To be really disturbed and upset about last nights Downton Abbey? SPOILER ALERT

[CiderBomb]

I won't say what happened in case there are people on here who haven't watched it yet, but I was really, really shocked by that one scene in particular and can't get it out of my head this morning. Just when people were saying that they thought it was getting boring they go and throw that in. And a much loved character as well...

I'm not one of these sad people who complains about things on television, especially when they happen after the watershed, but I found that really shocking and it seemed to come from nowhere.

I know it happens all the time in real life, even today, but bloody hell :(

[ClementineKelandra]

I'm torn with this. I hated the episode last night and was very upset by it.

But, we should be upset and horrified by rape shouldn't we? It's a sickening, life shattering event and if we didn't find it distressing then they would be something wrong with us.

[jonicomelately]

juggling of course it isn't a documentary but I've heard julian fellowes give a speech about downton. Firstly, he's an extremely nice man who'd be horrified people would hink he's using rape to further his own career. He's keen on using real stories and incorporating these in downton. He will have researched this problem with sexual abuse and subsequently decided to incorporate it in order to highlight the issue. It isn't pleasant but then again nor is the slaughter of millions of men in the first world war, the spanish flu pandemic and the death of mothers in childbirth, all of which have been explored in the show previously.

[Nancy66]

Bowlersarms _ there was a house party at Downtown. One of the guests had a good looking, very amiable valet. He was flirty with Anna, she was friendly back. Bates (Anna's husband) didn't like it.

During the concert Anna got a headache and went down to the deserted kitchen (all the domestic staff were upstairs watching the concert) to get an aspirin. While there the valet came up behind her and made a pass at her. She rejected him and he raped her.

We saw her being struck, knocked to the floor and then very roughly carried to a room. Her screams are not heard because of the concert.

Valet is seen adjusting his clothing and going back to the concert. Anna, clothes torn, face bloodied is found crouching and weeping in a corner by Mrs Hughes.

Anna says she cannot tell Mr Bates (her husband) as she knows he will kill the valet and he's already been in prison once.

[DuchessFanny]

Joanne Froggat (sp) is a brilliant actress and she was very, very good ... But it wasn't for me, as I said on the other thread ( had to find one to vent last night as was so upset ) I missed the warning and didn't see it coming. I kept thinking someone would come to her rescue and that would be the drama ... for us Downton is a fairly gentle tv show ( despite war and death previously -- I found this MUCH more horrific ) and I went to bed tearful, upset and feeling a bit sick. Woke up and it popped in my head again . Seriously considering whether to stop watching as it was so depressing and if you're not expecting it ( like if you choose a gory film or even watch the news !) then it's not good for me :(

[CiderBomb]

I think this storyline will obviously lead to a pregnancy, and we will be left wondering who the daddy is . I'd prefer it if it they didn't go down that route as it seems a little bit too obvious, it would be far more interesting to see how this terrible event impacts on Anna and her relationship with her husband.

[JugglingFromHereToThere]

Hmm, I just don't think it's a black and white issue that's all - whether different issues and situations are being used as the basis for drama and/or to "push up ratings"
For example hundreds of films have been made about the first and second world wars - is it right that this be used as entertainment ?

I think there's a middle ground between "using rape to further his own career" (which would be quite a shocking thing to think) and "incorporating it in order to highlight the issue" (which possibly overstates his altruism)

[jonicomelately]

We don't know if it will lead to a pregnancy. People on here have decided it will, but then they have also decided that JF has made the decision to include a rape storyline to boost his ratings. I could talk all day about the fact that this isn't how scriptwriters think but I don't think people will want to hear that.

[squoosh]

JF also wrote a TV series on the sinking of the Titanic but people didn't accuse him of using the deaths of hundreds of people to further his career. This is something said specifically when rape is the topic.

I don't rate him particularly highly as a TV script writer but I don't see why people are so shocked at the inclusion of rape as a storyline, it's a depressingly everyday occurrance.

