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AIBU?

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Original poster

...to not take a child's account of what happens at school as the Absolute Truth?

55 replies

Vivacia · 21/10/2013 10:48

I'm surprised at how many threads we get about the Terrible Things that happen (or don't happen) in schools based on the word of a child. Nobody ever listens to them read, the teachers make all sorts of elementary mistakes, evil children get away with murder yet the teacher hates them...

If I believed my children's reports I'd think they did nothing but play in the sandpit all day, had never had a fire engine visit the school (despite photographic evidence of being sat behind the steering wheel of a fire engine wearing a helmet), were given nothing but fish fingers for dinner (every day, despite the evidence of the menu being emailed every Friday) and definitely hadn't had PE today so the inside-out, back-to-front t-shirt is a mystery.

OP posts:
havatry · 21/10/2013 13:22

I think you have to eek the pertinent facts out gradually. I usually ask "and what happened before this" because it never is completely clear cut.

Goldmandra · 21/10/2013 13:23

I used to assume my children were exaggerating/misunderstanding/missing the other point of view. Then I started helping in school quite a lot and witnessed staff saying things to children they wouldn't dream of saying in front of their parents.

On one occasion the HT said something so awful as I walked into a room that she sent the secretary to remind me that what I heard in school was confidential!

I also started a long battle for SEN provision and found that the culture in both my DD's schools was to lie black was white if that got you what you wanted.

I now assume my DD's are telling the truth once I've dug around the issue to make sure I have the whole story. I've not been proved wrong yet. TBF they both have AS and it doesn't occur to them to lie very often anyway.

DeWe · 21/10/2013 13:34

Marshmallo, ds has been obsessed with planes since he was 3yo, and can tell you all about it, plus many other planes including the Russian immitation the name I forget but he doesn't.
The school trip was also to a place where they have a Concorde to explore. I did ask him not to regale his classmates with descriptions of the Concorde crash and why it happened (there was a good documentary on youtube he loved for a while) while they were sitting on it. Thought it might not be helpful.
I think instead he chose to tell the guide all he knew about the bouncing bombs. Grin

He still hopes that Concorde will be brought out of retirement for him to fly.

FreeWee · 21/10/2013 14:16

I am a fussy eater and was made to eat all sorts of revolting things during school dinners still can't bear mash I was literally force fed fish cakes one lunchtime and promptly sicked them back up again. My mum was called to collect me because I'd been sick. I missed the afternoon school trip as a result (can you tell it still grates on me?) I told my mum and when she asked the school they denied all knowledge of it. Years later I reminded her and she said whilst she couldn't be seen to believe my word over theirs that is what prompted her to switch me to packed lunches. I never knew that so although it hurt not to be believed at the time I ultimately didn't have to eat school dinners again and the school saved face. When schools lie, what can parents do? Not every teacher lies, not every child tells the truth. I guess you have to know your child and know how far to trust them.

Sparklysilversequins · 21/10/2013 14:26

Both my dc have ASD. They can't lie, no imagination for this kind of thing so can't think them up. If they say it happened then it did.

FriskyHenderson · 21/10/2013 14:41

Sparkly my ASD ds doesn't 'lie' but certainly has his own version of truth Grin People kick him but he only ever nudges them gently with his foot. He doesn't see why he was told off for not sitting on the floor at carpet time - because there are chairs in the room and why should he have to sit on the floor when he could sit on a chair? So it might not be a lie but it's all in the perception of events Hmm

cory · 21/10/2013 14:46

it can go either way ime

I have never doubted that my children are capable of lying: it's a thing that all NT children are potentially capable of.

Otoh so are adults.

I would not have believed the way the school treated my dd if the teacher hadn't accidentally referred to it in her school report and the HT hadn't admitted it; in fact, there were lots of things dd didn't tell because they seemed so unbelievable

I also had the HT say things to me in private and then backtrack madly when there were more people present

these days I try to keep a totally open mind: if I hear two conflicting reports I will tell myself I know one of them is wrong, but I won't jump to conclusions about which one

FrightRider · 21/10/2013 14:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

littlemslazybones · 21/10/2013 14:51

Still laughing at Sarah Connor

There are 215 bones in the human body, that's just one

...pockets that for parent's evening, thanks

Sparklysilversequins · 21/10/2013 15:02

Thing with my ds especially is that so much goes over his head that when something happens and he actually tells me I know it's got through to him and its a big thing. He always had problems at school but he came our of school one day practicality catatonic. His HT was waiting with him and gave me a near hysterical account of his "misbehaviour" that day. It was awful, really awful to hear Sad. When I got him in the car I tried to talk to him about it and he burst into tears and told me that she had held him down head first on a table and then banged his head off the table "lots of times". His head and face and arms were covered in bruises and abrasions so god knows what else happened Sad.

