SEN & lack of training for teachers / prospective teachers etc - Should they consider volunteering as a means to access support and training?

[LifeIsFreeStyle]

Hi, It really is my first ever AIBU, so please go easy on me. Not intending the thread as inflammatory - just a genuine question.

There has been lots of debate recently about attitudes and capabilities of schools / school staff towards SEN kids and statements. One aspect of this seems to be a frustration from both parents and teachers at the lack of teacher training available on SEN and disabilities, ASC in particular.

So my question is really, AIBU to suggest that a period of voluntary work with disability organisations might provide the insight and training that will help everyone in the long-run? And by everyone, yes, I do mean everyone including classmates and support staff.

Ah yes the suggestion was already made to have an LA 'A-Team' who can go in and help teachers. Training on a case by case, need by need basis would be useful.

I teach hundreds of children, with varying needs, from ASD, dyslexia, dyspraxia, ME, short-term memory problems, to life-limiting conditions, pacemakers, severe epilepsy, limited vision, to anger management issues, oppositional defiance disorder, self-harm, eating disorders. This is a normal comp.
I would love training in how to teach them all maths better, where would I start? I'm not sure volunteering, unless it was a specific programme of volunteering deliberately designed to help teachers would be any good. Filing and tea-making wouldn't be any use, for example.

Google nut, I'm not certain that there is enough specialist training available to create a team of experts- who would need to be teachers I feel- in each borough.

There's lots I don't like about the US models, but allowing teachers to specialise in SEN in the same way as they specialise in a subject/age group means that those teachers have a depth of knowledge which is just not possible to obtain on the job here. This would allow schools to employ these specialist teachers and not have to be led by the needs of the children, providing training as a reaction to a need. The expertise should be in place already.

Voluntary organisations are a very rich source of, often free, training and support

But it's not free, is it? It's free at point of use - so either it's fundraised (so parents/supporters are putting their hands in their pockets and paying for the charity's funds) or it's govt funded/subsidised - in which case, why not fund the training properly in schools in the first place?

I do however agree it's unrealistic to train every teacher in every SEN - and every child is different. Visiting school services are incredibly stretched though and need more funding. There also needs to be more openness within schools and willingness to partner. I fund an ABA consultant for my child occasionally, who is viewed with suspicion by our school. She can make recommendations to me, which I then have to couch in acceptable language for school, who then might take on board 10% of them.

You would think the CT and HT would be falling over themselves to learn from a specialist with 7 years training in my son's specific needs, who I fund to visit their school, but that's not how it plays out...

I think the 3 days in special schools does something...if it's only a culture shift. Staff, like many parents, still often enter with the attitude of 'shouldn't they be in a special school'. Culture eats strategy! At least they KNOW that high-functioning child shouldn't be in a special school and it's not just their parents 'in denial'. (sigh) Also I do think staff bring back many strategies, as to I when I visit, they are way ahead of us and I get a lot out of visits.

People, teachers included, often still don't have the attitude to deal with difference. We've all seen the cases of a teacher refusing to teach a 'violent' asd child who's overloaded and unmanaged routinely then shunted out when they can't cope. Training is a piece of piss compared to shifting attitude. I'm not bashing teachers, it is an attitude that is prevalent in society in general and. Teachers with the right attitude adapt to any SEN quickly and use their training, I have other staff I've offered every quality piece of training there is from outreach specialists, short courses to INSET and they STILL just don't get the attitude in which to approach SEN.

It would be lovely if all teachers had training but, as someone has pointed out, the range of SEN is so vast. Where would you start? For example, in my son's year alone there is a little boy with a serious medical condition, a child with autism, one having speech therapy, two with medical toileting problems and DS has a heart condition. Heart conditions alone can mean anything from having little rest if PE gets a bit too tiring to not being able to do outdoor games in the winter because cold puts pressure on some heart conditions to not being able to carry a rucksack of books from one end of the school to another - one girl I know through a heart charity we belong to has permission to use a wheel suitcase for her books at secondary school for that reason. And DS is only 1 of 56 children in his year - so a secondary school of 1000 plus would have even more diversity.

One thing I will give our SENCO is that she will link to any organisations or call any professionals a parent suggests to her to find out as much as she can about illnesses or issues a child in her school has. She doesn't pretend to know everything but she constantly keeps herself up to date with the needs of the children she currently has. She can't think about possible future children - she's a teacher, not a GP. She's got to live in the present and do the best she can really. As long as she encourages us, as parents, to speak to her, understands and acts on our kids needs and ensures my DS's needs are met by everyone he has contact with at school, I'm happy. I'm just shocked that she seems to be in the minority. We've never had a problem with her and, speaking to other parents, they may have complaints about homework or bullying but the SENCO is seen as doing Avery good job.

I used to teach in an ABA school, Wilson- we had in house ABA advisors, and training was ongoing. It worked very well.

I would like to see teachers specialised in SEN take up a similar role in every school.

I also feel that the role of SENCo is distinct from this, and the two should not be fudged together.

YANBU

My ds has aspergers. I have had the following comments from his teachers:

On his report: "mini's son needs to learn to understand the feelings of other children" - errr, no shit Sherlock!

Yesterday: "Mini's son. Can you look at my face when I'm talking to you? " No, he fucking can't look at your face when you're telling him off. It confuses him!

My 10 year old knows more about autism and aspergers than his brother's teachers.

tethersend, I have had NQTs who have said they've 'specialised' in SEN. It's a bit like when I 'specialised' in ICT on my primary course from what I've seen, a few half-days extra waffle.

