and let live'. I know some people don't like children; I don't let children in my care bother strangers. Likewise, some of us don't like dogs/are allergic to dogs/are worried about toxocariasis etc. So, sauce for goose, sauce for gander: dog owners: prevent your dogs from bothering people - especially small children - that you don't know for sure will welcome such bothering, and make sure you clear up all their mess. 'Prevent' there is an active verb, note: either train your animals to never bother other people (difficult perhaps, but maybe possible), or keep them tied up on a lead and close enough to you that you can stop them whenever there's a possibility of other people - especially small children - being around. And don't leave their faeces around on the ground in public places like parks.

One recent experience. Recently in the local park, which is generally full of animals running round, but which has a (very) small fenced-off playpark with the usual 'no dogs allowed' sign on the gate. And - you guessed it - a man with a small child and a dog inside the playpark. When I pointed out (my DGD, 18months, is properly scared of dogs) that the dog shouldn't be there, I got a stream of abuse, 'Huh, always some jobsworth, etc., etc. ...'

Now, if you want to take the risk of disease (see, eg www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2242751/Girl-nearly-goes-blind-inadvertently-eating-parasite-dog-mess-travelled-stomach-EYEBALL.html) or attack on your children by your animal, fine; your decision. But it's plain not fair for you to put those risks on other people's children.

In short, keep your dogs away from me and my family! It's your responsibility, note, not your dog's. Otherwise, take the consequences: any dog getting too close to me or any child under my protection can expect to be forcibly moved away - force applied being the minimum required, sure, but up to fatal if necessary.

I've tried being reasonable. Many dog owners don't seem to get it, though. Talk, reasoning, doesn't work. So, seems it's the only way. And I recommend it to others, including the OP. If enough of us do this, the dog-owning miscreants will soon catch on.

If you're a properly responsible dog owner, you'll have no quarrel with any of this: you won't allow your dog near me or my family, so there'll be no trouble. If you're irresponsible like Mr 'always-a-jobsworth', expect trouble. 'Nuclear' trouble, if necessary!

evalyn i am actually scared to leave the house now

Yup, totally agree. A few weeks ago I was dropping DS off at his childminders when an off the lead dog ran past and into the actual house, started jumping up at all the children who were all terrified. An out of breath woman puffed up muttering vauge apologies, took ages to get her dog back under control and. then swore at the childminder when it was suggested she keep her dog on a lead!

Oh, the temptation to just shut the door, corral the dog and deny all knowledge of it whilst preparing the BBQ.

The violent talk from some mothers on here is truly frightening and just adds to the out of control hysteria that seems to surround dogs recently. I have a lovely, well behaved young dog but reading some of the opinions makes me worried to take her out of the house. I always pick up poo, even if it takes me half an hour to find it. I try to avoid busy times at our dog friendly park and if I see young children about I put her on the lead. I have 3 children and have owned dogs for many years and can honestly say that I have never had a problem with these hundreds of out of control, slavering, child eating beasts that seem to roam the corridors of mumsnet. The only bad experience I have had is when my 12 week old puppy was running about 20 feet away from a family when the dad came running towards her and tried to kick her head in for being near his daughter.

Yes, frightened and defensive people are very dangerous and unpredictable. It is better to avoid them.

You seriously think he should have kicked a 12 week old puppy in the head for being 20 feet away. Hysteria.

I took my kids to the park yesterday to throw a baseball around. An enormous, menacing dog kept on chasing after the baseball and running off with it/chewing it. Yes it was funny and we laughed but it went on and on. Ball coming back covered in slobber. Owner thought it was hilarious.

Sigh.

No I don't think he should have kicked her.
But you saw a puppy, he saw an uncontrolled animal with teeth heading towards his child and took action before it got any closer.
He'd probably have tried to kick out at a rat doing the same thing.
Frightened people are dangerous and unpredictable.

If you love your dog, why endanger it like that?

Surely seeing a small pup and thinking "uncontrolled animal with teeth" is not rational behaviour. I have 3 children whom I have raised to near adulthood without being prone to totally irrational thinking. This is what I don't get. Why when some people have children do they become so paranoid. Nobody I know thinks like this.

I think that's the point Goblin. I am so confident in my dog's temperament that actually it makes me very cross when kids barrel up to him and grab him - or as one particularly daft boy did, try and scare him by roaring like a monster in his face. I am as sure as you ever can be that he would not bite, but he is a big dog, and all it would take is one child doing something stupid, Giant Dog jumping up thinking it's in play, and a scared parent saying my dog 'attacked' him, and I would have a real problem on my hands.

Sadly, the posts here about people kicking a 7 week old puppy for going 'near' a child, or a grown man trying kick a Miniature Schnauzer puppy (seriously, google them, I've met scarier looking rabbits) show that just like people who are suspicious of dogs will always assume the worst, I think as owners we need to always assume the worst about strange humans.

See, I didn't think my pup was in any danger as she wasn't doing anything wrong. I hadn't allowed for hysterical, irrational parents!

Endanger the dog in what way? How are you supposed to know that some deranged bloke is going to run up to your puppy and try and kick it's head in because it was playing 20 feet away from his kid? That isn't exactly normal, everyday behaviour.

