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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Term time holidays and residential school trips

102 replies

shebird · 17/02/2014 16:38

Sorry another rant about term time holiday fines.

DCs school have a residential trip in years 5&6 to an outdoor activity centre at a cost of approximately £250-£300. The trip involves a week out of school in the middle of term. My understanding is that if your child does not go they get fobbed off to another year group and probably won't learn much while their classmates are away. While I'm sure my DCs would love this, I am a bit annoyed that schools can choose to take a week out of school to build rafts and call it education but if I wanted to take my DCs to visit another country or roman ruins I could face a fine or prison? AIBU to send a letter to the school reminding them of the importance of education quoting statistics on attendance and GCSE failure rates?

OP posts:
Scholes34 · 17/02/2014 17:58

All three DCs loved their Y6 residential trip. In your case, OP, I would question why the school is running a trip in both Y5 and Y6. Surely it dilutes what the children get out of it to do it twice. It's a major expense and easier to justify when it's a one-off.

lljkk · 17/02/2014 19:02

Over my dead body will DS go on yr5 or yr6 residential trips. He has emotional, social & behaviour problems and residentials would be a disaster (they would send him home within hours for violating the behaviour codes & we would be out of pocket to the tune of £££).

Whereas I can handle him in spite all his many terrific difficulties so I can take him somewhere for outdoor & cultural activities where he gets something out of the outings. Guess which situation is harder to get authorised absence for?

I think there's something very loony about English primary school education that it teaches something once and exactly only once ever in the curriculum. This lack of flexibility & revisiting topics sounds very daft & rather unproductive.

Bunbaker · 17/02/2014 19:05

"I think there's something very loony about English primary school education that it teaches something once and exactly only once ever in the curriculum. This lack of flexibility & revisiting topics sounds very daft & rather unproductive."

Have you thought about home educating?

lljkk · 17/02/2014 19:11

It would kill me BB, but I increasingly understand the appeal!! Grin

lljkk · 17/02/2014 19:12

ps: I also don't believe a word of it. I've been into help in class loads & it's obvious that they re-visit lots of material that has been previously covered. Just like my education went. Maybe it's different at GCSE or A-level when they have so much material to cover at speed. I'm waiting to see...

clary · 17/02/2014 19:18

Yes you are being unreasonable. For the reasons others say.

I really wonder if parents have any conception how disruptive it is to their child's education if they are not in the class. I teach a student who missed the first 2 weeks of his first term at secondary. My subject was totally new to him. I honestly don't feel he has caught up now, though I have done my best to help him.

All the class/year will bond together, try different activities, work on their social and team-building skills, perhaps do activities based on the trip when they get back, get out of their comfort zones, have issues and sort them out... none of that is going to happen if you take your DCs to Spain for a week in June, sorry.

clary · 17/02/2014 19:19

Yes lljkk we do revisit material. If I didn't keep reminding my students how to say "he is" in German none of them would remember! But it really does help if you were there the first day we learned it (or so it seems to me...)

BoneyBackJefferson · 17/02/2014 19:44

Educational trip to Thorpe park workshops etc.

mindthegap01 · 17/02/2014 19:45

What clary said. I'm a teacher too - of course we revisit material, fgs.

And I've taken Y6 on residential every year for the past 7. Being away from home and family fosters an extremely valuable independence which you by definition cannot possibly achieve through a family holiday.

And yes, I love spending the entire year up until May (alongside teaching full time) filling in risk assessments, spending my Saturdays driving 100s of miles to do reccies, haggling endlessly to negotiate the cheapest price I can possibly get for parents, most of whom don't even bother to thank the staff afterwards, etc. Oh, and then being away from my own family for a week whilst being responsible for 30 other people's children 24/7.

A bit of an exaggeration - I love my job and Y6 camp is great, but it really bugs me when teachers get criticised for organising residential trips in term time. Should we do them in our own holidays?

lljkk · 17/02/2014 20:04

I don't think anyone rational resents term time residentials. I am grateful for the good experiences other DC have had on them even it they are a pointless offering to DC3. It's the problem of term time absence that can't possibly be seen as being just as educational. I know that dictat came down from central government, doesn't mean I can't moan at the absurdity of it. Not having a go at schools, they don't have a choice either. (frowny smile I'm not allowed)

lljkk · 17/02/2014 20:07

ps: I'll let you know what school does with DS for the non-residentials. I had impression in the past that the kids basically did some light revision of previous material during yr5 (colouring & worksheets), and that the yr6s get to play with the yr1s & yr2s. Nothing special.

Original poster
shebird · 17/02/2014 20:19

I applaud teachers that make the effort for these trips but I certainly don't expect it and don't think schools should be responsible for every aspect of my child's life. I resent the fact the the government thinks I am not capable of deciding what to feed my children or make decisions for their well being. The burden in schools to be both educators and parents is just too much.

