AIBU? DS was ill and the school have marked it as an unauthorised holiday and are threatening to fine me!

[WeAreEternal]

A couple of weeks ago DS (7) had an upset stomach, he D&V over night and most of the next day.
First thing in the morning (a Thursday) I called the school and let them know he was ill.
He was feeling better by the evening but as he had D&V school policy is 24 hours off, so I kept him off Friday too.

I received a letter from to school yesterday saying that those days have been marked as an unauthoried holiday as "although we received a phone call from you stating that (DS) was ill, we are led to believe that DS was in fact on a holiday to XXXX on these two dates"

The letter goes on to say that if he was genuinely ill they expect me to provide evidence such as a doctors appointment card, a prescription, a medication receipt or something simmilar that can "verify my version of events".

I am a medical professional, I know when when my DS needs medication or to see a GP or when he just has a bit of a stomach bug and needs rest and fluids.
Who would take a child to the GP or buy medication for D&V anyway?

How on earth can I prove that DS was ill?
And why are they even querying this?
AIBU to think this is bloody ridiculous?

Anyone have any ideas?

"Amendments to the 2006 regulations remove references to family holiday and extended leave as well as the statutory threshold of ten school days. The amendments make clear that headteachers may not grant any leave of absence during term time unless there are exceptional circumstances. Headteachers should determine the number of school days a child can be away from school if the leave is granted ."

From the DfE website.

So ti sounds like LEAs are making up their own rules rather than following the national ones. No wonder everyone is so confused.

So a HT could give leave of absence to a pupil whose terminally ill parent is nearing the end of their life - as it's an exceptional circumstance? But LEA's are deciding to over rule these regulations and make their own policies that's its not possible?

Head teachers can't authorise holiday afaik but they can choose not to fine parents. Ds had some time out of school recently, it was unauthorised but the head was aware and supportive and will not be fining me.

So if they can't grant leave at all, why are they asked to determine the number of days a child can be away from school is leave is granted?

What I found was that dd's school were very ready to throw their weight about and threaten with Social Services and fines and court procedures in general terms.

But the moment we stood up to them and said, in effect "very well, we are convinced that you are breaking the law here and would welcome a court case", they got shit scared. We invited SS in and spoke to them and SS took our part.

For the school, SS and the courts of justice were just so many bogey men who were useful for keeping parents in check; they relied on the assumption that most parents would be easily intimidated by authority and comply with everything however absurd in the face of that threat.

Once they had to face up to the real possibility of having to argue their case under oath, they were noticeably less keen.

Our HT is still authorising holidays so long as attendance of the child is generally good. Dd's school is in a very deprived area and he would know that for some pupils a fine would have serious implications on a family's well being and also an in term holiday may be the only holiday a child would ever have. I'm glad he has the empathy to recognise this and act as he believes is right rather than applying a policy that is harsh and punitive.

Cory's right. Schools and LA's happily use legal threats against parents but are not so keen to apply the law to their own actions. I was threatened and turned it back on them by taking them to court - they didn't like it.

I like your style cory

Its a real shame it comes to that though - we are after all still a state with freedom of speech. Not everyone has the same attitudes to education I agree, but I like to think most parents have their child's best interests at heart.

Gone are the days when I was at school, when my mum and dad were fairly new teachers, and they remember June and July being very quiet in the classroom because most of the pupils went on their holidays then.

innocent until proven guilty does not apply to employment either. If an employer has a reasonable reason to think you've done something naughty they can discipline/fire you.

Do the same rules apply to free schools too? Or are they more like private schools?

I think you're right. I think free schools are basically just private schools that are free, or thinking about it another way, a group of home educators banding together and setting up structure/hiring staff.

Placemark, I really want to know how you got on Eternal. This absenteeism sledgehammer is getting past silly and well into Kafka-esque.

