To Think That Comprehensive Schools of the 70s and 80s were "Shit" and did nothing for many pupils and where in many cases just as bad as the "Modern" Schools they replaced

[soul2000]

I suffered terribly at my "Middle Class" Comprehensive in the early 1980s and when I was taken out by my parents at the end of 3rd year I could not even hold a pen correctly. I had forgotten even this basic thing, the Secondary school taught my absolutely nothing , and just left me dreading school everyday ( Not through Physical Bullying) I was able to defend myself that way , but through Mental Torture from Staff as well as pupils.

I honestly believe I would have learnt more in a old fashioned "Modern School" The dreaded words, I believe that they would have at least taught me basic Maths/English and I would have been able to show some ability on the sports field.

I know some people will come on and say " I got in to Oxford from My Comprehensive , as did my 10 friends". There must be many people like me though that received an education that was totally inadequate.

They must be some people who believe like me that believe these experiences put them off Education , and made it very difficult to even contemplate returning to any education ( Why Would you go back to something that caused you so much pain and fear)

A long post I know, but was feeling Crap in bed last night and started "Crying" I know its 30 years ago . ( I have Blocked it out for many years) Since I started studying again Open University) I can get fear and trepidation in bed , thinking about education ( although I am doing ok with the O.U)

I'm also aware that there could easily be others from my year whose memories are not as positive; however, I know from those I'm still friends with (quite a few, even though none of us lives there at the moment,) that I am not alone in my opinion.

I went to a comprehensive where it wasn't acceptable to be seen to be hardworking or enthusiastic about learning. I got bullied and shunned and didn't do as well as I should have.

There was no need to ensure 5 As to Cs. I only got 4 first time round. That was an outrage. I didn't have the home support and school had no impetus to push borderline pupils.

There was no need to ensure 5 As to Cs. I only got 4 first time round. That was an outrage. I didn't have the home support and school had no impetus to push borderline pupils.

Soul 2000. Yeah a selective Prep school when DD was 9 offered to take her after tests, but suggested she start 1 year down due to immaturity .
Its funny because that's where she is today 1 year down and out of year group.
the fights I have had for DD 2 School, DH, My Father, Sister all suggesting different things " My father wanting DD 2 to go to Boarding School because it worked for Sister ( DD2 would have Hated Boarding School) Sister wanting DD to live with her , and stating DDs behaviour was down to my lack of parenting skills . Sister rather conveniently forgetting DD 1 and her academic achievements. The most bizarre thing though is that DDs current Senco shared a house at University with DSIS though not that surprising as both are ( Public School Girls).

DSIS has said she wants to stay teaching in the Private Sector, and that one year doing her PGCE was enough of State Education for life. She is very Lucky to be able to choose ( Because Dad spent 14K A year on her Education (30K plus now) .

I was forced to start as a 16 year old shop assistant, and sister moans how hard things are. I "love" Sister dearly but at times she is in a different world from most of us.

I went to a newly-created Comp in the 70s. I think I was in the second intake after the Boys' Grammar and Secondary Modern merged.

We were streamed according to ability from Year 3 (currently Year 9) onwards. If you were in the top set, you got the teachers from the Grammar.

Among the many inequities that annoy me, is that those in the top set were catered for academically but didn't benefit from the properly Comprehensive ethos. We were still too segregated. We had to do the 'academic' subjects and weren't given a shot at anything 'manual'. The one hands-on subject that I was allowed to do has given me more pleasure and been more useful than the majority of the lessons I was forced to take.

The merging of the schools also caused a lot of difficulties amongst the staff and that was evident to the pupils.

I started Secondary school in 1973 , the School had gone Comprehensive in 1970 from a Secondary Modern. They was no streaming or setting, everybody just thrown in together with each other . Total chaos as "Grammar " ability pupils were asked to do work aimed way below and aimed at bottom level pupils . No Foreign languages at school ( Domestic Science Sewing) . The Brightest could do Typewriting , the English text books were from the 1950s , the desks were to small for 11 year olds never mind 16 year olds. The school leaving age only went up to 16 in 1973 anyway , so it was certainly not a learning environment. I think ( Memory not sure) but the school only entered first pupils 10 of them for O Levels in 1975 , everything before that was CSE'S only.

There was no Streaming or setting...