Someone went out of their way to stand on my previous dog's tail once :( I was waiting for someone to get off a bus - bus shelter beside the kerb, wide pavement, then a wall. I was standing against the wall a few feet along from the bus stop with SelectALab sitting quietly beside me, on his lead. Man walking along the pavement towards us almost drew level, then stepped in and trod on the end of SelectALab's tail. There was no one else on that stretch of the pavement so no need for him to alter his course - it was obviously deliberate. Dog yelped and understandably jumped up (jumped up as in went from sitting to standing, not paws off the ground), and the man started a tirade about dogs shouldn't be at a bus stop (I was about ten feet away from the shelter), should be under control etc (he was motionless until YOU trod on him, arsehole!) and was generally very unpleasant.

I'm afraid I swore at him, quite a bit

imonaplane: OK, you're right. 20 feet is too much. I'm not going to chase 20 feet to try and kick your dog, even if I could. If it gets close enough to me or one of my family, though, I'll defend us against it just as if it were a bubonic-plague-bearing rat. Which it may as well be, as far as I'm concerned. 'Close enough'? Let's say within kicking distance, why not? Good rule of thumb?

Thing is, what you see as a loveable cuddly 'man's best friend', I see as a smelly, disease-ridden, dirty stupid dangerous animal. You think I'm irrational to think what I do? OK, fine ... but I think you're irrational to think what you do. What's the solution? Live and let live. But keep your animal as far away as possible from me or my family or take the consequences. Or, rather, have your dog take the consequences for your thoughtlessness if you let it run free and it gets too close.

As I said, I've no quarrel with dog owners who keep their dogs away from me and my family. Live and let live as far as that goes.

Some of my best friends have dogs. They know not to bring them round when they come. I know not to go hang around their doghouses. Sorted!

Can I just ask the dog owners here how you train your dogs to come back? This is a serious question. I don't have a dog at the moment but have in the past and am now regularly in charge of a relative's dog who, at 1 year, can be a bit of a handful.
TBH my children have been bounced over many times by friends/families/strangers dogs and it has never bothered me. Yes they have been initially scared and cried but the owners have always been very apologetic and will wait around whilst I reintroduce the child to dog properly and allow them to tell the dog to sit and give it a treat. In most of these cases they have been young dogs that are still on the "bouncy, over friendly" stage and are likely to be the wonderful family, come-when-called dogs that the owners on here are going on about. It probably helps that I love dogs and would like to get another one of my own when the children are bigger so want them to play/grow up with them and understand their behaviour.
I understand that an uncontrollable dog should be on a lead but in order to learn to be the socially acceptable animal we all want they need some time off the lead. I used to have a rescue lurcher that for the first year I had her she ran off regularly. But constant training worked and soon she stuck like glue to my side, ignoring deer/chickens/rabbits etc (she was never a children/person dog so didn't run up to people).

I would always assume that there might be dogs loose in woodland areas but in parks dogs should be much more closely controlled.

evalyn "a bubonic plague bearing rat"?, "a smelly, disease ridden, dirty stupid dangerous animal"? Hysteria. I don't like cats but I'm not hysterical enough to describe them in derogatory terms like that. Some parents lose all rational thought where their little princes and princesses are concerned. I rest my case.

blondefriend I spend loads of time on recall when dog is a pup / when I first get it if it's an older rescue. Start on a lead in the house, use a very high-value treat - cheese, dried liver/sausage or similar - and/or toy for a less food-motivated dog. I crouch down, open/welcoming posture, 'excited' tone and show the treat / toy while using whatever command I've chosen for recall (I use dog's name to get attention then "here"). If dog doesn't already show interest (which most do) then I tug gently on the lead to encourage it closer. Essentially the trick is to make me + treat more interesting than anything else around. LOTS of praise and the treat / game with toy for coming when called.

Then I move to the same thing but in the garden, still on the lead, then a longer extending lead - the only time I use one, as I hate them for out-and-about walking as they don't give enough control - and finally loose in the garden. I ALWAYS praise when the dog comes, no matter how long it might take or how irritated I might feel with a wilful dog.

Only when recall is 100% established loose in the garden do I progress to letting the dog off the lead in a public place. To be honest, using the above method it really doesn't take very long. Admittedly my expertise is with gundogs; I know sighthounds and lurchers can be trickier.

Anyone who really doesn't like dogs near them, I would strongly suggest NOT kicking them. Mostly because a dog's bite reflex is about 2000 times faster than even a martial arts master's kick, so if it IS a potentially aggressive dog you're likely to get bitten and if it isnt' an aggressive dog but you scare it into thinking it needs to defend itself you're more likely to get bitten.

If you want to shoo a dog away stand tall, stand still and say AWAY or BACK calmly, loudly and firmly. Tell kids to stand still or walk calmly away, i.e. not scream, squeal, flap their hands or toys at the dogs face, and run around in circles.

Blue Cross advice around dogs

SelectAUserName - Thank you. Yes, toys and treats did NOT work with my lurcher. In the end we used agility as a way of proving that being with me was better than anything else. We would use anything we saw on a walk as an obstacle.
My relative's dog is a lab and is 100% in the house and garden but gets overexcited when she sees another dog or ball and recall is impossible. I therefore don't let her off the lead in parks or areas where children are playing with balls but in the woods I let her off doing constant recall with treats (being a lab she loves food) but the moment she sees a dog she is off whatever I've got with me. Over a week she slowly gets better but next time I have her she's back to the beginning again - drives me potty, their last dog was the same. I would refuse to have her but she is great with the kids and I can persuade them to have my kids in return for a dirty weekend away.

I don't envy you - if your relative isn't consistently reinforcing your good work in between times, you've got an uphill struggle installing a reliable recall.