OMG. Are these 'penalty notices' for taking children out of school in term time legally enforceable?

[Utterlyastoundedmum]

Not interested in having a debate about whether it is 'right' to take a child out of schol, in term time for holidays etc. just wanting to know whether they can be enforced from a legal perspective.

I have just read the latest school newsletter and am to be honest, very annoyed indeed to find that as of September the school are changing its policy on authorising absences. Until now it's always been on a case by case basis but now they are saying no absence will be authorised whatsoever no matter what, except for one day for weddings ( with proof!)

The penalty is £60 or £120.

Not very fair on any parents such as myself who booked a holiday for a week in October as we really CANNOT get away in half term this year.

I will not be paying unless this is legally enforcible!!

"I really wish this would happen in my area. The woman downstairs is constantly keeping her son off because she "can't be arsed" (her words not mine) or that "he's too tired" because she has let him play in the garden until 10.30 pm (he's 5 btw) or been arguing all night with her bf. A nice £60 fine would sort that shitty attitude out. The school he goes to is literally down our street too."

There we go.

This fine for holidaying families isn't going to stop parents like this from acting like this. There are already legal procedures in place for persistent truants so this new legislation isn't going to bother her one bit, is it? This new fine doesn't target parents like her.

It isn't targetting parents such as those you mention living next door. Those sorts always can and will get away with it and at their child's expense too, but why should we all suffer??

LEA's don't 'do' home tutoring. They do, however, do taxi's for 4yr olds to go in excess of 13 miles alone. They also split siblings over three schools when for the children's stability it would be better to keep them together. They play fast and loose with the rules that are supposed to make them culpable for their actions and fail to adhere to new legalities.

But they usually think they know best

Marmalade I think that the absence issue may well effect them (and about time). It's not specifically holiday orientated it's about unauthorised absence, which currently is very poorly monitored. Most schools in Wolverhampton for example, don't check on truancy under 85% absence.

You lot may not understand the importance of these fines but I certainly do. My parents used to take me out of school regularly for holidays. At least two weeks a year, often much more. On holiday, I resolutely refused to learn anything, as being in a classroom engaged my interest so much better.

It ruined my whole education. So much was achieved in the one or two lessons of each subject I missed in a week that I couldn't possibly catch up. And the other children in my class missed me so much that they used to cry the whole time I was gone. No-one got any work done and we became horribly educationally stunted. We all dropped out of school at 15 and now we live in a community of boxes under a bridge.

Let this be a warning to you!

" Those sorts always can and will get away with it and at their child's expense too, but why should we all suffer??"

Precisely.

The woman that I mentioned earlier on in thread. She will keep on not taking her DS in whenever she can't be arsed. Fines won't scare her because she has no job so no can pay fine. She might be made to pay a penny a year if the worst comes to the worst. That poor kid's tray of work was the only one left out on the table at parent's evening last week, waiting for someone to come and look at it. As we were the last ones to leave, I doubt very much that anyone came to look at it and fill in his sheet. Yet it is us that are the bad parents for caring about our son's education and caring enough to take him somewhere further than the end of his street. :(

Children should lose school places if they are being taken out of school by parents for holidays. Fines are useless because the parents who can afford them will still go on holiday during term time.
Save up properly and take your kids on holiday during the holiday time and save your kids (and their teacher) a lot of hassle trying to catch up.

" Most schools in Wolverhampton for example, don't check on truancy under 85% absence."

To be fair, (I used to live in Wolvertrampton!) if schools in Wolverhampton investigated every truancy, there would be little time for anything else! It's a sad state of affairs but it's a run-down city and these, sadly, are the problems that come with it. It's a culture for many families and a fine will not bother them.

PG, it might not only be finances that dictate when you can take your holiday. Parent's work leave may not be granted in times that correlate with school holidays, for example. If visiting relatives abroad or attending weddings, they might not fall into school holidays.

"Save up better" isn't much help for the families who can just about scrape enough cash for a term-time holiday, either...

TryDrawing

If only your parents had been financially clobbered you'd probably be in a a rural area with a detached property and 40 acres.

Still, it's not too late for the rest of them

Parent's work leave may not be granted in times that correlate with school holidays, for example.

So, you place more value on the contracted terms for an adult at work than you do on the terms of receiving free education for your DC.
Presumably, if your DCs school place was terminated (just like employment would be if you took 2 weeks unauthorised time off from work), you'd enrol your DC in another school?

That's an interesting point - can schools request information about a transferring DCs attendance record before accepting them on role?

Weddings should be the exception. Family abroad should realise how important education is here in the uk and help make plans that don't infringe on the child's education.
If you have financial difficulty you shouldn't go on holiday anyway.

"And the other children in my class missed me so much that they used to cry the whole time I was gone. No-one got any work done and we became horribly educationally stunted. We all dropped out of school at 15 and now we live in a community of boxes under a bridge"

"So, you place more value on the contracted terms for an adult at work than you do on the terms of receiving free education for your DC. "

Stop being ridiculous. It's not about placing more value on, it'sabout not having the choice, maybe? Funnily enough, if we decide to not bother going to work to go on holiday without authorised leave, we will find ourselves in a sticky predicament with no jobs ergo no house.

And yes, at this stage in his life (HE IS 5!) I do place more value on mine/DH's jobs, than him missing ONE WEEK of education.

"If you have financial difficulty you shouldn't go on holiday anyway."

Ouch - that's right poor people must NOT enjoy themselves!

And it's NOT FREE EDUCATION. In fact, I pay for his education through tax. I am a paying customer.

"If you have financial difficulty you shouldn't go on holiday anyway"

Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!

What a wanker.

Save up better" isn't much help for the families who can just about scrape enough cash for a term-time holiday, either...

I did occasionally miss school as a DC to go on holiday - which might mean that my mathematical ability is flawed but here's my idea:

If family can afford to save £500 a year for a holiday in term time, how about they save £500 this year, but not go on holiday, and save another £500 next year and so forth, until they do have enough money to go on the holiday they want to during school holidays?
Or is an annual holiday a necessary part of family life? Why not two holidays a year? Or three?

PrettyPaperweight basically the school year is outdated and does not work for working parents - so stop being so silly!

Wow thanks Marmalade!
If things are tough financially you should prioritise - holidays are not fucking mandatory.

Financial diffuculty=no holidays, what a snotty view.

It's a realistic view...

And it's NOT FREE EDUCATION. In fact, I pay for his education through tax. I am a paying customer.

Exactly my point, thank you. You are buying a service. Entering into a legal contract with the LEA or Academy to receive education in return for agreeing to abide by the rules - which on occasion may change as needed.

If you don't like the service offered, or the terms it is offered under, buy elsewhere

Aw not it is an awful view of humanity you have there PGRated

Lots of things are not mandatory but they are nice and enhance quality of life.

I forgot though. On MN, only the rich middles can enjoy the naice things in life. The poor can just fuck off and make do with whatever gets handed down to them, eh?