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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

and possibly unlawful with this plan?

53 replies

ErsonOfPinterest · 08/01/2014 23:22

long story short (and n/ced as worried about outing myself)
There's been a series of sex attacks in our area, not word of mouth, police have been knocking on doors warning people. Daytime attacks on people at bus stops. The one where my DD gets the bus. And attacks in the area she does her paperround. Angry The man is quite identifiable so should be easy to spot if he appears. we have been told to dial 999 if we see him.
I want DDto be able to protect herself and her friend that shes always with. I am thinking of getting her a mini spray deodorant to keep in her blazer pocket to spray in an attackers eyes if necessary.
Is this a bad move? Obviously I don't want to advice her to do anything illegal, but want to have a chance in the event of the unthinkable.

OP posts:
softlysoftly · 08/01/2014 23:24

We used to have a mini pen shaped pepper spray as teenagers, highly illegal given by a friends dad. She had to use hers once at night.

Just saying.

Lilacroses · 08/01/2014 23:25

I honestly don't know about the legalities of that but I appreciate your worry absolutely. You must be so on edge. Are the police making sure they have an increased presence at these places for the time being? I would be very unhappy about my Dd doing a paperound in an area where this was occuring.

BunnyLebowski · 08/01/2014 23:26

YANBU.

I used to work in a city centre pub and lock up alone late at night.

After a rape nearby I walked to my car every night for weeks with a steak knife in my pocket.

Legalities, schmegalities.

BrianTheMole · 08/01/2014 23:27

Its not a bad move, but is she really going to get it out and use it if something happens? How old is your dd? What if he just takes it from her? Can she pair up with anyone going to the bus stop? I'd probably walk the paper round with her tbh, unless they can go in pairs and cover two rounds together.

lougle · 08/01/2014 23:27

Tricky. Forethought may get you in trouble, but if she just happened to have it in her pocket....

Also there is 'reasonable force', which I think would be pretty much most things to try and get away from an attacker?

lougle · 08/01/2014 23:29

The police used to give out rape alarms, which are very loud. Could you get her one?

TheCatThatSmiled · 08/01/2014 23:29

It's not illegal to keep a small bottle of spray perfume in your pocket - one of those travel size you can get from boots - like impulse.

It's a bugger if it gets in your eyes. Not as bad as pepper spray, but still ... Just saying.

Original poster
ErsonOfPinterest · 08/01/2014 23:29

She's never alone. Gets the bus to/from school with her friend who is a neighbour. And the paperround she is always accompanied.
I don't know BrianTheMole, maybe she wouldn't be able to? But on the offchance, its there in her pocket with the lid off, might work?

OP posts:
Prettykitty111 · 08/01/2014 23:34

They used to sell a rape alarm which also contained a florescent "skunk spray". The stuff was impossible to wash off skin and also invisibly tagged any clothes for evidence purposes. This is legal to carry and if she gets some in an attackers eyes whilst setting it off then that is surely self defence. I got mine on eBay when I went to Uni. I disagree with rape alarms because people don't test the batteries properly and what use is one if the batteries are dead? Also with the amount of white noise nowadays people might assume it is a car alarm and if stepped on they are easy to shut up.

Dahlen · 08/01/2014 23:35

Most things can be classed as an offensive weapon if the person carrying them admits that their primary purpose is as a weapon.

In the scenario you outline, the chances of your DD being prosecuted for an assault if she sprayed an attacker are minimal, as she could claim self-defence and it is perfectly normal for someone to carry a can of body spray (far harder to explain away a knife). That wouldn't necessarily stop any would-be assailant launching a civil case but you'd probably feel that the risks of that are outweighed by the benefits of giving your DD an 'edge' in the event of an attack.

What might be more beneficial is an attack alarm or something like this www.eightriverssecurity.co.uk/defence_sprays.html along with maybe a one-day course in self-defence, which are really brilliant and teach you how to use many normal every-day-carried-with-you-items and your own body as weapons.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/01/2014 23:44

Get an attack alarm.

