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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that dd should have been a priority case?

178 replies

Edenviolet · 30/12/2013 22:41

Dd2 has type 1 diabetes.

Last night she had a series of hypos which we treated and then another which would not respond to treatment. Her eyes were rolling and she was not fully conscious. We phoned 999 and thought they would come quickly.

We had to wait an hour and in that time phoned them back twice as she was so unwell. It was terrifying. We thought they would prioritise her or send a rapid response paramedic (the ones in a car not ambulance) but nothing. We were told they didn't know when somebody would be available.

When they finally came they took dd to hospital and she is now fine but when dh was there another child had just been taken in from an ambulance with earache, apparently the drs were not too happy and made this child go with his parents to wait in the waiting area but it mad me wonder how efficiently 999 calls are being prioritised.

I want to complain but I don't know who to contact. I am just so shaken up as took it for granted they'd arrive within minutes.

OP posts:
Misspixietrix · 30/12/2013 23:58

Iaminvisible! I always try and see GP first with DD if its not OOH. I didn't think I would ever agree to a suggestion of paying for treatment but the 'being charged for proof of wasting nhs time' is a good idea.

ohfourfoxache · 31/12/2013 00:00

Christ that's scary - dreadful waste of resources.

Sunshine that sounds bloody awful Sad -I'm so sorry you and DH went through that.

I wish people knew how much care costs, and what is involved in trying to provide seamless care. In my last department each missed appointment cost between £110 and £170, depending on if it was a new or follow up. Roughly 10% of appointments were DNA'd (did not arrive, I.e. Missed). That is a shitload of time money and effort wasted Sad

Wantsunshine · 31/12/2013 00:00

Love the idea of charging for time wasters though

ohfourfoxache · 31/12/2013 00:01

Cupoftea that is devastating Sad

RestingActress · 31/12/2013 00:01

Sadly complaints to NHS / ambulance / MP can't solve much.

The problem is with the time-wasters who see an ambulance as a quicker way of getting treated (it's not) or won't pay for a taxi.

Bogeyface · 31/12/2013 00:05

If a doctor says "This person should not have called 999, they have a cold/sprained ankle/hypochondria" then slapping a £100 charge onto them (that should be sanctioned by the government so like a police fine or council tax is non negotiable) would have stupid selfish calls cut within a year.

There is still the idea that 999 means you jump the queue, not so and this would get that message across. And of course the DM and the Sun would love it as they would have lots of "sad face" photos!

ohfourfoxache · 31/12/2013 00:08

They can do resting, but it depends on how willing people are to push forward insisting on changes happening.

It is slow progress, and things don't change overnight, but when the shit hits the fan something has to change. I've moved into this area of the NHS in the last few months and some trusts do take complaints and serious incidents, we'll, seriously.

Op it may well be that this complaint constitutes a serious incident or SI - in which case it should be reported to NHS England and the findings be taken to the board. Please complain and make as much noise as you can until someone takes notice

Misspixietrix · 31/12/2013 00:11

ohfourfoxache I don't know about A & E costs but DM recently spent almost a month in ICU. Apparently it's a £1,000 a night just to keep one patient there and thats before they start giving meds etc. The ex always says we should be grateful too (from overseas). His exact words "you'd be looking for money before they even agree to look at your DM/DC/DH etc". Think that's what makes people hesitant to complain. The NHS and the ambulance crews etc might not be perfect but at least we have them for free and don't need to worry about how we are going to pay the hospital bill. If you could prove someone was definetely time wasting. Then yes. An NHS fine of some sort may be a good deterrent.

FrankAndFurt · 31/12/2013 00:13

I think it was on one of the '999' shows where the dispatchers discussed the fact that some pregnant women in their area either lie about their situation or leave it until the very last moment so that they can call an ambulance rather than have to pay for a Doctor. Confused

tipp2chicago · 31/12/2013 00:21

I'm in Ireland and one of DH's friends is a paramedic. The recent stories I have heard from him are:

People calling 999 because they're hungry and they want a pizza delivered
Because they wanted to attack the ambulance (really shitty area but they can't refuse to go)
Picking up "frequent flyers" eg habitual drunks/heroin abusers etc
Having to defend himself from someone who was having a psychotic incident as a result of drug use

This doesn't account for emergencies such as
Very quick labour
Car accidents (including one where a toddler was killed but the mother survived - hit by a drink driver)
Assorted heart attacks and other critical incidents

I really have difficulty understanding why paramedics make barely more than minimum wage.

halestone · 31/12/2013 00:24

I think this would make an excellent Mumsnet campaign. Charging NHS timewasters, particularly those who use an ambulance with no need. Maybe if an organisation this big showed that it users thought it was acceptable then fines for ambulance misuse would become common practice.

