to think children don't really care about 'work ethics' and would prefer to have a SAHP?

[Mingnion]

Well aware I'm probably going to get mightily flamed for this but here goes...

I have a 6.5 year old and an 18 month old. My husband that supported us sadly died last year and I plan to stay at home and on benefits until my youngest is at school. I have a degree from Cambridge and will put in what I take out a hundred times over in the future no doubt. We do not have a lavish lifestyle but my children are adequately fed, dressed and are very happy which is more important IMO. Six months ago I found a part-time job and the impact on my children was massive. They were miserable at having to go to nursery and after school clubs and I was miserable as I missed them. Now they are inexplicably happy. I know it is a common opinion that single parents must work so as to teach their children about work ethics but realistically, do you really think children will care? I'd say most children would much rather have a SAHP and in retrospect I'd have preferred my mum to have been home so her work ethics obviously didn't rub off on me. AIBU to think this way and plan to stay at home with my children until my youngest is school age?

So sorry to hear about your husband.

I think you are fine to do what seems right for you.

Does depend on all of the circumstances - what you need financially, your own needs etc as well as children's. They are probably happier with a happy Mummy and if being at work made you miserable too they might have felt this (although obviously that's no reason not to do it if you need to!).

If you can cope financially you are fine, but try not to stray over into judging others who have made different choices - these will be for good reasons too!

I will clarify though - whilst we are not well off I do some work at home and H earns enough to support us, we are not on benefit...just in case someone fancied having a punt at me for being at home when I have older children.

bababababoom I was thinking that too. I have one DD and I do work but childcare for just two days per week is £90 and that's cheap in London. I think £350 per month is very low compared to what most people pay.

motherinferior - would you be as happy if you were doing a career you hated though? I envy people who ended up in the right career

bababa sorry if I sounded a bit 'off'

I was lucky to have a family member very happy to look after my brood when I went back to work PT. I now have a situation where myself and a friend work different days, so in the holidays we can cover each other.

When mine were pre-school age it wouldn't have been worth paying for child care. I also have to admit, I may not have felt so guilt-free going off to work when mine were still toddlers if they hadn't been being left with an adoring granny .

I do completely agree that children are best off with a happy and fulfilled parent, and that apart from work ethic, setting an example that we look after our needs too is v important for the children. And some children do love childcare environments.

BlueSky: hmm, no - but I do wish my mother had stuck to her guns and got my father to do his share of the childcare and/or sorted out paid childcare and taken up the sort of work that she only took to in her 50s - and with which now, in her late 70s, she is extremely eminent. At my age, my mother was a miserable teacher. She's now someone who wins awards for her translation and editing work. It would have made her - and us, I can assure you - far happier, and given us a much more positive picture of motherhood - if she had gone down that route earlier.

BlueSky

To be honest, I actually hate my job at the moment - used to love it up until about 2 years ago, hence carrying on working, but hate it now!
Unfortunately, I am in a pension trap at the mo - I only have 3 years to go until I qualify for an immediate pension and payout (am in the forces), so have to keep ploughing on until then or the last 19 years will have been a waste of time.

I have no idea what I'm going to do when I leave, I'll need to do something for my own sanity but I have no clue what.

There are so many variables in our children, and in life - I do admit I get a bit defensive when I see some of the old lines trotted out about stuffing children in care, don't have them if you don't want to spend every moment with them etc; not because I regret for a moment what I chose to do, but there is always that niggle at the back of your mind as a mum as to whether you cocked up somewhere along the way.

Ah, I missed the bit about benefits. Not to derail, but why do you need benefits, OP? Did you not have the mortgage paid off when your DH died and did he not have work or other life insurance? Sorry if life insurance was not an option because, say, your DH had a long term illness. Personally, I would not be happy to rely on benefits knowing that I am in the fortunate position (and you should be too with your privileged education ) to be able to work if I need to, and having insurance for occasions where I can't. Whatever my DC "preferred" I would not rely on sitting at home on benefits. Having said that, I can understand that a year or so of shock/ bereavement may well have prevented you from engaging in the workplace, but that is not quite the reason you have stated, which is that it is what your DC "prefer. I agree with K8Middleton above on that point really.

