To want to make myself believe in god?

[HopHopHopSkip]

I have always been very logical and so despite going to a Christian primary school, having a very religious mum(though not in a pushy way) and reading the bible when I was younger(the story version I was a bit of a book worm) I have never really got my head around how god could be possible.

But I really wish I had the extra "something" that some people seem to find by believing in god. I'm probably not making much sense, but I wish I could get myself to feel like there's somebody watching out, that there's something after death, that everything happens for what'd ultimately a good reason/what's meant to be so on.

AIBU to try going to church for a bit even though I don't believe in god? Or am I just being silly, is it something you can't 'make' yourself feel?

caster can you expand on what you're alluding to when you say I would bear in mind that people who have SN manage to find God too.

Bun fight? Seems quite friendly so far, starting to wonder where SGB has got to though?

I was trying to say that in most churches in Britain, there are people in the congregation who have special needs. And their faith is just as valid as the rest of us.
About 3 years ago, a person who I think had Downs Syndrome, stood up and talked about her faith in God. It was awe inspiring. It was remarkably deep.

I honestly can't understand people who declare unequivocal adherence to a book. It's all made up, as sporks said, men decided the contents of the bible at The Nicea council. Not "God". They left out the gospels which didn't give he right impression of the Christian faith that they wanted at that time.

You might as well read Harry Potter.

Further, I cantunderstand the adherence to a dogma which teaches hatred and discrimination, about women, or homosexuals. Organised religion is one of the worst things to have happened to the world. Crusades, wars, the spread of AIDs in Africa.

Also what was said above, condoningor creating the suffering of innocents, children who die or are disabled, famine, disease. "God" really seems like a sAdistic to have created that when ou think about it.

You don't need religion to live a good, honest life, treating others with kindness and acting fairly. Love isn't the privilege of the religious.

Thanks caster but I still don't understand why you needed to add that. What is it specifically about people with SN having a faith that you want the op to bear in mind? What point are you making?

I suppose God is not just a philosophy but a relationship. It is interesting to look at faith from an academic perspective - some find it more interesting than others, some don't have the cognitive ability to look at it in depth in this way. It seems that God has laboured the point, over and over, that it is relationship he wants and has gone to enormous lengths to facilitate. That is not to say that academic scrutiny isn't rewarding and interesting if you enjoy that sort of thing - CS Lewis did, and look where it got him (surprised by joy on a bus) - but that relationship is where God is at, where his heart beats iyswim. So, if you picked apart and scrutinised the love you have for your spouse, you'd probably end up with dust if you subjected it to the microscope that God is put under re you can't 'prove' love; though it certainly has its fruits.

My perspective is to get to know, hook up with, God first, then grapple with the big issues with him. I am convinced that he is good. That may seem simplistic but half-knowledge can draw some scurrilous conclusions. Life is a serious, serious business and imo God has put some serious, serious strategies in place to address it.

Tydna, have you read through those Gospels? There are hundreds of contradictions from men who supposedly followed Jesus' every move. There is also historical evidence that some of them were written over a hundred years after Jesus' death.

I love my dh because he is good to me and makes me laugh. When we spend time together my brain releases feel good hormones which further reinforce that feeling of 'love'. Yes, it's merely a bunch of hormones and synapses and neurones or whatever but its all in my own head and that doesn't make it less special to me. There's nothing spooky or supernatural about it.

I think it's very hard to believe in something that most likely doesn't exist, it usually take lost of brainwashing and complete denial of the truth. If you want that, it's up to you, I used to think I did too. The day there is one shred of evidence that God/Gods exist I will believe, until then I'd rather not live in fantasy land.

I agree with the other posters, any religion that looks down on women, homosexuals or people who believe differently is a very bad thing and I wouldn't want to be part of it.

headinhands. I was specifically talking to LittleSporks in that instance. But I think what I said about people who have special needs is relevant for everyone.

In LittleSporks case specifically, she appears to have serarched and searched for God. I think she needs to let it go, and wait for God to call out to her.

Springy, if god has gone to enormous lengths to have a relationship with people why do so many reject it? Wouldn't that suggest his message isn't working? I'd love to have a relationship with an all powerful super being that loves me immeasurably but there's no evidence whatsoever that that is the case.

I am a believer, but haven't joined an organised religion.

I believe that life on Earth is a 'test' for our next life, which could be in paradise or not.

The evil on earth is a result of our free will not God's actions.

Those people with great wealth and power can make so many positive changes to our world and to those who live in poverty.
Some of them choose to do so and some don't.

Many rich people are very greedy and want more wealth and many other people use their wealth and connections positively.

It is very easy for people to be corrupted by money.

Indeed, if offered £10m+ many of us would sell our own grandmother.

The coffee, tea and cocoa plantation workers are often treated like slaves.

Fair Trade should be compulsory for these commodities.

CofE church should only be investing ethically.
This is an example of why I don't join organised religion, as well as the child abusers.

I know exactly how you feel too HopHop.

I used to have Christian faith but lost it when I was at uni. I saw
it and felt it as a loss.

I remember being little and believing that the world would last forever and the meek will inherit the earth. I almost believe in karma now. My values are largely Christian.

When I did believe in The Resurrection and Eternal Life after Death I nevertheless struggled with the parable of the Prodigal Son. It seemed so unfair. Now I get it - I now realise we sometimes have to make a choice between justice and peace; peace usually being the more sensible choice.

If you try to be good and do the right thing I think you will have some inner peace. IMO the Christian religion promotes values that are psychologically beneficial for everyone. The ancient wisemen had a sound understanding of human psychology and how to live well to promote a peaceful, thriving society. Whether you believe in a divine purpose/being possibly doesn't matter IYSWIM. A rose by any other name.... Live a Christian lifestyle even without the belief and you'll (more or less) get the benefits.

