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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think dp is being an entitled arse?

93 replies

Beavie · 03/03/2014 12:53

Opinions please! Me and dp had a row yesterday. He is a teacher and thinks it is massively unfair that he gets paid the same as a younger teacher with the same experience. He went into teaching late in life, he is nearly 40, and this is his first year after his nqt.

He was actually put up a pay scale by his last school because of his age, so he is getting more than he would if he was younger. But he seems to think that his masses of life experience should mean that he gets paid significantly more. His life experience mostly involves travelling around the world putting on raves, so not exactly relevant.

I told him it's his tough shit for arsing about for so long before studying. No?

OP posts:
K8Middleton · 03/03/2014 13:12

What subject does he teach?

YouAreMyFavouriteWasteOfTime · 03/03/2014 13:12

did his raves become more profitable as he got older/had children?

BringMeTea · 03/03/2014 13:15

He sounds a bit thick. If I were you OP this would actually make me find him less attractive. I hope he realizes just what a dick he is being.

Lovecat · 03/03/2014 13:17

Oh Jebus, he sounds as bad as my SIL, who when her ex left her in the lurch with 3 kids complained that she should get more Income Support than 'people on council estates' because she was used to a better standard of living...Hmm (I wish I was making that up)

Jolleigh · 03/03/2014 13:17

Was this seriously a row? Like a proper falling out type of row?? He can't surely think that he should be paid way above and beyond another person with the same experience simply because he's older and has children?

You have to get on the career ladder to start climbing it!

fascicle · 03/03/2014 13:18

His reasoning is lawed, but I think teaching should be better paid. 25k is low.

fascicle · 03/03/2014 13:18

flawed not lawed.

Hobbes8 · 03/03/2014 13:21

Reminds me of this Armstrong and Miller sketch:
m.youtube.com/watch?v=4slqDJaU6VU

Original poster
Beavie · 03/03/2014 13:22

He was being totally serious yes.

I told him what a bell end he was being and he told me that he knows far better than me because he has a business degree, darling, and this is the kind of stuff he knows about.

Yes a proper row, he was frothing that I disagreed with him. I am studying to be a social worker and he asked if I thought it was fair that when I graduate I will earn the same as a 21 year old sw graduate, and I said yes that's more than fair. He couldn't see how I reached that conclusion.

OP posts:
MaidOfStars · 03/03/2014 13:22

He was actually put up a pay scale by his last school because of his age, so he is getting more than he would if he was younger

Is this even legal? If I were a younger teacher at that school, I'd have complained very loudly and bitterly.

earlyriser · 03/03/2014 13:24

But if he worked in Scotland that is exactly what would happen. As I entered teaching a few years later than many, i was paid at a higher scale than them, to reflect my age and experience. It was certainly standard practice 15 years ago, not sure if it is now.

oldwomaninashoe · 03/03/2014 13:24

Ha, I am a civil servant and what ever grade you are on you get paid the same rate whether or not you have been doing the job for 10 minutes or ten years!

MaidOfStars · 03/03/2014 13:26

In my field, you get paid according to the job you do. Age doesn't count for anything. I probably get paid the same as some of the twenty-somethings and some of the forty-somethings.

ISeeYouShiverWithAntici · 03/03/2014 13:28

well, really it doesn't matter what he thinks. He won't get paid that.

what's he going to do? march in to the head and demand a higher salary on account of the fact he didn't get his shit together till he was 40?

Goblinchild · 03/03/2014 13:28

'Goblinchild

"despite being the possessor of a penis"

What a vile thing to say and nothing to do with the topic...you don't have to have a penis to be an entitled arse.

Look at the percentages of male/female in teaching.
Look at the percentages of M/F in SLT
Look at the percentages of F/M in headships, advisers and management.
There has been a problem with that for decades, and the OP's husband is likely to end up benefiting from that bias if he stays in teaching and is reasonable at it, especially if he already feels confidently entitled to a better deal than the average.
He may well be SLT in another couple of years.

pluCaChange · 03/03/2014 13:28

If he were teaching business studies and could use his budgeting, bookkeeping and organisational experience to offer new perspectives to his pupils, maybe. However, I expect "recognition" for tgat sort of thing would be more of a private school thing to do...?

I have a French friend who teaches English, and she does gave a points system (state sector), which offers points (which can be traded fir more desirable posts, e.g. South of France ir the Alps!) for things like:

  • a year studying abroad, as it was in an English-speaking country),
  • passing the CAPES language/culture exam
  • years teaching
  • teaching in a challenging school
  • also, having family (not quite sure how this one works, only that she was losing out on one full-time-in-one-school place to a married colleague, who may have had children - sorry, I can't remember)

So family respondibilities are (or were) included (this was before Sarkozy had his presidency), but exoerience had to be relevant.

K8Middleton · 03/03/2014 13:28

15 years ago age discrimination legislation did not exist earlyriser.

Now you can pay someone with more experience and skills more if you can objectively justify it. So a graduate who has only ever had part time work in a supermarket is likely to have fewer transferable skills than someone who worked their way up to a middle manager over 10 years and made a career change.

However, if there is no relevant experience or transferable skills it cannot be objectively justified and so would be unlawful.

K8Middleton · 03/03/2014 13:30

Did they not cover basic employment law in that business degree? Seems a bit shit if it didn't.

Original poster
Beavie · 03/03/2014 13:31

He doesn't teach business, he teaches mfl.

OP posts:
caruthers · 03/03/2014 13:33

What are you going on about Goblinchild.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-14748273

Teaching in both secondary and primary teaching is dominated by women.

Your use of genitalia in this instance is crass and sexist.

MammaTJ · 03/03/2014 13:33

I would love to agree with him, being at uni studying nursing at 46, but only if his way applies to nursing too! Grin

In all honesty though, why should he (or I) get paid more than someone who has gained the same qualification at the same time?

Jolleigh · 03/03/2014 13:35

He's being a prat then Beavie and doesn't like that you're not agreeing with his prattish ways. Being older than his peers doesn't make him a better language teacher. Nor does having children. Nor does having a business degree. And frankly I'm a bit tickled at him waving said degree in your face as if it automatically makes his opinions more valid than yours.

rollonthesummer · 03/03/2014 13:36

Ha ha-I've been teaching for 16 years and don't get £37k!

I think he should go to see his Head teacher and have a big strop about it. That should make him see sense. What an unattractive trait.

littlemrssleepy · 03/03/2014 13:37

Caruthers I think that was Goblinchild's point - teaching is dominated by women, yet despite this men dominate the SLT (Senior Leadership Team) and headship roles. I lost count of the number of primary schools i looked at where the question "do you have any male teachers" was answered "well, there is the head and the deputy head".

K8Middleton · 03/03/2014 13:38

Oh thank goodness for that! What language should we tell him he's being a prat in?