AIBU to think that life with a 9 year old shouldn't be one long battle.

[Lonecatwithkitten]

At the end of my tether. Single parent with 9 year old DD, every request is currently met by a NO. Every little thing is a battle. I don't shout I put in clear boundaries and follow through. It is just so wearing.
She throws things if she doesn't get her own way, she shouts at me, she tells me she hates me, she tells me she is going to go and live with her Daddy (whose house is a lawless society).
She mostly maintains that she doesn't care about any penalties I try to impose. The latest row (the 3rd of the day) only end with her complying when I said I would take away iPod, radio and all her books. Though she still doesn't see why she should apologise to me.
She doesn't think she should be asked to help in the house and she definitely doesn't think she should be asked to go for a walk with the dog.
Where have I gone wrong?

how long have you been split from dd father? his home might be chaotic but is it possible you could discuss the situation on neutral territory? sounds like your dd is testing how far she can push you and that the grass is greener with dad, not necessarily so, have you spoken to school, what's she like there? if it's a recent split may be she is hurting and thinking you are to blame in some way, whatever happens stay strong, be a great mum and i'm sure it will settle down soon, what do other posters think?

I think we all have times where parenting is a total bitch, I have done with both of mine. At 9 I tend to think that your daughter is old enough for you to sit her down and talk to about the issues you are facing, perhaps draw up a fair rota of duties so you can both clearly see what needs to be done and if she doesn't get it already then perhaps discuss pocket money or some other reward system for jobs well done - I know its a bit early days termwise but liase with the school to find out how she is there. It might be that she is less ok than she appears.

We have been split for 15months. She is a perfect angel at school with perfect reports.
ExH doesn't do rules.
I do eventually get begrudging compliance, but it takes about 20 minutes to get even the smallest thing done. Yesterday the biggest one was over taking the dog for a walk, when we eventually went we had a great time picking blackberries etc.
I'm just worn out by it all.

I can't offer any real advice, sorry, but just wanted to say that if you have gone wrong, so have I.

DD1 (teen) good as gold. Worst we have ever had from her is a bit of sulking.

DD2 (10) a blinking drama queen. Screaming fits (ignored by me and DH) eventually end in tears and begging for cuddles, but not before we've heard the "I hate you you're the worst parents in the world" routine several times over. In DD2's case I really believe it's hormones - she's clearly entering puberty already - and that it's a stage we're going through. Meanwhile we are all about boundaries (locking all channels on TV, hiding the remote, refusing to respond to the yelling) and doing the broken record thing with her about following instructions now thank you.

Wearing is the right word - and I have DH's support.

I wish I had answers OP, my 9yo DD is very similar to yours. She can be so lovely, kind and helpful but it's a 20/80 split and some days I dread having to interact with her which makes me feel beyond crap.

have to say my son has been a moody git since around your dd's age and it has only recently got better (he is 12) so it might just be an age thing x

Oh yes, hormones here. DD had her first period recently and she was hell on earth leading up to it, afterwards she was back to being my lovely little girl!

Where have you gone wrong, OP. Its hard to say. Maybe you have a problem child, born not made.

But more likely is that you've just not laid down the law enough and your daughter is spoiled! Personally, I think you should get angry back in a self-assertive way, and take no crap. Children actually like boundaries and discipline up to a point; it makes them feel clear and safel. This may not be you, but I quite often see demanding and rude children and passive, nice parents who are being led a sorry dance!

(I also think far too many excuses are made on MN: toddler tantrums, hormones, teenage strops, etc. There may be some truth in them, but I think a lot of it is self-indulgent bull to be honest).

Look on amazon for some books with proper strategies. Is she unhappy about something?

If you seriously want things to change, you need to change your strategies. What you are doing is not working, keep on the same and she will get older and harder to deal with. She is nine, there is plenty of time to change your relationship.

If you change what you're doing, she will change in response. It's like chess, you are the adult, and can plan a few moves ahead. So try and set up 'win win' situations, where you both feel you've got what you wanted-eg when we've done the housework, we'll do X-something she wants to do- and maybe incorporate the dog walking into that? If she starts resisting, then say neutrally, we won't have time to do X, at this rate, that's a pity..'

She is most likely affected by the split, she needs to be allowed to say how she feels, without acting it put.

I recommend the 'How to Talk' series of books, they really helped me.

I am hugely consistent and really fairly strict. Today's worst battle was when I made the unreasonable suggestion that in preparation for returning to school tomorrow we look through her report and refresh our minds as to what her targets are for this year. We ended up sat in silence for 10 minutes after she had thrown a pen at this unreasonable request until she picked said pen up.
I have done all the behaviour contracts etc. I know what to do and how to do it is just the effort it requires alone with an incredibly stubborn child.
She has had counselling for the upset from our breakup and I am never ever rude or make denigrating comments about her father. Even though she has pushed me really hard I have refused to enter into further discussion as to why we split beyond we were not making each other happy.

I'm not sure whether its just part and parcel of being nine tbh.

I'm experiencing similar with dd1 - absolutely everything is a battle.

DH and I are consistent with her, but she takes great pleasure in winding up her siblings (both younger than her).

I too am at the end of my tether and am finding myself biting my tongue and counting to ten more than once a day!

