To ask for some advice re dc's school application

[WahIzzit]

Ok firstly, I know this should be in Education (or chat even) and I did post in there only recently about something similar, but I really need the AIBU traffic and you lovely brutally honest people have not let me down in the past.

So dc1 is currently in nursery and will be starting reception next September. Apparently the council sent out a letter (which was not received) about applying for schools online, I just found this out today. I had a quick look at the website form - it asks for our three choices and any additional information relevant to our choice of school.
Our first choice is a school 0.6 miles away (I put 0.8 in another post but that was incorrect) its a brilliant school and we know of some pupils who attend, and dc's friends are hoping to go there too. The second choice is an converted Academy which is two minutes away, however we do not know of anyone who goes there/is going there.
Had a look inside first school, and had a virtual tour of second (has a brilliant website).and both seem pleasant and friendly.

The reason I am really worrying is because DC is a very anxious, quiet child who needs familiarity and it takes ages for her to get used to new situations and changes in routine. She is cripplingly shy - mute with her teachers though does chat to nursery friends. She is also emotionally immature, and will cry rather than communicate whatever the matter may be.
Members of staff have no concerns, however they do not see her anxiety before nursery every single morning, or the tears and emotional outbursts after nursery due to a mixture of tiredness and feeling overwhelmed with all the goings on at the nursery :( I feel the mutism may be an issue later in school and really want her better emotionally supported there.

I feel she will really settle in better at the first choice school as it is smaller and will have some friends attending there. However with it being a little far out, we may not get a place. Dh suggested writing in the 'additional information' box about dc's needs. Although I occasionally get paranoid about DC having some sort of SEN which could explain her quirkiness, nursery has not flagged up any concerns and have reassured me she is fine.

So my question is what would you advise in this situation? I told DH they may think 'oh here we go, another parent with a sob story'. But is it worth writing anything or would it backfire on us? If so what should we mention? Sorry totally ignorant regarding this as its my first DC and am a worrywart and the best of times.

*ethnically diverse

Op my niece was selectively mute at nursery. When she started school she decided that she was going to talk. She has always been chatty at home but doesn't talk to new people, and if she is uncomfortable for any reason, she goes quiet (and stops eating)

But, as I said, she decided that at school she was going to talk and does, unrecognisable to the child at nursery.

Thanks for the info comeinto I dont think we would have the emotional energy for appealing etc if I am honest, lots going on right now. I would like her to get into the first school hence starting this thread, so if we get our first choice, brilliant. But if not, will have to just suck it up and dc will simply have to get on with it.

Thats comforting steppemum I worry a lot about her, she is so shy with MIL and FIL despite seeing them twice a week. Will only nod or shake head most of the time, or whisper - not helpful as they are hard of hearing!

my niece has spoken only a couple of words to me, when she has been staying for a few days.
When I see her with her mum and dad it is like another child. (to be fair we were lively overseas so she doesn't know us very well)

There were a couple of lovely programmes on about this a year or so ago. I remember one lovely set of grandparents who were very close to their gd, and she had NEVER said ONE word to them. They had a developed a lovely way of talking to her and including her in everything, letting her be herself, all without a word from her.

Have you got the admissions booklet for your local authority. It should be on their website somewhere if you don't have a hard copy. In it it should list the schools and the admission criteria for each school.

It might also list which category the last child came under and the distance from the school. If it doesn't have that information the local authority should be able to provide you with it if you contact them. That distance can change from year to year so it isn't a guarantee, but it should give you an idea about how likely you are to get a place at each school.

If it isn't likely, then you still put the school at the top of your list, but you need to make sure that there is at least one school on your list that you can pretty much guarantee you will get into, even if you don't like it that much.

That is really sweet steppemum luckily dc's dgps are very good too and never push her to speak. It just makes me feel a little sad though, when the other gc happily chat to them and it feels they have a greater bond than with my dc because of her shyness.

I dont have the admissions booklet but I downloaded the doc off the council website just now and had a look through. The schools all have pretty much the same admissions criteria, and dc will qualify by distsnce from our house as she is the eldest so no siblings already at any of the schools, and no official diagnosis of any developmental problems.

So 1. School is 0.6 miles away

1. Academy is 0.2 miles away
2. We are undecided between two - first is another Academy convert which is 0.4 miles away or an average school which is 0.2 miles away

Shit loads of schools around my area but theyre all bursting at the seams it seems!

Is keep it short and just put elective mute on the form.

I personally think he tears after/before nursery could just be total exhaustion. Mine were like that and took a year or so of school to have more stamina

Can you visit all the schools? Visiting is the most important thing. A virtual tour is not the same. You need to meet the head/teachers and get a proper feel of the ethos/classroom mood.

Small schools are hugely overrated, imo.