My comprehensive 1973 to 1980... Huge school, around 2,000 but about 95% left at 16. Mixed CSE and O level classes. Needlework, cooking for girls, auto engineering for boys. One teacher went to jail for sleeping with the children - eventually, but he did a lot of harm first. One used to weep in lessons. Another famously never wore underpants and would "forget" to do up his flies. I got the shit kicked out of me for being a swot until I learned to sell my skills doing homework for people. I went to oxford, no bloody thanks to them, frankly.

morry1000 what seems to underpin your posts is the idea that your sister had it better/easier than you as she was born later and could benefit from your parents' improved financial situation. You seem to think that if you'd had the education your sister had, all your problems would have been 'fixed.' Given the level of knowledge about dyspraxia at the time, this is extremely unlikely. Perhaps even more so in the hothouse environment of a highly academic and/or traditional private school.

Yes your sister was lucky to be born later, but (my views on private education aside) as I understand it an expensive private education couldn't have even been considered when you were 11. So where would the 'fairness' be in saying 'morry went to the local comp, so you must to' or 'sorry younger daughter, you can only have Kwik Save no frills food, as that is all we could afford when morry was your age.' Or 'no we can't have the heating on, because we could only afford to have it on for an hour a day when morry was little.' Circumstances change and she got lucky in a genetic lottery. You don't seem to have gone wholly without given your dad paid your mortgage for a while.

This ridiculous resentment that your sister is gasp a teacher is a bit tiresome too. It is a fairly run of the mill job that doesn't command an astronomical salary. Your husband almost certainly earns a similar amount if not more as a University lecturer.

Another thing that I noticed and stuck in my throat a bit.

The same Dad ( Who would not employ me when he was A Negotiator for the N.U.M) " I don't employ people with no qualifications"

The impression being that you seem to think by the mere fact of being his daughter he should give you a job on the mere basis he was your father. despite you lacking appropriate qualifications.

That just smacks of a bogus sense of entitlement, pointless grudge holding and an incredible memory for a perceived slight.

Compos. You have got me confused with Soul 2000. I don't suffer from Dyspraxia , though I left School without qualifications.

My sister certainly had it "Better" than me and was treated like a Princess and perhaps I should post on the " My Parents took me to Stately Homes Thread". I am delighted for younger sister, and the opportunities she had.

I love her dearly , but two things: 1. Would you not be miffed if a sibling had a £150 K Education (£300 k) in Today's Money, the same time as I was a junior Salesperson ( 25) without much help ( Apart from a room at the "Big House".
2. My sister can be very dogmatic in her ideas, and she believes that I have let DD2 down. Sister is adamant DD would not have suffered the problems ( See Other posts about DD) If I had sent DD to live with her.

Compos. I was 16 years of age and had left school after an incident happened , caused by a bullying teacher ( You will know what Staff's Modern's turned Comps) were like in the 1970s. I needed my dad to at least get me a job doing anything. You will also know that most people in the Mining industry had their jobs through ( Family Connections). The job went to his "Best" mate 17 year old son on the basis that he had 2 O Levels in English/Maths.

Soul, DH feels the same as you. His early 80s Essex comp was terrible, bullying and wild, he left when he was 16 with nothing. He has, in my eyes, done well, but he feels his potential was absolutely wasted.

Like you, I think, he is fanatical about the grammar system, which is something I think that people who had a good education can never really understand.

I live in an 11+ area so we never suffered comprehensives. I went to a sec modern. Out of 4 of us who left primary together , one went to a girls grammar (no a levels, got pregnant, married at 23, did OU and is now a doctors receptionist), one went to a mixed grammar (12 O Levels, no A levels, lived in a squat, eventually went to uni in her late 20's and is Something Big in TV Production), one went to a comp (not even a CSE to her name GCSEs hadnt been invented, is a bossy mare and is the driving force behind her husbands independent finance business.) I was the only one who left with a proper array of qualifications, had a career and was financially independent from the outset.

The sec modern groomed us properly, how to be middle management, how not to be reliant on anyone else. The grammars oddly groomed their girls how to marry well, and the comps seemed to offer little other than courses in 'parent craft' as it was back then.

Yabu to generalise from your own experience. My comp was excellent.

John. I would never have passed the 11+ ( Would have been no point taking it) . That's not the point , My Niece/Nephew have benefited massively from Grammar Schools as would my Brother if one had been available to him. The Sole reason my Niece achieved 3 As at A level and is doing French/Business at an RG University is because of the school she attended . If She had been at the Comprehensive I attended , even that school today she would have ended up with Ds or Cs at best .

OP, did you have a thread last year about blazers and how the local comprehensive ("that school") was rubbish? Your style is very similar.