In essence: do what you like and don't beat yourself up about it BUT also don't judge other people's choices as deficient just because they differ.

I do think one of the reasons I chose to work is that my Mum was clearly miserable in the end having been a sahm and found it too difficult to get properly back into the work place after so many years away. Times have changed a bit I accept. Also, we need the money, but we wouldn't starve if I didn't go, we'd just have less.

And yes, I am lucky to have a job I enjoy (mostly) - I've told dd that I enjoy my job and am lucky to have an interesting job. She's got a bit on an inkling about being able to/not being able to afford things now since starting school because she came back saying some people couldn't afford to be on the milk list (i.e. have school milk). So I thought I should say to her, yes we are very lucky.

But I still think most of all that we shouldn't judge each other's choices or say either sahm or wohm is "better" for children in general.

(That said I think dd will like me being on maternity leave for a bit!)

YABU to think that your "Cambridge degree" means you'll be a very important person in the future.

YABU to think that children require an on-site parent more than they require food on the table.

Your mothers career sounds really interesting - we grew up in a small community the career choices we were given were limited (to say the least) I under achieved at school and have only realised since being on Mumnet that studying more independantly was an option but at my age I wouldnt have a clue where to start.

I worked when DS1 was small and I had to be practically kicked out of the office at the end of the day - my boss used to say "shouldnt you have gone by now?" I hate to think how I would have been if I had been doing something I was engrossed by.

The "work ethic" argument is dreadful because it confers moral superiority on something that doesn't necessarily have it at all. You can have an excellent work ethic without working at a paid job. You can have a dreadful work ethic (moral code) while raking it in.

PS - I don't really give a f* if you are funded by me, OP - I'm sure you will give back in the long term. I just express reservations on your post because I think working Mums have a hard enough time without being told they've made their children less happy.

I don't think it's unreasonable at all. I have done all variations on work/SAH and if I am honest, being at home works best for the family as a whole - certainly if we can manage financially. I think if you are at home it's important to find fulfilment so you don't get resentful or lose confidence, but parenting is worthwhile and a demanding job, it's not worth less than going out to work. There is no best option for everyone, only the best for you. As for work ethic, I am not sure it is hot from a working parent. I foster and have had many children from varying backgrounds through my house and their work ethic has rarely reflected their parents- it is a whole host of factors, predominantly self confidence and self worth that count, and being at home can be as important in giving these to children as being at work.

As a child I was quite happy to have a working mother (part time til I was 8, then full time). She didn't work massively long hours (nor did my father but she was the main carer, so even if he was around he didn't do active parenting). It took about a week to get used to being latchkey kids and then we rather enjoyed the freedom. And as we hit teenage and could see various friends' mothers being quite frustrated at home I was very happy to have a mother whose interests weren't too closely focused on me.

My dc seem similarly quite happy to have 2 working parents. We're quite lucky that all 3 dc like groups and activities and have mostly been happy about going to after school clubs, holiday clubs etc. Some dc are absolutely fine with being bunged into (hopefully nice, caring, sociable, stimulating) institutions for part of the week.

I think when they are little they care about love, attention, stability, attachment and consistency- whether that comes from a parent, other family member or professional childcare. If they know that mummy or daddy are there all the time that's good. If they know they go to a nice nursery or childminder or granny and mummy or daddy always comes to pick them up at the end of the day that's good also.

As they get older they are definitely concerned with things like - whether their homework is in their school bag, whether you remembered to get the form in on time for the school trip, if they have clean uniform to wear...obviously with a gradual progression to doing those things more for themselves. But they also start to notice the type of things money makes easier, and think about what they want to do/what sort of life they want when they are older, and also whether you as parents are happy and what sort of relationship you have and how healthy and active you are. It's not easy at all, but it's about being good role models and trying to find a balance of all those things.