She denied it completely, said she had never been alone with him and that he was lying. No further action was taken. But I knew from the moment he said it that he was telling the truth because he never told me anything before that no matter how out of hands things got before that. My dd is the same. She was being bullied for ages before she broke down and told me.

And now I am blubbing, thinking about all this agin!

Justforlaughs · 21/10/2013 15:02

I try to keep an open mind about what is the truth and was isn't and what is just my child's spin on an incident.

There was the teacher who consistently called my DS "stupid", "an idiot", "would never amount to anything" etc, some people think that this would never have happened and that I shouldn't believe my DS. The fact is, that he NEVER told me about it, it was other parents who were ringing me after their DCs were going home telling them what was going on.

I remember an incident when yr1 DD took a poem into school to show her teacher, she had written it herself, illustrated it and tied it up in a bow. She handed it to her teacher who shouted at her to "put it your tray, can't you see I'm busy". I watched DDs face drop as she turned away. Teacher then spotted me in the door and about faced so fast! I asked of she had seen DD yet, "Oh yes, Mrs Just, I told her it looked lovely and I'd sit down with her in a minute to have a really good look in a minute" - my arse you did! I called her up on it and there was nothing she could say.

Don't disbelieve your children on the grounds that they are children and adults don't lie - they sometimes do. Don't believe your children on the grounds that they are YOUR children and YOUR children would never lie, sometimes they will (even if it's not deliberate, just their take on something). Do a bit of digging and get to the bottom of what really happened.

Justforlaughs · 21/10/2013 15:04

Bloody hell, sparkly I'm not surprised you're blubbing. How old is DS now? Was this a long time ago?

Sparklysilversequins · 21/10/2013 15:07

He's ten now and it was exactly this time two years ago, October 2011. So he was 8.

Sparklysilversequins · 21/10/2013 15:10

I've seen that justforlaughs, many times, impatient dismissive tones that change as soon as they see you standing there. I quite like dd's current teacher because she's shouty and firm right in front of the parents and dd says that's just what she's like but dd likes her.

cory · 21/10/2013 15:26

This is wise:

"Don't disbelieve your children on the grounds that they are children and adults don't lie - they sometimes do. Don't believe your children on the grounds that they are YOUR children and YOUR children would never lie, sometimes they will"

Sums it up perfectly.

Takver · 21/10/2013 15:36

Cory's point is a good one.

In serious cases, I would say it is often worth trying to get the views of another child who was present (obviously depending on age). I learnt this having been very sceptical of dd's description of an event, only to have it confirmed completely and independently via more than one other child (not by asking them - they told their parents about the incident and said parents happen to be friends of mine so let me know.)

I also don't take a teacher / HT's account of what happened as the absolute truth, as I have witnessed an event /conversation myself, and then seen it spun out of all recognition in retelling at a later date.

Justforlaughs · 21/10/2013 15:40

Sparky are they still in the same school. Has anything happened since? I really hope that they are ok now, and that you are as well Flowers

fromparistoberlin · 21/10/2013 15:45

yes, and no

we need to listen to them, and "listen" is the word, not necessarily react

But I agree as DS has...emebllished some stuff recently

but its a tough one..

and agree if you go in "guns blazing" its already started on a bad foot

elastamum · 21/10/2013 15:48

At our first new parents meeting the head of my DS infants school said ' Dont believe everything they say about us and we wont believe everything they say about you!' Grin

Sparklysilversequins · 21/10/2013 15:55

No I pulled them both out that day. Ds is home educated now, he refused to go back to school and dd is in a lovely school only a few minutes away.

Justforlaughs · 21/10/2013 16:01

Sparkly I'm sorry that your DCs had such a bad experience of school, Sad Glad that they are happy now, hopefully your DDs school will prove that not all schools are the same.

Blueandwhitelover · 21/10/2013 17:32

I overheard a parent informing my teacher that her child had been 'telling Mrs Blueandwhitelover all week about the bullying and she wasn't doing anything about it'
I had been away all week up until that day. Parent was mortified.

ThisIsMeToo · 21/10/2013 17:41

Hmm I am a bit in two minds about that.

On one side yes is would be careful because it's only one side of the events. I mean adults are known not to be reliable when giving an account of events so it would be fair the same happens with children.
On the other side, a child coming back saying they have hen upset because of x or y, I eod always listen and take into account. It might be that they aren't all white or that there are stuff that they haven't taken into account. But I will always believe their feelings.

ThisIsMeToo · 21/10/2013 17:46

And YY to the fact that adults lie too. Or that their version of events isn't reliable either.

Why is it that you should always believe the fault rather than the child?

AllDirections · 21/10/2013 18:56

I'm sure for most parents they know whether to believe their child or not.

There are lots of parents who think they can always believe their child, most of them are deluded.

I'm not saying that you should never believe your child because that would be silly but I have friends with DC that 'never lie'. They bloody well do lie Hmm