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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To want to make myself believe in god?

999 replies

HopHopHopSkip · 25/07/2013 22:55

I have always been very logical and so despite going to a Christian primary school, having a very religious mum(though not in a pushy way) and reading the bible when I was younger(the story version Grin I was a bit of a book worm) I have never really got my head around how god could be possible.

But I really wish I had the extra "something" that some people seem to find by believing in god. I'm probably not making much sense, but I wish I could get myself to feel like there's somebody watching out, that there's something after death, that everything happens for what'd ultimately a good reason/what's meant to be so on.

AIBU to try going to church for a bit even though I don't believe in god? Or am I just being silly, is it something you can't 'make' yourself feel?

OP posts:
PramelaAndherson · 30/07/2013 17:29

atrcts, I am sorry you suffer with MS. Can you link me to those podcasts, please? I'm currently listening to internet sermons from a brilliant church miles away (I don't have a car and live in a remote village with no Sunday bus service and the local churches are rubbish).

2much2young · 30/07/2013 17:42

and we are sinful by nature because ...? gah I give up the whole shebang makes no sense to me. riddle me this an' all that.

Caster8 · 30/07/2013 18:04

I havent got time to read all this afternoons posts yet.

Hih. You accept suffering but dont like it. Fair enough. Neither do the rest of us.
I dont think, and I could be wrong, that the world was designed to suffer. If we go right back to the beginning and that tree again, God made the world and saw that it was good. No suffering on earth, no animals eating each other, no weeds in the garden etc.

headinhands · 30/07/2013 18:18

Congratulations on birth of your baby atrcts btw!

headinhands · 30/07/2013 20:02

Whoa whoa whoa why would god have designed the formidable jaws of a tiger/lion/crocodile etc and then expected them to eat lettuce? Their jaws/teeth/intestines are more suited to flesh/bones. Why would god do that?

headinhands · 30/07/2013 20:07

The term 'weed' carries no botanical classification value, since a plant that is a weed in one context is not a weed when growing where it is wanted.

Wiki puts it better than I can :)

HolofernesesHead · 30/07/2013 22:47

Hello all (waves).

It's oddly comforting to see all of you talking about God again! I may or may not be able to take part much in this thread (busy old me) but in a weird sort of way, it's heartening to know that you're all here. Maybe we should set up a believers and non-believers meet-up some day?

PramelaAndherson · 30/07/2013 22:55

Yay! Then we can stone all the God-haters Smile

PramelaAndherson · 30/07/2013 22:56

...that was a joke, by-the-way Hmm

2much2young · 30/07/2013 23:13

Fantastic humour pramela very Life of Brian I was going to make an inappropriate joke about being able to tell who was on what side by what they were wearing. No prizes for guessing who'd be in the slack bras and Jesus creepers

Anyone see the bbc2 (?) doc tonight on Hindu festival? takes allsorts doesn't it, and why not?

Read something interesting this afternoon about Satan and his relationship with God -allegedly-now that's an interesting topic.

atrcts · 30/07/2013 23:50

headinhands panda's have higher teeth than you and yet eat bamboo! The fruit bat has sharp gnashers too, yet (as the the name suggests) eats fruit. Some piraña fish are vegetarian and we all know how much damage the non-veggie cousins can do... And so on so forth. There are theories regarding this but nevertheless it is not entirely unreasonable for a huge lion to have once been vegetarian like the dear old cuddly bear (capable of killing - and eating - a man)!

atrcts · 31/07/2013 00:03

PramelaAndherson one is LBC but you have to click on the media tab and it's not possible on a smartphone so I couldn't paste the direct link) and the other is www.riverviewchurch.com.au/watch-listen/podcasts.html

I use them through my podcast app rather than the websites directly, and it's like anything, it sometimes hits the spot but other times not so much.

headinhands · 31/07/2013 07:05

it is not entirely unreasonable for a huge lion to have once been vegetarian

Evidence? It is unreasonable to suggest something remarkable that you have no evidence for.