This too shall pass??? bloody soon hopefully

You sound like two peas in a pod, in a lockdown over a pen! If you're anxious about the lack of rules and boundaries at exs, you might be overcompensating? I'm sure it's very hard to know how to deal with shared parenting and the lack of control when they are away. It sounds like you are trying really hard to do the best for your dd.

If life's a battle, surely its worth trying a different approach?

I have not thought of going over reports at the beginning of term, I think any of my four would find that stressful.

My rules are the same as they were when we were together. I expect my requests to be carried out in a timely and pleasant manner. I do not expect anything to be thrown at me in any circumstances.
The pen was thrown in anger totally unacceptable and in my view needed to be picked up to acknowledge that it should never have been thrown in the first place.
School requests us to retread reports before the start of time looking in particular at the targets for next year.
Maybe we are to similar, but her stock answer to anything seems to be NO.
I have done the whole well do my thing then your thing - NO so I have carried through and she hasn't got to do it. I have even cancelled her going to play with a friend.

Do I just ignore everything and let her do exactly what she pleases (so watching TV and playing on iPad).

I have just reread that and it seems that I am rejecting everything. Believe me I have tried every tactic know, I have read a variety of child psychology and tried their suggestions. She just ups her game to counter any changes in tactic.
I was away with my Mum in the holidays, my raised 2 girls and has regular contact with my 2 nieces and nephew and Mum said she has no further idea apart from doing more of the same.

Have you read Divas and Doorslammers, by Charlie Taylor? His hypothesis is that, when they go into puberty, teenagers' brains change structurally, and during that change, they lose some of their abilities to empathise with the feelings of others - but that these abilities do come back. And he gives you ways to deal with them so that you both survive until that blessed point arrives.

Nice of you to make such assumptions about the OP, TrueStory. You've met her and seen how she parents, have you?

Lonecat - along with all the age related stuff, it does sound like she's indulging in long distance playing you off against her father. Do you think she'd still see the grass as greener with her father if she stayed there for a few days, or would she soon get bored of it?

And jsut a perspective from the mother of a boy with ASD - even though it's unlikely to be a problem for her, since it's not life long, it might be worth you reading about handling children with PDA (Pathological Demand Avoidance). The trick is avoiding situations where they have the opportunity to say no, by making them think that everything is what they wanted to do in the first place. Instead of "if you want ice cream, you need to tidy your room" you would say "I've got some icecream for after you've tidied your room." It's much less confrontational and much harder to argue with. It also makes the room tidying something she needs to do, rather than something you've told her to do. Of course, she may say "well I don't want ice cream." Your response is "whatever" and you make a note to find a better carrot (eg time on the iPod!)

It sounds like you are doing what you need to to give her good boundaries and bring her up well. It might help to make sure you thank her/praise her whenever possible (if she is helpful or well-behaved at all) and try to find things you are both interested in to talk about. This can help build your relationship and reduce the amount of confrontation time.

Ouryve she has just spent week with her Dad and phoned me on 7 separate occasions crying saying she missed me and wanted to come back. I reassure that I know and understand that I love her and it is X sleeps till we see each other. I then big up whatever she has been doing and minimalist what I have been doing.
I have to admit I think hormones are playing a big part she has been wearing or deodorant for 2 years now, has breast buds and getting hairy.
I feel like I spend my days waiting or her to explode.

Actually Truecat, my guess would be she was born that way, and not a reflection on ops parenting skills at all. I speak from experience.

We have 3 ds's. none of them were any trouble. Then we had dd, who is just like the ops dd and has been like that since she was tiny. Yet are parenting skills were fine with ds's. so did we just switch them off when dd arrived?

I hate people who assume its bad parenting. Some kids are just awkward. Op my dd is exactly the same at 7. We are worn down with her too. I am always on the behaviour boards about her. Much sympathy

Orange I do joke out of her earshot that she was born stubborn. Tried no less than three different mispresentations during pregnancy and labour. Finally had to be manipulated into position and dragged into the world. She gave the Ob a baby death stare as she was delivered - had to been seen to be believed.
When she left preschool they said they would miss her, but not the negotiation and they predicted she would be a criminal barrister as she can argue black is white.
Fortunately she is at a school that encourages independent forthright girls.

If the divorce is that tecent, she may still be upset by it, and is acting out in frustration.

divorce is one of those big things that unsettles children deeply, and she will need time to come to terms with her divided loyalty.

Lots of patience and love and clear boundaries, sounds like you are doing that already.

Good luck, it is always mums that get the roughest deal, but she acts like that with you only as you are the only she KNOWS who would never leave her ( even if her dad did), she feels safe to show her troubled side to you.

In my view, every day being a battle, waiting for her to explode, at the end of your tether, asking where you've gone wrong suggests you are looking for suggestions rather than sympathy?

In my opinion you are on the right track, withdraw electronic entertainment and other desired activities for bad behaviour, reward good behaviour, ignore minor bad behaviour. I do think the 'how to talk..' books are excellent, have you tried them already.

I don't think life with any age person should be a battle, it's not good for either of you.

My DD now 23 was called bossy boots at pre school, was an angel in juniors , head girl at secondary school, and absolute bitch devil at home ,
Now she is a primary school teacher?
We all have battles of will to deal with ,ometimes these are of our own making , she is only 9 and already had to deal with her parents relationship breaking down etc ,
Try backing off a little keep your boundaries rules etc but try to see it from her point of view before you resort to strangle her