Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think that Miley Cyrus is not a feminist because...

72 replies

IceBeing · 13/11/2013 08:51

feminism isn't just about individual expression but about making the world a better more equal place for everyone....or if you can't do that then at least don't make it worse for the rest of us!

It is perfectly feminist to make money by getting naked if that is what you want to do...and in a perfect world where your actions don't affect other people that would be the end of it.

But in this world here, the one we actually live in, MC's actions make life noticeably worse for swathes of the population, all the way from teenage girls who feel increased pressure to become sexually active before they are ready, through even younger and younger girls believing that their looks are their defining characteristic, up to old farts like me working in male dominated environments who find themselves in a professional setting suddenly being faced with questions about twerking.

So no Miley you are not a feminist because you don't give a shit about the result of your 'self-expression' on the rest of woman kind (or human kind for that matter).

OP posts:
everlong · 13/11/2013 11:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

WorraLiberty · 13/11/2013 11:23

Even Justin Beiber had his 'bad boy' moments to try and shake off the squeaky clean image.

I heard he had dinner yesterday and didn't eat his vegetables?! Shock

So rock n' roll...

TheWickedWitchOfTheWest · 13/11/2013 11:26

I personally can't stand her or her music but I don't see that what she does is any different from any other pop star out there? Rihanna (another one I can't stand), Lady GaGa etc, even Madonna has been doing it for 30 years! Why is Miley Cyrus so different? Confused

NeoFaust · 13/11/2013 11:28

If she thinks that women are equal to men, surely that's the only definition of a feminist that matters? This is what a feminist told me, anyway.

Sallyingforth · 13/11/2013 11:32

She's a very boring brat. She will grow one day - perhaps

Yes - except she is in great danger of going down in drugs booze flames before she gets to grow up.

IceBeing · 13/11/2013 11:33

hmm well I wish she wouldn't get naked for cash as it makes my life and my DD's life more constricted as a result....but no I don't think she is particularly worse than the others....but I don't know that they are claiming to be feminists....

I see what people mean about not defining feminism to strictly....but I disagree that certain things cannot explicitly be labelled as 'non-feminist'.

For instance you cannot logically say 'I believe there are some jobs that no woman can do better than any man' and 'I am a feminist' because you cannot be a feminist while believing that.

OP posts:
IceBeing · 13/11/2013 11:34

neo I don't think that can be enough....If I think people should be treated equally without reference to skin colour, but then only hire white people am I racist?

Your thinking and actions are both part of the picture.

OP posts:
BarbarianMum · 13/11/2013 11:37

Thanks for that Tabbytolst. You have perfectly encapsulated what I was trying to say when I was seething at the radio this morning (but ended up just chuntering at dh instead). Smile

Tikkamasala · 13/11/2013 11:40

I like her and if you listen to her talk she is actually quite clear about what she's doing. It doesn't sound like she is being manipulated and I think it's a bit patronising to suggest she is a puppet and doesn't know her own mind.

Callani · 13/11/2013 11:45

I feel sorry for her - she's been manipulated her entire life and is probably being manipulated now by agents that convince her that being lewd and naked is "edgy".

Sometimes on interviews she comes across as quite sensible and you see what she probably thinks, then she ruins it by reverting back to her "cool" form. I think she's mostly a girl who doesn't know who she is and is acting out to try to stay relevant - more or less the set script for child stars (obvs Harry Potter actors and British child stars are fantastic and therefore exceptions to this rule...)

Mara Wilson (from Matilda) wrote a very interesting piece on why it happens a while ago whilst the media were going mad about another child star gone loopy... www.cracked.com/blog/7-reasons-child-stars-go-crazy-an-insiders-perspective/

Halfrek · 13/11/2013 13:26

Wow, just watched the wrecking ball video and its shockingly inappropriate, why do music videos not have age ratings?

Mitchy1nge · 13/11/2013 13:33

For instance you cannot logically say 'I believe there are some jobs that no woman can do better than any man' and 'I am a feminist' because you cannot be a feminist while believing that.

