to hate it when famous people die

[2rebecca]

OK I'm in for a flaming, but I'm in my late 40s, I lived through the ANC/apartheid/ "free Nelson Mandela"avoiding S African fruit in supermarkets/ being delighted when he was released and became an excellent president, sad when his successor was an HIV denying plonker,and the fact that S Africa is developing corruption levels like the rest of Africa and still has a huge violence problem (mainly black on black), but find the wall to wall media coverage completely OTT.
Obituaries are interesting when they are brief and concern someone whose story you don't know. When they are endless and cover someone whose story has been extensively documented it just makes me avoid the media.
It's nothing against Nelson, when the queen dies it will be even worse , and every time a media luvvie dies the media goes into overdrive.
All I needed to hear today was "Nelson Mandela has died", not everyone and their dog repeating stuff I've heard before, especially as I heard it last night anyway.
Someone famous dying is news, endless anecdotes and preprepared staements aren't news.

tinmug, I know about Sharpville, Steve Biko, the Pass Laws, segregation - those awful burning 'necklace' deaths that no-one has mentioned that I've seen. The buses - I don't know what the pencil test in the hair is though - can you tell me?

I'm in my late 40's and remember well the day he was released, extraordinary man.

I guess the resistance in occupied France/Poland etc where also terrorists

They were white. Big difference. Huge.

Harticus exactly right. People normally quote Gandhi and say look what he achieved through non violence, but it's not necessarily true. These people were seriously oppressed, in ways that we can't imagine in this country. Unless you have walked a mile in those peoples shoes, you cannot say what you would resort to.

Watch news at 10 now and tell me you can't understand.

The pencil test was where you put a pencil in the hair to test the curliness i.e. how "afro"-like was it. People could have their colour re-classified based on the result.

I don't know what the pencil test in the hair is though - can you tell me?

Here you go. Try not to be sick in your mouth.

Separate buses - did you know about that? Blue buses for white people, green buses for black people. Separate benches at bus stops - did you know about that? SLEGS BLANKES written on our benches. WHITES ONLY.

He didn't always go about it in the right way though.

Ok, so what would you have done differently in his shoes?

Of course his death wasn't a shock.

But this man was an inspiration for millions. He brought the truth and reconciliation programme in SA which was an unbelievable achievement.

Seeing how he affected hardened
journalists like John Simpson speaks volumes.

I'm not a political person and am white middle class English but I am moved by his life and death.

His antics .

am I on Nethuns

He didn't always go about it in the right way though.

What alternative methods do you suggest which would have worked better at achieving all he has?

FFS - some of you are a bloody disgrace. IRA my bloody foot !! And as for the use of the word 'famous' to describe him! You ought to be bloody ashamed of yourselves(

THIS!!!!!

Some of the views here are so depressing "oh it bores me, hope it dies down soon"...god some people !!!! Its news thats all, and of course the media are going to report it, simple solution - dont watch.

snap - tinmug

But honestly guys, this situation was NOT EASY! There were no easy, trite, simple solutions. He couldn't just write to his MP, and the MP would look and say "well, hey jiggery, silly old me, you're right, you should all have the vote".

tinmug I certainly wouldn't have killed anyone.

But you are right , that he probably felt (at the time) that he had little choice perhaps?

I don't disagree with any of your posts today, I don't disagree he was right to fight for black South Africans.

I don't agree with the way many people are educated about him though.

He couldn't just write to his MP, and the MP would look and say "well, hey jiggery, silly old me, you're right, you should all have the vote".

Jesus Christ why don't people fucking understand this.

When people say "They should have negotiated!" - WITH WHO? WITH WHO? Government representatives? Who addressed all black people as "boy"? Fucking... yeah.

Uppity bloody wogs, eh? Always making a fuss about nothing.

Felt he had little choice? What other choices are you suggesting were available?

I am not saying I condone violence. I abhor violence of any kind. But sometimes the "eye for an eye" thing sadly is reality, as we humans are not perfect.

Do you think it was wrong to kill Germans to topple Hitler?

I'm in my 40s as well and I think YABVU. He was a great man. To do what he did after spending 27 years in prison is incredible, particularly as he was in his 70s when he was released. If you don't want to hear about him, switch channels. I think some people on this thread should listen/read about him though as they are clearly very ignorant.

Feminine whilst you are formulating your ideas as to how you would have brought an end to apartheid differently, perhaps you could also turn your genius to the issue of FW de Klerk and the controversy surrounding the hit squad headed by Eugene de Kock and the murder in their beds of 5 black teenagers in 1993.

As you are such an authority on the socio-political situation in SA you are bound to have some fascinating insights.

Yes, NM was seen as a "terrorist" in the old South Africa, he orchestrated attacks against the apartheid government, but his legacy should be one of forgiveness, redemption, reconciliation and peace
People should see who he was before he was imprisioned and then who he was after he was released, the change in his attitude, demeanor, and his ability to forgive and be forgiven.

My biggest hope that now that he has passed away a massive spotlight will be turned onto the ANC and Zuma will be held accountable for driving the nation into the ground!! pigs could fly and all that jazz

I don't see it as sad when someone lives a long life and then dies, but then, my child died. I hope he is reunited with his children and granddaughter who preceded him in death and past his pain.

But I don't find it shocking, tragic or sad.

The endless celeb comments on it are annoying.

Good to see the spirit of Margaret Thatcher living on.

*Feminie" 'I'd choose my Grandmother. A woman taken from her home during WW2, placed in a camp -then suffering terribly for the rest of her nervous, worried ruined life!

Do you really think your grandmother would want her life put up against someone else's and judged?

Awful post!

caterpilla I don't agree with violence in any form.

I see you are saying the same.

Man constantly makes dreadful mistakes. As I said earlier, I've personal experience in my own family of people left wounded by vile acts.

One member was beaten brutally/imprisoned for his supposed political beliefs.

I'd like to think I'm not basing my opinions today on thin air.

I think it is sad, in this case, because sadly I think his presence on this earth was one of the few things still holding South African society together. It remains a deeply troubled country.

Otherwise though, yes, expat, 95 years is more than anyone can ask for.

complex thank you for marking my post.

I actually don't understand your point?

You asked me for a hero, I thought about it and decided upon my Grandmother.

A woman who suffered dreadfully and continued to do so after her homecoming

No, his death is not 'tragic' - a long and v full life come to a close at home and with his family.

Yes, his significance cannot be overestimated.

No, he was not a saint. He had the insight to know and publicly state he was not a saint.

So yes, the public saintification of the man and the blanket TV/news coverage is becoming a bit much. As for slebs' comments...

Forgiveness, inclusiveness and reconciliation - this thread could do with a bit of those.