I used to be a school secretary in a former life, IME a letter like that would only be sent out if the school and pastoral team were REALLY pissed off with child's general attendance and they had pretty good evidence that you child wasn't ill that day (ie you were spotted out and about, had previously asked for a holiday that had been declined)

We had children who were 'poorly' for 2 weeks coming back with suntans and Sombreros for their friends - even that wasn't sufficient 'evidence' to send such a damning letter!

I suspect that the school are a bunch of mentalists or there is more to the story ;)

Op this sounds crazy! Do update us on what evidence the head claims to have!

I agree with elliegoulding. I said it earlier, a school wouldn't send a letter out like that without good reason and unless they were completely certain of their facts.
"...this sounds crazy..." - yes, it does.

Saintly why are you saying that children at special schools cannot have holidays at busy times?? That is a load of rubbish.

How many times has someone on here been told if a holiday is not authorised, just phone up and say the child is ill? Why are people so amazed that the school doesn't believe a parent who says their child is ill?

But the OP said that she had not previously asked for these two particular days off for a holiday (as none was planned). So, as schools get numerous absence phone calls from parents every day, why have they assumed that hers is false?

I didn't say she had.
I am just pointing out how a lot of people here, seem to have no problem saying that a child is sick when they are in fact on holiday but a lot of people here also think it is terrible a school could think a child is on holiday when the child is sick. Double standards?

Starfish - depends on the child. Not all but in many cases that is the case. Many children with severe autism (& other special needs) cannot handle crowds. My own son can't - we don't go anywhere that's busy ever - because we'll have to bail out. He can now handle queues, but it's taken until his teens to get to that stage. Other children with severe disabilities have problems with illnesses - so should avoid busy places. Families with disabled children are often worse off financially than those without (plenty of stats to back that up) so may not be able to afford peak times. We were planning a Calvert Trust holiday - I was going to go during winter in the school term, because it is so so expensive during holiday periods. Mainstream cheap equivalents such as PGL are simply not accessible to our son.

In ds1's school at least many of the children have life limiting illnesses - meaning that holidays may involve more family members & may therefore be a lot easier to organise during school term (and ffs - if you have a child who isn't going to reach adulthood - are they really going to benefit from school over a family holiday).

So there's a few reasons.

marcopront Sun 10-Nov-13 16:29:08
"I didn't say she had.
I am just pointing out how a lot of people here, seem to have no problem saying that a child is sick when they are in fact on holiday but a lot of people here also think it is terrible a school could think a child is on holiday when the child is sick. Double standards?"

Not at all. Mumsnet is a large forum and posters are different. The fact that some posters may think it all right to pretend that a child is sick when they are not does not make it right to accuse somebody else's child of lying. If some other poster think it's all right to pretend a child is on holiday that doesn't prove the OP has double standards.

There are plenty of thieves and shoplifters in the world- most of them probably lie about their activities. That doesn't mean the police can go up and accuse random people of shoplifting on no evidence just because it would be double standards not to let them make false accusations when other people are making false protestations of innocence.

elliegoulding, haven't the regulations changed really recently - this year in fact? Were you a school secretary before this?

I agree with Joan this is something to do with the new regulations and the £60 per day fine.

The actual statement in the letter the school sent is utter bollocks. And it would be even if the OP had been on holiday.

"We are led to believe that X was infact on a holiday to X on these 2 dates"

The above is not a factual statement. It says they believe not that they know, so they can believe the OP has 2 heads and eats kids but it does not make it true.

If the letter had said

"we have evidence to show X was infact on holiday...." then that would be a factual statement to make assuming they have evidence.

The fact is they do not have any evidence - they cannot possibly have if OP was at home.

Request of info through the DPA will mean they have to delcare what has led them to their belief.

Personally I am desperate to know what they have on the OP because its got to be laughable surely if she was at home with her DC.

Could it be that the op really annoyed them by taking her DS to the funeral against their wishes or they put her on some kind of blacklist of parents who might be sneaky trouble makers and will now suspect her of going on holiday anytime her kids are off sick?