Our local authority has two different distance criteria, distinguishing between people for whom the school is the nearest school (getting priority) and those for whom another school would be closer. So child 1 might live 0.8 miles from the school and nowhere near another school so would get priority over child 2 who lives 0.6 miles from desired school but has another school 0.3 miles away in the other direction.
I think you need to be clear on the rules, you should be able to find them from the council. Ours also has a lot of data on the website from previous years, stating how many children were admitted to each school under which criteria, so you could see if it is in any way realistic that you would get your desired school.

You need to establish if the school has an "exceptional social/medical need" category.

Schools (unfortunately) do not have to have one. If this one doesn't, mentioning it on the form will make no difference to the application, and shouldn't carry any weight at appeal (though panels are sometimes sympathetic beyond what is permitted)

But if there is one, or if you want to mention it, then yes you put on all relevant parts of the form that DD should be considered in that category, and that you are attaching letters relevant to her condition. It needs to be described fully, by professionals, at the application stage so that the admissions tem can consider if she meets the criteria to be placed in that category, and then her admission application will be ranked accordingly.

The letters need to be from GP, other HCP, previous SENCO etc, and also need to say in their professional opinion why she needs school A above all others. It's not enough to have a specific issue, they have to show that the needs can, exceptionally, be met only by school A (or a school with features ABC, from which you can demonstrate that A has but none others nearby).

Yes you are right, we should really go to the school and have a proper look and speak to the Head Teacher etc. Will try and organise a meeting after the holidays though I did want to fill the form in as soon as possible.

I scoured the school websites and there is nothing mentioned regarding exceptional circumstances for emotional/social needs except choice 2, which has a special one-to-one unit for pupils with behavioural/emotional/social problems. Might it be worth me emailing the first choice to ask what help they have in place for a child like dc?
bicycle our council website doesnt seem to have that info unfortunately or it would have been very helpful.

It won't help as things stand, but if things get worse over the next year and the nursery do agree that there is a problem, then it could be part of your supporting evidence for appeal.

Let nursery know of her behaviour before and after school. If you really think there is a problem then, help them witness it, or take her to the doctor. You need to get evidence and then you have grounds for appeal. If you do nothing on the basis of what the nursery say, and you know there is a real problem or it gets worse, then you won't have a leg to stand on.

My dd had never spoken to an adult at nursery either, she went to an primary school.with 90 in every year, very academically focused, where she knew almost no-one and chats away there. She is still sometimes shy with adults but no worse than some of the other children. Unlike your dd, my nursery did want to get her formally assessed.
You must visit both schools. Some large schools are excellent. You also need a plan for your dd, there are excellent resources on the web for selective mutism. We never applied pressure, but gave encouragement if she interacted with people she didn't know and generally tried to build up her self esteem. We found helicopter parenting made it worse, bribery occasionally was excellent. Starting school also gave her the chanceto stop some of her learned behaviours, with people who weren't necessarily expecting her to be silent. It could work really well.

Just to warn you both of my dc's schools are ethnically diverse but are oversubscribed taking only catholic children. My own aren't white.

If your dd's problems are serious enough for her to be unable to function in an ordinary context and there is evidence that she has needed the input of professionals to be able to cope so far, then you might be able to make a case on the grounds of discrimination even if there isn't a box for medical and social.

Sometimes admissions and panels do have to stretch the rules: some LEA's never statement for physical disabilities but they don't actually want a situation where the wheelchair using child can't even get through the doorway into the school because they've been put in the only Victorian school in town. They would end up sued and the press would have a field day.

But we are talking really serious, obvious cases here- and diagnosed cases. Without a diagnosis they'd just have to take your word for it and they're not going to do that. Any parent could say anything.

A diagnosis would have to be from a medical professional and would have to make it perfectly clear that your dd had problems well over and above what could be expected for her age and that these problems were making it impossible for her to function unless her needs were met. There would need to be evidence that you have already sought medical opinion and are doing everything you can to support her because her difficulties are that serious.

But you have to be aware that "function" means function on a level that might be expected in a 4yo. Ime it is normal to have at least one child in an infants class who hides under the table and doesn't speak to the teacher. And at least one child who has to be peeled off his mother sobbing in the morning. So this type of behaviour wouldn't necessarily be seen as a sign of being unable to function. Schools are very good at handling it on the whole.

Ds was one of the hiding-under-the-table ones. He is now at secondary and was put on report several times last year for talking in class It took some time for him to settle into primary school but the teachers were very patient and he got a lot of help from the other children.

I do wonder if you should request a referral to your Speech and Language Therapy team. You can do it via the nursery or GP. If you have concerns, don't wait for others to suggest the referral. It may have no bearing on your application but, SALT waiting lists can be very long and it might be best to get the ball rolling now rather than wait until she starts school.

It costs £10 to sign up to school guru (Google it). You can enter details of where you live and it will give you guidance on if you would get into your school choices based on admissions front the last few years.

Also, look at village schools as a back up plan as they sometimes have spare places if you really don't think you'll get your first choice. A small village school might suit your little one better.....