We have also all had the opportunity for funded masters in SEN, not one teacher took it up. Teachers are so under pressure now it's nothing like when I was in class. I regularly get emails between 11pm and 2am.

If I made a change, if anyone's interested, I'd make it a requirement that ALL SENCOs are SMT. The worst schools I know have impotent SENCOs that are class teachers on a days release being ignored when they do give advice. A SENCO needs the authority to wade it and say some things MUST happen, or act a bit unilaterally at times.

Exactly, Berry.

I think the status of being an SEN specialist needs to change too- only allowing teachers to specialise at masters level means that they are always a maths teacher and an SEN specialist. SEN is always seen as an add-on.

Frogspoon hit the nail on the head

Where on earth (even if you had the time) would you volunteer to get experience of DCs with the sort of SEN's you meet everyday in mainstream schools. Dyslexic, Dyspraxic and Dc's with higher functioning ASD don't all conveniently meet up at 6pm in the local village hall.

What is shocking is not that PGCE/NQTs and more experienced teachers haven't worked with SEN DCs. It's that they haven't even read the first page of the sort of web site a worried parent would go to first.

I simply cannot believe that PGCE students are not required to spend a few evenings online watching a video about and doing some bitsize style questions on the most common SNs they are likely to meet.

This should be accompanied by a list of resources so any teacher or TA (or parent for that matter) could research further an area that interested them or was relevant to a child in their care.

It's the sort of thing that should simply be on the dept. for Educations web site.

I suppose I'm thinking from a primary angle, as that's where I am! I can see how they'd fit in at secondary, but in primary they practically have a day or two per subject on their PGCE to become class teachers.

I do find we send children from year 6, or occasionally during the juniors, to a specialist provision. SEN teachers in high school may have kept more have mine mainstream. We find the size, concept of timetables, no consistent adults, moving around are often the end of mainstream for many and (most) high school are quite inflexible.

Our SENCO is the deputy head Berry. I think you've hit the nail on the head. She has the time and the authority to make things happen and it shows.

starballbunny, what you're describing is pretty much my borough give or take, plus a wealth of online resources. There is a LOT. The website is used internationally as well as by parents. Horse. Water. Won't Drink. (obviously not all, but it is still quite common)

I think it's also a case of getting a bit tougher, if these children are in schools it shouldn't be as optional as it now feels to meet their needs. SEN outside the statementing process could do with some rights. As it stands there is practically no comeback if for example I ignore all SALT recommendations. SEN also need status as I said. Parents need proper channels within the LEA for resolving . I feel like a lot of children were given the option on mainstream or the right to the normal curriculum, but in the process lost a lot of rights, funding and specialism. Yes 30 years ago I had friends who did only woodwork post age 13, but in some ways they had a better deal that kids like my sister who was granted the opportunity to accessing the full curriculum, but failed everything and left with nothing at all plus a level of self-eestem that does not mix with a workplace. It's like we stepped backwards at time from what was already a crap deal.

Berry, you misunderstand me- I envisage SEN specialists in all schools, primary and secondary. They would not be class teachers- their role would not involve whole class teaching unless relevant to an issue they were working on.

The longer we continue to add on SEN training to other teacher training, the longer children with SEN will be failed. There is more than enough content in the PGCE- and SEN is a large enough area to warrant at least a year's training.

there is more than enough ^other content

It's a good idea, BUT budget? It would have to be top-sliced to happen. In a small school salaries practically=the budget. I struggle to retain (dismally paid) LSAs, let only highly paid teachers. It would be a huge huge cost.

Londonjax, well said
'She doesn't pretend to know everything but she constantly keeps herself up to date with the needs of the children she currently has. She can't think about possible future children - she's a teacher, not a GP. She's got to live in the present and do the best she can really.'

I had a class with a child with type 1 diabetes, and a child with EB (Epidermolysis bullosa), and a child with dysgraphia. So I spent a lot of extra hours focusing on learning about those specific issues.

Absolutely, the cost would be immense, and must come from the very top.

But it would be worth it.

Without serious investment, any strategy is a half-measure which will never address the scale of the issue IMO.

This is why they came up with the compulsory SENCo qualification but it is a drop in the ocean.

I 100% agree that teachers should be able to train as SEN specialists.

Or perhaps as inclusion specialists, because being an expert in a Special School, particularly one with a narrow focus, and pulling off true inclusion in mainstream are two entirely different ball games!

BerryGood starballbunny, what you're describing is pretty much my borough give or take, plus a wealth of online resources. There is a LOT. The website is used internationally as well as by parents. Horse. Water. Won't Drink.

Too fucking true I have a DD who ticks 99% of the boxes on any dyslexia web site. Despite that it took almost 5 years for her primary school to do more than give her the odd extra spelling sheet.

It's a little village primary, with nice well behaved DCs is it honestly too much too ask for 30 minutes research in 5 years?

It certainly took a lot more than 30 minutes to check the rules, have a meeting with us and get her a scribe for her SATs

Also, said research would not be wasted their were two or three younger DCs who's parents I have chatted to with very similar problems.

I'd like to see a broad base of SEN training, with teachers then specialising in specific areas. Effective inclusion strategies for their specific area would be part of this training, as inclusion strategies for a child with ADHD are likely to be very different to those for a child with CP.

Ideally, this training should be at least two years' long and involve multiple in-school placements.

And of course, would come with a hefty cost.