To think parents should teach their children how to behave round dogs

[Xihha]

There have been a few posts lately about people needing to control their dogs more (and I agree, if you cant control our dog and clean up after it then you shouldn't have a dog imo), but is it unreasonable to expect parents to teach children to be a bit more careful round dogs?

Whilst walking my dog (on his lead) a child who looked about 10 ran up and stuck his head in my dogs face to make a fuss of him whilst i was picking up doggys poo, without checking if it was ok, there have been other times kids have just walked up and started pulling doggy around, this sort of thing happens a lot, especially in the summer when there are more kids out playing and the parents rarely say anything about it.

It's not really an issue with my great soppy lump of a dog because he loves kids and will put up with anything for a bit of fuss but shouldn't these kids know that you should check with the owners before approaching strange dogs and that even a nice dog can get pissed of if you start pulling it around?

I tell my children not to approach strange dogs as they can't trust the dog or the owner.

Well the amount of owners who just let their dogs slobber over my kids or jump up at them saying "don't worry he's friendly" are huge so I'll generalise as much as I like thanks.

That's an enlightened view you have there

I've never met anybody who does that. You really are most unfortunate.

I can honestly say I have never been jumped on by a strange dog unless I have had my own dogs with me and been in the very near vacinity to off lead dogs while waving tennis balls and liver cake around.

Do you carry a lot of liver cake in your pockets MrButtercat? Or walk around randomly waving tennis balls in the air? If so I suspect that might be the problem.

I never get jumped on when I am simply minding my own business. It's always my food or tennis balls the dogs want, not me

While I don't doubt the stories from harry & butter, I think it's important to remember that not being able to read and react appropriately to dog behaviour and unintentionally threatening or upsetting a dog is not the same as an unprovoked attack.

Attitudes on this thread illustrate exactly why.Owner arrogance.

Nope. No dogs here. Just two very slothful hot cats (inside cats for anyone about go off about cats shitting in gardens, btw).

He's fine, more spoilt than before to be honest. My parents wanted to hurt the family in the only way they could after their baby boy was hurt (yep that is what they refer to him as :))

Unfortunately the parents of the child still think sunshine is produced from his nether regions, although he does avoid my dad like the plague now. They had the nerve to complain to a friend of our family that they were having to pay the vets bills.

Christ on a bike! No one is saying that some dogs attack unprovoked and that some owners are complete twats.

My DCs have both had strange dogs jump up around them. The dogs were probably just feeling jolly and happy, but were as tall as the children who found it upsetting.

On more than one occasion the owner has said "Oh, my dog's just friendly", to which the only sensible reply is "and my child is terrified" while picking them up out of the reach of a mouth full of teeth and slobber.

And no - we don't go for walk with food or tennis balls - why would we?

pip that's fair enough. It's true too. At the end of the day the owner of a strange dog is also a stranger and children are usually discouraged to approach them. A dog on a lead doesn't make a stranger any less so.

I've had children approach and ask if they can stroke her. Usually I say yes but don't put your face by hers. It's because she'll lick their face. It's something I hate myself and she's my dog so wouldn't expect a child or their parents to love it either.

Wilfull dog owner ignorance as well as arrogance if this thread is any measure.

That all these people on here can actually believe that if their dog attacked, bit and injured a child that the child is the guilty party, and their dog and they are the injured, innocent parties, and that a dog being on a leash gives them a get out of jail free card, is quite scary.

To repeat. A dog attack, even the potential of a dog attack, in a public space is an offence in the UK. That is not a negotiable because your dog (according to you) is luffly and harmless, it is the law, and all your selective misreading of that law won't help you if it happens. Nor will claiming you had "control" on a lead - the attack makes it manifestly clear you did not. It can only (possibly) mitigate the penalty.

The current laws in draft are aiming to tighten this up further, and extend the offence into private spaces as well. The attitudes on this thread are a combination of old doggerel, wishful thinking and dangerous arrogance.

*usually as in, sometimes I will say no. If she is very excitable, jumping around, yapping for me to throw her ball, I will say no. Not flat out just "usually it's fine to pet her but she's a bit excited at the moment sorry".

My dog is tiny in the great scheme of things but then, so are children. And the above situation is not a good time for them to mix.

I may get blasted here but i think its largely up to the owner to control the dog in public. It's their pet and they choose to have it in public. Since it is an animal no matter how well trained it may decide to follow its own natural instincts against the owners calls to stop.

yes parents should give their kids a pep talk. But vey small kids will forget unless the pep talk is given every time they leave the house i.e i have a 2.5 year old she wouldn't remember, but the 6 year old should in theory although i remind them . I don't do it constantly though because the danger is i could instill a fear of dogs in them. My husband is scared of dogs i don't want my kids being like this.

I think its stupid that in council parks that are huge they don't divide it up so there are areas for dog walkers only and families and kds only. