To be pissed off about the so called healthy eating advice we've been given for years ?

[Scarletohello]

I did the Atkins diet about 8 years ago when it was considered faddy and dangerous. Low fat was the healthy way to go. I got so much hostility about it, almost like I was a climate change denier. To my surprise,I lost 2 stone easily and quickly. Unfortunately I got scared by all the health warnings about how bad it was for you so eventually went back to a ' normal' diet. And put it all on again. Am currently watching the C4 doc about how sugar is bad for you. Of course it bloody is !!

Why can't the authorities wake up and realise its not fat that makes you fat? It's sugar and fast acting carbs.

It's time we had a major overhaul in our thinking about what really makes us fat...

And the debate rages on!

Just watching Baggy Bodies on C4. Now that's an incentive to lose weight. Those poor sods. Lose a person in weight but are left with the most hideous saggy flesh...

So what do you 'know' then billy

Enlighten us poor misinformed souls? Come on...let's hear it

Blimey op, you're on a roll tonight! Had no idea some of these programmes existed

For some people the whole "just eat less", "calories in=calorie out" etc etc just does not work. Not every body is the same, not every metabolism is the same, and some people seem to be more sensitive to carbs, sugar etc.

Personally, I tested this for me. I'd been dieting for months, logging every damn mouthful religiously, weighing everything. I was absolutely meticulous. And it was a pretty substantial calorie reduction. Nothing. Lost an initial few pounds in week one then nada.

I did some research and when I read up on insulin resistance it kind of clicked with me. So I thought OK, I will try low carb but I will keep my calorie intake exactly the same - which I did. My weight start dropping, and apart from a brief stall it kept dropping. I looked better, felt better, etc etc etc. For my body it is pretty clear to me that not all calories are equal.

I didn't used to be like this - something changed in my body and how it reacts to food. When I was pregnant with my DD I was extremely sick, and the only food I could keep down (once they managed to stop me actually vomiting) was highly processed shite. Super noodles were a food group :) and I wonder if this period of eating such a "bad" carb heavy diet cause some sort of shift. I don't know. But I can't lose weight on low fat, low carb diets.

For me it's fat, I love cheeses and dairy.

For hubby it's simple carbs and sugars, which is a bummer as he's diabetic.

Don't assume that we all share the same problems as you'd be wrong.

I had an unexpected side effect of cutting out wheat and sugar to lose weight. My asthma and allergies all but disappeared. If I cave and eat sweets/ bread/ whatever - I am wheezy in an hour.

I've had severe asthma all my life. The received wisdom of low fat-high carb was making me ill, and also fat.

Going low-carb has changed my life, and I'm not even talking weight loss - I lost 6 stone by basically calorie counting, and had some of the worst asthma attacks during that time. Also made myself anaemic and generally ill. Low-carbing (to lose the 2 stone that I put on through long term steroids) means I don't need those steroids in the first place!

I was always told losing weight would stop the asthma and snoring etc. Didn't make a gnats fart of difference. Ditching wheat, grains and sugar has changed everything. No more random excema/ hive attacks either!

I know not everybody is wheat intolerant, but it has made such a difference to me!

BTW, I don't replace the bread/ pasta with anything, nor the sugar. I don't really miss it any more.

YANBU.

The nhs nutritionists still plug low fat, high carb crap too. In fact, the NHS is so far behind on this I doubt they even read the studies.

I do think very low carb is a bad idea though - I think the evidence will mount against that. It's a huge strain on your body, even if you do lose weight.

My money is on an American guy called paul jaminet who spent 5 years reviewing all the evidence to decide for himself what to eat. I pretty much trust him and few others.he is basically moderate good fats, moderate protein and moderate "safe" carbs.

I know that I can get it wrong along with anyone else and there are experts out there who have actual qualifications.

I also know there is a lot of fat in cheese and a lot of calories in a small amount and that plenty of people could eat a lot of it in one go.

Hmm. I'll agree that sugar (as in refined sucrose/fructose) is nutritionally empty and we don't need it at all.

But to any low carbers eating dairy products and saying it's how we "evolved" to eat - we're the only species that drinks milk into adulthood. Milk, what's more, from a species other than our own. I don't think evolution has much to do with that.

I try to stick to what that bloke said (can't remember his name now): eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants.

Well those experts aren't doing a great job, as we are finding out. Hence a new way of thinking.

And depends which cheese really. Little and often and you lose the hunger pangs.

With Low carb eating you are actually supposed to limit the dairy anyway as can inhibit some peoples weight loss... Others are fine

Statisticallychallenged, I agree with you. We are all different. One person can eat in a certain way and be slim, whereas another will be overweight. My brother and I grew up eating the same food, same portions, but he liked the unhealthier stuff more! He was, and is, rail thin, and I am, and always have been, overweight.

I have also spent years trying to lose weight, even under the care of NHS dieticians, and it is incredibly hard. I also have realised I am insulin resistant and now eat only small amounts of complex carbs alongside a moderate diet, and do loads of exercise, and weight is finally coming off very slowly.