I don't think women make very good sperm donors but I can probably still be a feminist?

Objection · 13/11/2013 13:36

Feminism is the belief and actions supporting the concept that Men and Women are equal.

The question is whether MC's actions support that philosophy - I personally think she is portraying the idea that women are only valuable for their looks and sexual appeal and is neither promoting maturity or intellect to those she is a role model to.

She may see herself as a feminist and even have feminist values - but she doesn't act on them so therefore in my mind she isn't a feminist.

wasabipeanut · 13/11/2013 13:42

I can't stand her because she has contributed to raising the bar yet again as to what is and isn't acceptable with nudity/sex etc. She (and bloody Rhianna) perform live practically naked - in videos they are naked.

What next? Will women artists be expected to actually shag someone on stage in order to promote their songs to an audience so jaded by the ongoing pornification of popular culture that they think its normal? Or empowering?

It makes me so, so angry.

Objection · 13/11/2013 13:42

Feminism really is very simple - do you believe that men and women are equal? do you actions reflect this belief?

If the answer to both is yes - you're a feminist.

DuckToWater · 13/11/2013 13:43

I don't think what she is doing is anything different than Madonna 20+ years ago.

She's certainly selling a lot of records at the moment and good luck to her. Lady Gaga is probably cursing her under her breath. The nudity and twerking are not my cup of tea, but perhaps unintentionally she flushes a lot of misogynists/people with double standards out of the woodwork.

tethersend · 13/11/2013 13:43

I think it's sad that the only way a woman gets to 'be herself' and 'rebel' is to undress and do exactly what men want her to do.

Girls are fed that bullshit all the time. It's one of the patriarchy's greatest triumphs.

Or a striking coincidence Hmm

sandfrog · 13/11/2013 13:45

The persona she projects can be seen as exploitative / exploited depending on your viewpoint, but that is not feminism. It's pandering to a sexist stereotype for personal gain.

I agree with tabby.

SaucyJack · 13/11/2013 13:48

Feminism Test

Sallystyle · 13/11/2013 13:50

Miley is turning out to be my secret guilty pleasure!

Leave her alone Hmm

After reading a few interviews from here I don't think she is being manipulated, she knows exactly what she is doing.

She is young and immature like most 20 year olds. She will either grow out of it or go down in flames, I hope it is the former.

Sallystyle · 13/11/2013 13:51

her not here.

zatyaballerina · 13/11/2013 14:06

If young men were also writhing around naked every performance, playing with their balls on stage, sticking their genitals to the camera and producing music videos where they're naked, simulating sex with inanimate objects and large groups of people and selling the message that young boys were merely sex objects who were always gagging for it with everybody and any boy who doesn't emaluate that behaviour is frigid and has something wrong with them, then I'd agree that it's not a feminist issue but a societal one.

Watching any music channel, men make music, women (with rare exception) do porno.

How women and young girls are portrayed in the media affects how they see and portray themselves, it affects how others see us and how we are treated or mistreated. That is a feminist issue.

Miley is a stupid little girl. She is so unsexy, pathetic, desperate, repulsive and cringeworthy to watch that she could be the best thing for young girls as that will be what they DON'T want to be. She is a parody of the music industry right now.

mrsjay · 13/11/2013 16:08

Off subject slightly. But I happened to hear her singing live on the radio yesterday and she was actually really good. Made me really sad (for her) that she thinks she needs to act the way she does to get attention.

she is a nice singer but maybe she doesnt like nice I think she was meant for country singing but she has rebelled saying that she did do a semi naked picture when she was 15 under her management in what universe is that a good idea

Objection · 13/11/2013 16:10

SaucyJack Fantastic! Great test!

mrsjay · 13/11/2013 16:12

I wish people would stop saying Miley is being manipulated to wear and act how she is she isn't she knows what she is doing what she is doing is ridiculous and she looks desperate but I believe this is how she is she wants all this attention, people dont think imo Lady gaga is being manipulated they see her as bonkers doing her own thing

Swipe left for the next trending thread