I never really get the 'funded by me' argument. If I spent too much time worrying about all the things I'm 'funding' that I don't agree with (sending our troops to Iraq, nuclear weapons, bailing out the bankers, etc etc) I would give up and crawl into a hole.

FloozeyLoozey: 'You are setting a bad example to your children by being reliant on the state' - How? They honestly do not care, and I can't see them caring in retrospect either. Will I/they really look back and think 'oh I wish I/Mummy had worked more instead of being able to take me to gymnastics, read stories with me, take me to the park' etc. Hardly. I hardly think they're going to be reliant on benefits when older because I took a couple of years of work when they're actually too young to remember if I chose not to tell them in the future - which I wouldn't, because I'm not ashamed of my decision.

mumandboys123 - Yes, actually, I do believe that a Cambridge degree makes it more acceptable that I'm on benefits than someone with no qualifications, who is making no attempt to gain any or any experience or skills. My degree and work experience means I'll have a job which is better paid than someone who has no qualifications and skills and therefore am more likely to repay the money I rely on now. 'Children adjust. Mine had to.' Look at your reasons. 'I work because I enjoy it', 'I work so no one can justify calling my children 'single mum, benefit scum', 'I work because it gives me financial independence and a sense of achievement every day. And as for your children? 'Do they suffer? I have no idea.' Well you should have an idea, in my opinion. Children shouldn't have to just 'get over their feelings' and have theirs displaced because you deem yours to be more important.

Why do I get the impression that the way the OP was worded is deliberately seeking responses on the lines of "you should not be on benefits that I pay for as a lifestyle choice"? (And agree with whoever said she probably does have more means than just benefits, otherwise it won't be much of a life.) I'm not doubting her circumstances are as described, except insofar as nobody knows the truth about strangers on the net, but I do think she is looking to get people very excited and polarised. This could be because being at home with young children is so mind-numbing that stirring up strangers is the only light relief you get, but that is probably projecting (and completely unfair to the many SAHPs with their own mental resources). I know I would have gone completely bonkers if I'd have had to stay at home with the DC when they were small, although I would have preferred to work part time if the option had been available. Instead their dad did the SAHP thing. That was ok because he was bonkers already.

Ooh look, x-post with a follow-up. And with another controversial opinion. Not everybody fails to have a Cambridge degree because they can't be arsed to put the study time in, you know.

'Will I/they really look back and think "oh I wish I/Mummy had worked more instead of being able to take me to gymnastics, read stories with me, take me to the park" etc'...

Yep, I wish my mother had. Sorry to wreck your attempt at rhetorical trope and all...

I don't think my feelings are more important than those of my children but I don't think they are less.

Sorry for patchy responses - am working my way through the pages!

I don't see the point of the argument: 'well if my DC had their way all the time, we'd all be obese so it doesn't matter what they want' with regard to work ethic. The thing is, in retrospect, grown-up DC will see that your choice for them not to only eat junk food was the right one. I struggle to see how a grown-up DC would look back and think: 'I really wish my parent(s) (assuming they want to stay home) would have worked instead of staying home with me.'

Of course the cost of childcare isn't ALWAYS more than people earn! Yes, it can be prohibitive for some but not for all. I was super lucky in that my mum wanted to look after Dd while I was at work 3 days a week. I worked (still do) as a part time teacher and would have been infinitely worse off on benefits as a single parent if I hadn't returned to work. I think I would also have sunk deeper into post natal depression and possibly never had the confidence to get back in a classroom again.

I'm not saying it was all good, it was very hard at times, I was tired and Dd didn't always want me to go but I don't think I would have been better off in ANY way by staying at home full time. I would just add though that this was before people started being able to take a year off for maternity leave, I would have done that if I'd had the opportunity.