OP i hope your DD is feeling better soon.

ohfourfoxache · 31/12/2013 00:25

Fining would definitely help, but it's patient's reluctance to complain that actually hinders change. No one has to be nasty about it, there is a way of doing it, but safety and clinical needs have to be addressed.

I went in for a back op a couple of years ago and the nurse tried to clerk me using my aunt's notes (we were in day surgery together in bays next to each other). I explained to her -twice- that they were not my notes. She wandered off, twice, only to come back again with the same notes and continue to try to clerk me. Did I complain? Yes I fucking did! Because I was relatively with it and not exactly a vulnerable patient.

What would happen if she tried to do that with a patient with, for example, dementia? And, worst case scenario, the patient had wrong surgery or a wrong drug?

It turned out that she was an agency nurse who did outpatients, she had never done wards or surgery and she basically didn't know what she was doing.

So yes, complaining might be counter intuitive, and realistically an awful lot of complaints come through from patients with a massive sense of entitlement, but if something is truly wrong then please don't be afraid to speak up.

ohfourfoxache · 31/12/2013 00:26

Halestone that's a wonderful idea x

OxyMoron · 31/12/2013 00:27

OP, so sorry you went through this with your DD. Serious hypoglycaemia is a medical emergency and an ambulance should have been with you within minutes.

On a practical note, have you been prescribed a glucagon kit for her (trade name Glucagen). It's an injection kit of the hormone glucagon that triggers the liver to release its glycogen stores to boost blood glucose. If you need more info just say and I can post some links for you.

Bogeyface · 31/12/2013 00:29

If every MP had to spend 6 months working as part of the ambulance crews before they got to Westminister then they would be on £50 an hour!

thankfeckitschrismas · 31/12/2013 00:37

Op when did you complete your medical training?

You overheard the whole of the kid with earache medical history???
Everyone is okay and you should be thankful for that.

Tigerbomb · 31/12/2013 00:41

Unfortunately I have been blue lighted to A&E a few times. I've been in resus more than once. Each time I have not wanted to call an ambulance as I have been convinced it's not urgent (heart attacks/asthma !) If it had been left to me I wouldn't have called them ( I thought I had indigestion) and I especially wouldn't have called them if I thought there was a chance I might have got fined.

A lot of old people wont call an ambulance as they think they are wasting the ambulances time - the worry of maybe receiving a fine would deter some people who really do need one

Tigerbomb · 31/12/2013 00:42

oh and I meant to say that I am glad your daughter is ok now op - I am sure it was very scary for you all

DoYouLikeMyBaubles · 31/12/2013 00:42

I'm glad she's okay now.

There's a book called Journal of a Paramedic or something like that. It's an eye opening read to the frustrations of ambulance staff. I bet they were fuming over the ear ache.

giraffesCantSledge · 31/12/2013 00:46

YANBU at all, hope dd ok now

Wantsunshine · 31/12/2013 00:49

Tiger you are right older people tend not to want to call 999 even when they should. How are there so many stupid people calling them for pizza. Argggg

ArtexTheHallWithBoughsOfMonkey · 31/12/2013 00:49

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ShinyBlackNose · 31/12/2013 00:52

Recently there was a motorcyclist involved in a collision in a tunnel in London. He had possible life changing / possible spinal injuries. The ambulance response time was given as an hour and the police were asked if they could transport him in the back of a van. The police refused.

I think that we have a lot to worry about with the future of the ambulance service. (None of which is the fault of the call handlers or paramedics.)

ShinyBlackNose · 31/12/2013 00:54

Should add the police were right to refuse. They were in no way trained or equipped to transport a seriously injured patient.

Gigondas · 31/12/2013 01:00

Artex I think treatment isn't free to non residents tho I think you are treated if you go into a and e as an emergency. Hence the idea if waiting to go into labour as get treated as an emergency . Am sure someone more knowledgeable will be along to tell me if this is true .

On the fines for inappropriate use, there was something on news about how fire service are going to charge businesses after 10 false alarm call outs. However I can see how it is easy to say you called us out when there is no fire etc. You could have issue with bad a and e calls of people who genuinely didn't know/lie about symptoms and call an ambulance to be safe .

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