[Bowlersarm]

Nancy66 succinctly described. Thank you! Poor Anna.

[midwifeandmum]

[killmuir]

She saved bates by not telling him about the rape. She begged mrs hughs not tobtell him as she knew bates would murder him and end up bck in prison

[jonicomelately]

The other thing is JF always portrays the mood of the servants as more jovial when there's a special occassion in the house. The fact that the staff were allowed to go upstairs to watch Dame Nelly would've made the atmosphere very different to usual. As I've said I don't agree with the people who say Anna is always dour. She isn't! Part of the charm of the relationship of Bates and Anna is their different personalities. And as Nancy says, the man was flirting with her but she was just being friendly back. The real story is that she did nothing wrong but some sleazy man took it upon himself to see an opprtunity to exploit. Writers of period drama have an underlying desire to make things that happened in the past resonate with a modern audience. JF will want to highlight how different things were then, but also, in some respects how depressingly little has changed.

[SHarri13]

I found it really distressing. I don't try and pretend stuff like this happens in real life but I do actively avoid any fictional stuff about it so was upset about this. Was there a warning as I'd recorded it so didn't see the credits at the start. I just don't see Downton as 'this' kind of programme.

[MrsDavidBowie]

I agree with squoosh..... I don't get the angst over the storyline.
It is post watershed, it's a programme for adults, and I don't see Downton as having to be all cosy and warm and snuggly.

Why there has to be a warning before it, defeats me.

[Coffeenowplease]

They killed off two main characters last season - that was enough to put me off. Im glad Im not watching it , seems to be becoming more and more unrealistic.

[gazzalw]

There was a warning before it started for sure..

[PeteCampbellsRecedingHairline]

I've just turned it on but I don't think I want to watch it now.

[Mollydoggerson]

I suspect she will have conceived as a result of the rape. She will struggle during the pregnancy and eventually Bates will find out and kill the perpetrator.

BTW what was the past story between Tom and the new Lady's maid?

[MarysDressSways]

There was a warning before the programme that there was scenes of violence that some viewers may find distressing.

It WAS distressing, but I think it was handled well - the suddenness and brutality was really shocking which works on a dramatic level, and it IS a drama.

I was looking forward to Nigel Harman being in it before!

[MarysDressSways]

The guardian blog on it makes some interesting points.

www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/tvandradioblog/2013/oct/06/downton-abbey-recap-season-four-episode-three

[JugglingFromHereToThere]

I enjoyed that blog Mary, thanks!

The sort of thing I'd write if I could get my head around all the characters and what they're all up to ....
But completely agreed with all the points about the writing and characterisations

[PeteCampbellsRecedingHairline]

Well I watched it. Poor Anna.

I felt like they changed her behaviour to fit in with the story, but is that because in the 1920's that was how people thought? "She asked for it"? Or am I thinking too deeply.

It was disturbing and I don't think they (Anna and Bates) will come through this.

[HorryIsUpduffed]

Nigel Harman always plays baddies, doesn't he?

As horrible as it was last night, I believe the follow-up will be more triggering and distressing.

Mr Gillingham will be leaving shortly because the concert was the last night of the house party. Problems will only arise if Lord Gillingham is a frequent guest, which if his obvious interest in Mary is followed up he will be.

I don't like Bates at all. I think he did murder his first wife, and that he is a very dangerous man. I think he would blame Anna and Mr Gillingham.

Interesting to see how she's going to explain away the very obvious black eye etc tomorrow. Nobody with two brain cells to rub together is going to believe that, but they might well be tempted to believe that Bates who shouted at her angrily in front of half the staff might have got a bit rough at home.

[MrsDavidBowie]

And Anna's acting was a welcome relief from Lady Mary. A cricket bat has more stage presence than that one.

[PeteCampbellsRecedingHairline]

I am fascinated by Lady Mary's arms.

They're bizarre!

[JugglingFromHereToThere]

I agree MrsDavid that Mary's woodeness does look like lazy acting (or directing ?) at times, and not just a grief stricken state of shock