My friend who is a very committed, practising Christian encourages me to go to church - she's hopeful for me - but I find it a mixed experience, sometimes useful to be reminded about how to live a good life and a moving reminder of my childhood - especially the lovely hymsn - but a sad reminder of my 'lost innocence' too.

That's been my experience anyway....

So if its all down to god why would his followers need to ever talk about their faith? If we're talking about the Christian faith specifically why does the bible command his followers to preach the gospel? Why even a need for the bible? Still don't understand how people with SN having faith means anything beyond itself.

why do so many reject it?

imo, largely because he has been misrepresented. The church has a great deal to answer for on that imo.

I dont think you have lost it chocoluvva. Just stopped at a certain point. Becoming a Christian is a personal journey. You are part way along. Glad you have that Christian friend.

Prodigal son. That was about justice too. God was saying that you can be forgiven for any wrongs that you have done, if you say sorry.
Or are you meaning there wasnt justice for the other son? He was being told that we can have what God has. We just have to ask.

The problem with this free will thing is it just doesn't excuse god's actions. He knew what his actions would cause. He knew humans would rebel and that there would be great pain, misery and suffering to small helpless children and he still did it. That tells me all I need to know.

Okay, so he's been misrepresented, then do something about it? Surely if the stakes are that high and he cares about me as much as you say he does then why doesn't he rectify the problem? And how come your religion is largely determined by geography?

This will give many of you a laugh but here we go:
The ancient civilisation of Atlantic was Heaven on Earth, a life of peace, joy and abundance.

Life was not the continual struggle that it is today.We manifested our needs and had everything we needed to have a wonderful life but then a few people got greedy and wanted more.
They were happy to see their neighbour homeless so they could have a house twice as big as everyone else.

That was the start of life as we know it: wars, poverty, starvation and a complete imbalance of wealth.

Headinhands; god's actions haven't caused all the suffering in the world.
God has stood back and watched us cause the problems.

why do so many reject it?

Also because people want to run their own lives. ime God doesn't sit well in back pockets (though a surprising number of people think he should), he expects to be in the driving seat. That is not easy for us, we are hard-wired to run our own lives and ignore God (= sin) and there has to be, literally, a conversion. Imo it is most often suffering that gets us there, gets us to wanting comfort, a relationship with a loving, powerful God; sometimes it is joy that gets us there, gets us to wanting someone/thing to thank for a wonderful something in our lives. Sometimes it is knowledge, the result of serious questioning (re CS Lewis).

God in the driving seat is a challenging thought if you've been fed the terrifying shit that a lot of religion pumps out: that he is a capricious, cruel God who is out to get you and make you pay. Imo the very opposite of what he is and what he has specifically addressed.

it is also challenging to accept a free gift without paying anything for it. It is challenging to accept that you are loved entirely and totally, that nothing you have done or will do is held against you ie you are forgiven. Even if you aren't sorry (that's especially challenging as a concept).

Our love is, generally, conditional. I think we have a smidge of what God's love is like with the love most of us have for our children - it is the closest thing to unconditional. Our kids may exasperate and hurt us (I have older kids - they can be incredibly hurtful, stupid, eg) but I would give my life for them in a heartbeat. That's just how it is, how it goes - nothing to do with emotion.

So why did I have kids if I knew I couldn't control what they were going to do with their lives, how they were going to behave? My kids are making some drastic mistakes at the moment - do I step in and take over? Or do I let them learn from their mistakes, as hard as that is for me to stand by and watch them make a dreadful mess? Do I regret having them because they are (currently - I live in hope!) making a mess? Do I think they shouldn't have been born because they have misused the gift of life (so far...)? Or do I love them with a love that just goes on and on and never ends, regardless what they do.

we are hard-wired to run our own lives and ignore God

Why would god create the human brain to ignore him?

headinhands. By chapter six of the first book in the bible, God was sorry that He had made humans. But saw that only Noah and his family were left doing good behaviour, so kept them. A couple of chapters further on he states that the inclination of the human heart is evil from youth.

Life is a lot more straight forward if you don't believe.

Nobody to pray to for help, nobody to blame when that help doesn't come.

No worries about burning in hell, no worries about getting past the heaven door policy.

No time spent fantasising about the afterlife and being reunited with loved ones.

o why did I have kids if I knew I couldn't control what they were going to do with their lives, how they were going to behave? My kids are making some drastic mistakes at the moment - do I step in and take over? Or do I let them learn from their mistakes, as hard as that is for me to stand by and watch them make a dreadful mess? Do I regret having them because they are (currently - I live in hope!) making a mess? Do I think they shouldn't have been born because they have misused the gift of life (so far...)? Or do I love them with a love that just goes on and on and never ends, regardless what they do.

But you're not god. You're not being held up as an all loving all knowing being. If a Dr told you before you got pregnant that your child would be responsible for the death and suffering of millions of people would you have still had that child? God knew what humans would do to one another (and that's without disease and congenital disabilities being brought into the equation). He knew and he still did it that way.

The thing is you don't know if your children will cause great pain to mankind and I bet you'll do everything you can to stop your children causing great harm to others regardless of their free-will. But god did know, and he still did it. And every day he watches his creation murder and rape and maim and still he does nothing. Even you as a mere human would try and prevent misery.

If you saw a man beating his girlfriend you'd at least call the police no? Tell me there's no chance you'd do nothing because you didn't want to mess up the man's free will??