Threads like this, when people reckon it's very simple to just eat less and move more, and make generalisations about how fat people eat, are very frustrating. I sit regularly surrounded by slimmer friends turning down the cake they are all eating.

My son came home with a Change4life leaflet today.
The misinformation in there (from the NHS) is terrible.

They recommend "smart swaps" such as full sugar fizzy drinks to diet fuzzy drinks (should be recommending no fizzy drinks at all surely?)
Butter for low fat spread
Cheese for reduced fat cheese
Full fat milk for semi and even skimmed milk (evidence shows that skimmed milk causes higher weight gain, due to higher percentage of lactose than found in full fat)

The older I get, the more distrustful I become of the NHS, more so now that change4life has joined forces with nestle, because they're not doing this out of the goodness of their hearts, this is business, and done to make money - big businesses make more money out of processed food and drugs to counteract their effects.

I have just read a blog on the NHS change4life.... Can't believe they have got away with that unchallenged!!

I think I've read the same blog :)

I suspect the NHS know they have little power against the sugar industry. With a rising obesity crisis the emphasis is going to be on damage limitation....hence the smart swaps.

My DS loves fizzy drinks but thankfully will also drink just water or milk without complaint making it easy for me.

I think if you have a population who drink fizzy dribks and are overweight then a start is by swapping to diet fizz.

A friend of mine had a terrible full sugar fizzy drinks habit. She dropped 4 stones in a year just by swapping to the diet version (wbich gives you an idea of how much of the stuff she drinks).

Agreed, Jake.

One thing I've noticed about low carb diets and books/websites about them is that they are always backed up with evidence, some of it decades old, and links to said evidence.

The websites of people against low carbing don't tend to have evidence to back them up, and also seem to make hysterical claims like "it's bad to cut out a whole food group" even though carbs aren't cut out at all, and "it's just another faddy diet", when actually, IMO it's less faddy as you eat far less processed, sugary crap, and can't actually back up what they're saying.

I have some old cookbooks. That sounds an odd thing to say on this thread, but it's informative, in that they give amounts to feed people.

So a man would get 6 oz of meat , a woman or child's 4. Lots of carbs only if you do a labouring or manual type job. Veg yes and fruit, to get the bowels going and vitamins. Milk for children but not most adults save in tea or on porridge.

Cheese is an alternative to meat, but less of it.

It's actually v sensible. And st these amounts most people were doing more exercise and didn't have central heating.

Think now of the huge steaks. Our ancestors ate Dar far less.

I see what you mean jake, but they're promoting foods that arguably have contributed to the obesity epidemic in the first place.

I grew up on low fat processed crap, diet drinks, etc, and no surprises I was very overweight as a child (and still am).

Guidelines need to change to information that is actually correct, rather than information fed from skewed research.
Change4life leaflets should never advise low sugar fizz, they should be advising water, the NHS of all organisations should not be giving in to the sugar industry, particularly when the results (obesity, higher rates of diabetes, higher risk pregnancies etc) are damaging the NHS as a system.

The NHS of all organisations should be reviewing their healthy eating policies all the time, instead of still churning out the outdated claptrap that they've had printed on millions of leaflets to give to millions of children.

That change4life leaflet is the same crap given out by the nhs nutritionists.

As I can't quite believe the nhs is that corrupt I can only conclude they are totally incompetent.

It's depressing to be honest because these are the meal plans rolled out in nurseries/schools etc. my nursery was extolling the virtues of sugar free jelly the other day. I nearly wept.

But if I try to suggest alternatives then I'm going against "official advice"

Recommended reading that explains it all - Felicity Lawrence's Eat Your Heart Out. She writes a regular Guardian column, this book goes into more depth about the structure of the food industries. eg that four foods make up most processed food whether you can taste it or not - and how everything is getting sweeter.

It should make you angry, and be prepared to change your buying habits which will change your eating habits, for the infinitely better.

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And yes what Fish+Jam said - eat food, not too much, mostly plants. Seven words to change the world. Michael Pollan, 'Unhappy Meals', whole article in New York Times

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SidandAndyssextoy how did you found out about your insulin resistancy? I've been asking gp's about the relevant blood test but get told repeatedly that they don't do it.

When the message to eat less fat came in, there was an explosion in low fat and lite foods available, but basically they are foods that had fat removed and sugar and artificial crap added.

I was reading the other day that one brand of low fat mayonnaise is vegan..that's right no eggs, no dairy in mayonnaise! It's main ingredients - sugar, water, artificial favours....yuck!

Eating less processed foods and foods with added sugar is not a fad, it's just sensible. We certainly try to buy "one ingredient" foods - fruit, veggies, rice, meat, eggs, nuts, milk. We buy about 5% processed foods. I'm not cutting out any food groups unless starch, sugar and colours are a food group.

Carbs....unless you want to cut out vegetables you can not avoid carbs! I do go for grainy bread, basmati rice and sweet potato instead of white bread/rice/potato but that's the extent of my limiting carbs.

Pp - insulin resistance. I actually read interesting research on how insulin imbalance is linked to polycystic ovaries and hormonal imbalance as well as weight gain. It's another reason to give low GI a go.