worldgonecrazy · 31/07/2013 08:17

2much2young if you want to read some really interesting stuff about the relationship of the Biblical God with the fallen angels (none of whom were called Satan) then can I point you at the apocryphal text of The Book of Enoch, especially from Chapter 6. Semjaza is the leader and bad guy, yet Azazel (literally "scapegoat of God") is the one that gets the blame and gets cast into the pit for a squillion years. Though admittedly Azazel was responsible for teaching us how to beautify our eyelids, thereby leading to mass fornication.

atrcts · 31/07/2013 08:35

The trouble is, headinhands that there is no evidence that it didn't happen either, so to believe that it didn't happen when there is no evidence may be as pointless as to believe it could have happened.

I was merely drawing a parallel with other species who appear carnivorous but actually aren't (like the panda bear). If you saw certain creatures like that, you'd assume they are meat-eaters and you'd be wrong.

That is all I am simply pointing out.

headinhands · 31/07/2013 09:09

The trouble is, headinhands that there is no evidence that it didn't happen either, so to believe that it didn't happen when there is no evidence may be as pointless as to believe it could have happened.

Nope, it doesn't work in reverse like that. You make a claim, you have to provide evidence. Without evidence we have no choice but to disregard your claim.

I can't say without doubt that lions were never vegetarian but I have no evidence that they ever were. Until I have some evidence it is pointless for me to even assume that they may have been. What you're doing is looking at the bible and when the reality doesn't match you're having to think illogically to get it to fit.

atrcts · 31/07/2013 09:49

It might not work like that to you but other people may consider that to be a balanced view when there is no evidence either way. A kind of keeping the jury out type of view.

But again, I did not claim it absolutely happened. To remind you of the context of what I was saying, I had said I was merely drawing a parallel with other large toothed fierce animals that don't use them for eating meat.

PramelaAndherson · 31/07/2013 10:21

Headinhands, have you thought any more about the murder of babies in our society and why that does not horrify you as much as the Old Testament? Clue: it doesn't really horrify you but it's a great excuse for atheists to denigrate God and ignore His love.

PramelaAndherson · 31/07/2013 10:27

atrcts, thank you for the links.

What is all this obsession with evidence, Head? Are you married? Is your husband/partner cheating on you? No? How do you know? Where is your evidence? You have none? It's just a feeling? Just faith and trust? Hmm...thought so.

headinhands · 31/07/2013 10:39

Thought I had explained it yesterday. Making women marry their rapist is barbaric. Ordering your army to kill everyone of another race but keep the virgins 12 years and older for wives is barbaric. Stoning people for having sex outside marriage is barbaric. You don't agree?

headinhands · 31/07/2013 10:42

I dont know he isn't cheating on me. Until I have evidence to the contrary it is logical to work on the assumption that he isn't. Would it seem sensible to just assume he is then?

PramelaAndherson · 31/07/2013 10:46

No, quite frankly, I don't. Do you know how remote tribes operate even today? You have to look at the context of the times and how rape victims would have had no life whatsoever had their attacker not been made to honour them in marriage. When you slaughter a whole tribe it is sensible to keep the women and children to continue the race. People are still stoned for having sex outside marriage. Bet you'd still go on holiday there, eh? Or buy clothing made in that country. You're not that horrified, are you?

I find your argument that God is just some misogynistic sadist very boring. I've heard it all before and it doesn't wash with me because I take everything in context.

headinhands · 31/07/2013 10:46

Biblical god is not superior to me morally therefore I can't accept that he is perfect and beyond reproach.

PramelaAndherson · 31/07/2013 10:48

If you have no evidence that your husband is faithful to you, then it is logical to keep an open mind that he may be dicking around, no?

PramelaAndherson · 31/07/2013 10:54

You can't speak of God and morals as if He has to operate within the parameters of your perception of Him.