OP posts:
WeAreDetective · 17/02/2014 20:21

Not the teacher's fault though... Nothing to do with the residentials they run and their timing.

thenamestheyareachanging · 17/02/2014 22:49

YANBU to suggest that your trip away could have more educational value than a week spent in school, just as the school trip away could. But don't expect most people here to agree!

deakymom · 17/02/2014 22:58

well i cant afford to send my child and i don't see why she should be merged with lower groups and spend her time working as an unpaid TA which is exactly what happened the last time

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 17/02/2014 23:30

You would not be unreasonable to clarify what the plans are for those that don't go.

mindthegap01 · 18/02/2014 11:08

Also you should speak to the school about a hardship fund. Pupil premium is often used to subsidise costs, but there are also grants available for those not eligible for PP. We have charities that we put families in touch with who will often pay 50%. The charity meets with staff to confirm that it's a genuine case.

MrsAMerrick · 18/02/2014 11:22

YABU to suggest tgat taking children out of school fof a famiky holidat is the same as a weeks residential school trip.

YANBU to question how much teaching they get if they dont go innthe school trip. ime, schools ensure that no child us unable to take up a place because of a lack of funds. If there is a whole class trip, the whole class ought to go.

BoneyBackJefferson · 18/02/2014 11:31

MrsAMerrick you are making the assumption that all parents want their children to go on the residential trips.

I can't take a child out without the parents permission.

Abbierhodes · 18/02/2014 11:37

As a teacher, I'm not keen on the holiday fines either. I didn't choose to put them there, and if I found myself on a different half term to my kids, I'd be more stuck than non-teacher parents as I don't choose my holidays, so I'd want to take my kids out of school too. I see the importance of good attendance, but I feel there are occasional exceptions.

However, I do like arranging trips for my students. I remember going on residentials with my friends at school and making some fabulous memories. Seeing young people bond with friends, learn new skills and develop their confidence through having new experiences away from their parents is amazing. Family holidays are valuable, I'll wholeheartedly agree with that, but so are school trips, in a different way.

I understand your annoyance, OP, but please don't be angry at the school. We are trying our best, under leadership which is, at the moment, quite ridiculous.

lljkk · 18/02/2014 11:40

Reasons that have nothing to do with cost why not to send a child on a residential:

  1. Child cannot abide by the behaviour code;
  2. Child tried residential before & was miserable with homesickness or another emotional issue;
  3. Social issues like isolation or Bullying (other kids or adults);
  4. Sometimes specific medical needs;
  5. Clash with other commitments, perhaps training for a specific sports event or rehearsals or family visits, etc.
  6. Other emotional issues

Must be more.

Oh well, DS will endure colouring in & enjoy playing with little kids even if the other parents might complain because he's seen as a bullying hazard.

Lambsie · 18/02/2014 12:00

My son won't be going on school residentials as his severe sn won't be catered for. We will be asking on the grounds of reasonable adjustment that we take him somewhere suitable ourselves. This will be better for him than being left in school with a ta he doesn't know.

WorrySighWorrySigh · 18/02/2014 12:07

YANBU

Having been through all of this three times I can honestly say that whole 'life skills' thing is utter rubbish.

Some will enjoy it, some wont.

And no, they dont remember it.

It is a waste of money and I think that it is a disgrace that schools effectively force parents to send their DCs on such expensive trips.

mummymeister · 18/02/2014 12:55

I never went on a school trip. my senior school went away for either a long weekend or week every single year and I never went on one of them. I was stuck in school "helping out", tidying cupboards, cleaning the art room and other general dogsbody type tasks. it was bloody miserable. when they all came back it was all everyone talked about. "do you remember that time when..." etc. so yes, I remember school trips really well but they aren't happy memories at all. parents feel peer pressure to let their kids go when they really cant afford it. family holidays make just as many memories only of course there are no free places for teachers on these. I know a lot of teachers put in many hours to organise this. I just think personally there are better things they could do with their time. the skiing trip this year had 30 kids on it. the other 60 stayed at home.

5Foot5 · 18/02/2014 13:35

*Some will enjoy it, some wont.

And no, they dont remember it.*

Well the first statement is quite probably true but I would challenge the second.

DD went on a residential in Y6 and had a marvellous time. They did loads of activities - including building rafts which actually sounded like an absolute riot.

She is 18 now and still remembers it very fondly indeed.

I sympathise with anyone who finds the expense a stretch. With DDs school the trip didn't take place until July but we were told all the details the previous September so people could send in the money in installments throughout the year if that helped. In fact it was very reasonable for what they were getting.

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