To ask for some advice re dc's school application

[WahIzzit]

Ok firstly, I know this should be in Education (or chat even) and I did post in there only recently about something similar, but I really need the AIBU traffic and you lovely brutally honest people have not let me down in the past.

So dc1 is currently in nursery and will be starting reception next September. Apparently the council sent out a letter (which was not received) about applying for schools online, I just found this out today. I had a quick look at the website form - it asks for our three choices and any additional information relevant to our choice of school.
Our first choice is a school 0.6 miles away (I put 0.8 in another post but that was incorrect) its a brilliant school and we know of some pupils who attend, and dc's friends are hoping to go there too. The second choice is an converted Academy which is two minutes away, however we do not know of anyone who goes there/is going there.
Had a look inside first school, and had a virtual tour of second (has a brilliant website).and both seem pleasant and friendly.

The reason I am really worrying is because DC is a very anxious, quiet child who needs familiarity and it takes ages for her to get used to new situations and changes in routine. She is cripplingly shy - mute with her teachers though does chat to nursery friends. She is also emotionally immature, and will cry rather than communicate whatever the matter may be.
Members of staff have no concerns, however they do not see her anxiety before nursery every single morning, or the tears and emotional outbursts after nursery due to a mixture of tiredness and feeling overwhelmed with all the goings on at the nursery :( I feel the mutism may be an issue later in school and really want her better emotionally supported there.

I feel she will really settle in better at the first choice school as it is smaller and will have some friends attending there. However with it being a little far out, we may not get a place. Dh suggested writing in the 'additional information' box about dc's needs. Although I occasionally get paranoid about DC having some sort of SEN which could explain her quirkiness, nursery has not flagged up any concerns and have reassured me she is fine.

So my question is what would you advise in this situation? I told DH they may think 'oh here we go, another parent with a sob story'. But is it worth writing anything or would it backfire on us? If so what should we mention? Sorry totally ignorant regarding this as its my first DC and am a worrywart and the best of times.

Oh fuck thats longer than I intended sorry half of its just me waffling on!

Unless you have medical or psych. Evidence to send with form.it will be vowed as sob story and no weight attached

What hwjm said. Please put down 3 schools you are likely to get into as well, look at their admissions criteria and check you qualify high up the list. Do you know if there is a shortage of places in your local area?

What are the admissions criteria for your first choice school? Do they give priority for medical/social need? If they do, it may be worth mentioning the anxiety and mutism, but the LEA will expect you to provide supporting professional opinion from (say) a psychologist. If there's no priority for medical/social need and/or you can't provide supporting evidence then you are not going to get any benefit from mentioning your dc's issues - wanting to stay with friends from nursery is not a reason for getting a place at a school if you don't otherwise fulfil the admissions criteria.

I think nearly every school locally is oversubscribed. A staff member at the nursery informally mentioned I could put the farther school and hope for the best, which is kind of what we were hoping to do! Currently dc's nursery is just over a mile away, and we have no problems walking every morning. unhappy sigh I really hate all this! It is a new area for me, where I grew up we had one primary and one secondary school and did not have this dilemma.

Well firstly I think you need to go and see both schools in person. Phone them and make an appointment to look round. This should give you a better feeling about which one you feel would be best and would be a good time to put out some feelers regarding their attitudes to children who may struggle, like your daughter. Whether or not to she turns out to have some SEN and requires support is not relevant to the application process (well not from the schools point of view any way) she has no statement of special needs so she will just follow usual procedures.
Places are not allocated by the school but by the local authority. They are allocated through a fairly rigid set of criteria. Usually distance from school is the main criteria. How popular is the first school? Were they oversubscribed last year? You can put what you like on the form. It shouldn't count against her. Sadly I'm not sure it will make any difference to her getting place either!

Will the list of priorities be on the council website? As I mentioned I have only had a quick look today, on the school websites it states the usual criteria - siblings, proximity from house etc.

Yes smartie from what I gather all local schools are oversubscribed, especially our first choice as it is a small school that is outstanding.. so desperately sought after in a deprived area with larger than average families.

The admissions/oversubscription criteria (aka priorities) should've in the schools admission booklet on the LEA's website but it sounds as if you have already found them on the school website. What - if anything - do they say about medical/social need?

I agree that unless you've supporting evidence from a professional it will make no difference.

On the positive side, it's still pretty much a year away - a lot may change in that time. After all, nursery is about social development as well as everything else.

Should be ...

The admissions criteria should be on the schools website and the councils too. Start there.

If you have a selective mutism dx then put that down, if not just put the schools in your order of preference ensuring that you have a chance of getting in and you fill all spaces

Would school write a letter about anxiety?

Ok thanks for all the replies, will have a look properly at what all three websites say about social/emotional needs.