What if attacker takes spray off her, and sprays into her eyes...

BrianTheMole · 08/01/2014 23:48

I don't know BrianTheMole, maybe she wouldn't be able to? But on the offchance, its there in her pocket with the lid off, might work?

I don't know, I wouldn't have a problem with giving it to her in terms of what the law thinks, I'd just be worried about him taking it off her and using it back on her, thats all. But it could work, I suspect she would be frozen and may not use it though. A rape alarm might not be a bad idea though, a very very loud one, attached to her wrist.

BrianTheMole · 08/01/2014 23:52

Some sort of self defence course might help as well. Is there any in your area?

cozietoesie · 09/01/2014 00:17

A nice bunch of keys, preferably with some keys for mortice locks. (At least 3 with a good heavy key fob which will sit nicely in the palm of a closed fist.)

anotherrandomusername · 09/01/2014 00:26

You know, it's possible to make it yourself.. not saying you should at all, but it's easy, and could also be an ingredient for home made chilli that you're taking to a friends house...

The only risk with that in this weather is that it blows back, maybe a tricky thing to use in the heat of the moment.

cozietoesie · 09/01/2014 00:56

Her best bet is a self defence course. Most people faced with sudden extreme violence just freeze - they stop thinking altogether because it's so completely outwith their experience. Just becoming accustomed to doing something - anything - if attacked would be worth very much indeed.

Wibblypiglikesbananas · 09/01/2014 01:04

A can of beans in a plastic bag... Perfectly legal but knock an attacker out...

Wibblypiglikesbananas · 09/01/2014 01:06

But could...

NigellasDealer · 09/01/2014 01:08

not even a can of beans is perfectly legal if it is being carried for the purpose of knocking someone out.....

ComposHat · 09/01/2014 01:31

True Nigella, anything can be classed as an offensive weapon if carried by someone with the purpose of using against another person. Likewise it is perfectly legal to have a massive knife/saw in your possession if you have a legitimate reason for having it (say a tradesman)

But I think the point Wibbly is making is that easier to explain away a can of beans than a knife, hammer or mace-type sprays should she get stopped by a police. Even so I wouldn't risk it, in a worse case scenario, any weapon could be easily taken off her and used against her and she is running the risk of prosecution/trouble at school.

Another vote for an attack alarm and common sense.

NatashaBee · 09/01/2014 01:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Tulip26 · 09/01/2014 01:38

The problem with attack alarms is if there's nobody around to hear it. It's usually no louder than a scream and they are often ignored. That's IF she can get to it and IF it doesn't panic the attacker and make him do something stupid. I'd go for the pepper sprqy or the keys. Don''t let her go out alone, even for a pint of milk. Is there any chance she can borrow a dog from a friend or neighbour to walk when she does her paper round? Preferably a large dog but anything is better than nothing.

ComposHat · 09/01/2014 01:49

Tulip Pepper spray in my opinion is REALLY bad advice.

There will be an increased Police presence in the area and there is no way she will be able to explain it away if she's stopped

Given that for it to be effective, it will have to be easily accessible, it could also be lost/dropped/nicked at school or some dickhead could decide to spray their mate for a laugh.

Any of these far from implausible situations occur and she's looking at exclusion for bringing illegal pepper spray into school, plus the possibility of them calling the Police.

trufflesnuffler · 09/01/2014 02:55

legal defence sprays here www.siffknives.co.uk/eng/sub_reparto.php?Main=236

ComposHat · 09/01/2014 03:06

I would be amazed if they actually are 'legal' for the reasons described up thread.

If you carry something with absolutely no legitimate use and are stopped by the Police, it will be classed as an offensive weapon. What possible legitimate reason could the girl offer for possessing pepper spray? It has no legitimate purpose other than as a weapon, whether wielded in self defence or not.

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