I did reasonably well at my High School 2 Cs and 3 Ds at Gcse , that was actually quite good for the school in Kent I went to . It was not until you compared them with my younger sister's results who passed her 11+ to realise how badly the pupils were let down with the education that school was providing. The school could not control a few bad boys who would continually push the teachers as far as possible, the school became a bear garden and made learning or wanting to learn difficult or dangerous. It was advisable to not show any eagerness to learning , because that risked being hit or if lucky being called all kind of names. The school at the time was probably only getting 15-20% of its students any passes at Gcse I don't know any people from my year group who got the 5 "good" Gcse requirement , this was as recent as 1992 so not the dark ages either.

The experience of my education made me want to leave as soon as possible and that is why after just doing a one year Btec course in 1993 I stayed out of education for twenty years.
In October I decided to try education again and started on an Access Course with the : Open University , it has been a big step for me and I have found the experience ,so far positive and different from the poor ones I previously had. My family has experienced the good and bad of education in particular the Kent 11+ .my Sister ,her two daughters 14/12 all passed, I failed. The school I went to was from the start more concerned in the football team , then improving the academic prospects of its pupils. The contrast to my sisters experience and those her Daughters are having could not be further from those of mine.

Thanks for reading my first post ...

Here's my experience of Secondary School from the late 70's to mid 80's. I left school feeling that my education was wasted and the system was grossly unfair. Kids were selected after first year and put into teaching groups in the second year i.e sets 1 to 5, naturally set 1 got the best most experienced teachers and set 5 got the worst. We were told if we worked hard and did well in exams we could move up the sets. But this took years and naturally I lost out of a good education and had to put up with bullys and being physically assaulted twice and carry the physical and emotional scares today. At both incidents the two teachers who saw what happened did nothing to intervene. I lost out on a good education because the system was flawed. I worked hard got good CSE's but was not able to do the A levels I wanted and wasted 2 years in 6th form. The whole system was grossly unfair and open to exploitation by both teachers who had their kids there and ensured they got into set 1 and by parents who naturally blocked any attempt to move their kids down sets to make way for people like me to move up. Naturally my A levels were poor, a disaster, I was not allowed to study for certain subjects (Maths) and others were not on offer as a result (History, Geography) and I left completely and utterly disenchanted by the whole rotten experience and which ruined my earlier life and wasted 2 years in sixth form studying rubbish Biology and Art. After school I joined the Army because I felt so disillusioned by education and my experiences to date and my home life where my mother made my life hell as she was just so paranoid, domineering and very annoying and obsessed that my school was really great when it was blatantly the complete opposite. I received absolutely zero advice from either parent as regards jobs or future careers on leaving school, I was completely ignored. My Step Father who was a quiet man never really made any efforts with me and I guess I felt really neglected with no one to turn to for advice or guidance. I then wasted 6 years of my life in the Army regretting the wasted time, out of the frying pan and into the fire. On leaving the army I then rekindled my education getting a professional accountancy qualification, going to uni getting a MBA and a further professional qualification in treasury. However despite these achievements I know I was badly damaged emotionally and my future career was ruined by my rotten school experience and can only dream if I had the chance to change things I would have gone to a good private independent school one that was really academically focused with good teachers. I know that there are some good State schools but why was my experience so rotten and why me? I can only blame my parents for not doing better for me for not communicating with me and especially my step father for being completely and utterly useless showing absolutely no empathy to me. Lastly if I had children I would dread them going to the same school as myself and receiving the same poor and grossly unfair standard of education and feeling extremely inadequate and not prepared for real life. For me my early school years were an absolute misery and I truly regret that wasted early life and even though I did my best at school with its grossly unfair education system which held me back and stopped me early on fulfilling my full potential!

I was at a comp in the very late 70s and 80s - it was very mixed - some middle class kids, a lot of kids from the rough estate.

If you were academic it was a good school up to year 11 (5th year) and I did get good O levels. If you were musical it was quite good too (I wasn't) - but there was an orchestra and a wind band.

Sixth form was not so good - the local FE college had better teaching, but the school was very snobby about it and kind of brainwashed everyone into thinking that the best choice if you were academic was to stay on. There were probably about 15 of us who got into uni/polys - though it was very rare for anyone to get in Oxbridge (none from my year group or the year above, though a few did apply).

There was certainly no encouragement of people to go for careers such as medicine/law etc.
Overall I have mixedmemories of school - some of it was shit, sometimes it was ok.