Half a mile is nothing when they consider travel to school, no bus travel if they have to walk less than 3 miles - they are expected to walk that! I actually only put the one choice on both the form for secondary and the one for primary, we are RC so they were only the options I was prepared to consider. I'm not sure I would recommend you do that but you can put any supporting evidence on and at worst it will be ignored. It is an awful worry these days trying to get into the school you want so good luck and hope you get the one that is best for your DC

Would it be considered selective mutism though, because dc does speak to her friends but gets all shy and tongue tied with the teachers. I always thought children with selective mutism didnt speak at all in the school environment.

Thanks tiredoutgran our first choice is a RC too, though we are not but its a brilliant school. Hm lets hope dc gets a place wherever it is best for her. I am a big believer in fate so will try my best and leave it at that.

You were the one who first used the term mute, do you know better than us whether it's a good description of your child's issues.

What I have been trying to say is that not every school/LEA has a separate admissions category for social/medical need. Where they do, it has to be for children whose needs have been identified and confirmed by relevant professionals, who confirm that there is something about the preferred school that means it is best placed to meet the child's needs (eg a school with a unit for hearing-impaired children for a deaf child). Friendship issues or being shy are not, in these terms, a social/medical need.

So you know ...

Unless there is a diagnosis and statement of special needs it will make no difference.
I'm afraid if it is a faith school and you are not practising you are at a bit of a disadvantage already.

selective mutism can be any form of mutism on any circumstances. So if she doesn't speak to teachers, then she is selectively mute with her teachers.

This needs a recognised professional to write a letter in order for it to be any use.
But the admissions criteria is very clear and very rigid, and is not about persuasion.

So typically the criteria look like this
1st looked after children (children in care/fostered)
2nd children with special needs (this is only those with a Statement)
3rd siblings
4th distance from school.

So your daughter's needs do not appear on the list and don't count. BUT they may count if you appeal, given that you have expressed it on the form.
And the criteria may include medical needs, which your daughter may fall under (again it is usually for those with a Statement of medical needs)

The form has to be in by Jan 15th. So you have a bit of time to go and look at the schools.

You have nothing to loose by putting your favourite school first. The system is hard to explain, but if you aren't eligible for your first choice, then your second choice automatically becomes your first choice and is considered alongside those whp put it as their first choice So they DON'T fill up with first choices and then the second choices get a chance.
As long as you have 3 schools and one of them you have a really good chance of getting in, then you can put them in the ordr that you would ideally like

Please don't make the mistake of only putting one school on the form, this will not make them give you that school. If you are not eligible for that school, you may then end up with a school miles across town.

missed the faith school part.
so on my list eg
no. 3 might be children who are RC, and there may be % of places set aside for them, or all the places may be open for faith kids, which means that if RC child living 5 miles away applies, they would have precedent over a child living next to the school

Whether the dc's needs will carry any weight at appeal again depends on whether the admissions criteria make any provision for social/medical need. If they do, there is scope at appeal for arguing that - with appropriate evidence presented with the initial application - the LEA was wrong not to give a place on that basis.

But the crucial issue for any appeal for a reception place is whether it is an infant class size appeal (about which there are lots of threads in Primary Education). If it is, the appeal panel can only allow the appeal if the LEA made a mistake in not awarding the place. Infant class sizes are limited by law to 30 pupils with one teacher, so the panel can't allow the appeal except on the very limited grounds detour in the admissions appeal code - the fact that something had been mentioned on the application form doesn't automatically make it the basis of a winnable appeal.

based on what you said.

chances 1st school are slim if over subscriibed it will be those who rc, siblings and those who live closer you don't say how many per year group as if 30 could be tricky in our area half 50%places or more went siblings last year.

Im in same situation as eldest goes out of catchment so so no sibling link and only 20 places.

deadlines
15th jan, you should find out april to start sept 2014.

You can keep her at nursery until term after 5th birthday as nursery 15 hours are availiable until then.You can defer a place and join wait list too.

my advice look at as many as you can.

Rc school with be voluntry aided so t will be governers make decisions and report back lea based usually on faith, kids in care.

we used to go rc primary and they dident do well so now eldest in small coe school.

Lots of kids are shy if nursery not concerned unsure if it is selective mutism but know what you mean my 2.5year old wont talk and really worry about him.

good luck.

Thanks for the replies, comeinto yes I see what you mean sorry, I did mentiom mute but as it has not been officially diagnosed as selective mutism as well as me being ignorant of what it is exactly (thanks steppemum ) hmm it seems it could well be Selective Mutism then, perhaps I should have a word with dc's keyworkers and take it further if we decide there could be room for medical intervention. (My GP is useless and dismisses everything). Not specifically for the school place, but it may make it easier to have a diagnosis so she is better equiped for help when starting Reception. I should note this is her second year in nursery and she was mute/silent then too. Was hoping she would feel more comfortable this year but is still the same.

The school is RC but I believe nearly all the pupils are from other faiths as we live in a very ethnic diverse area. So I dont think we will be at any more of a disadvantage in that way than the other applicants eally.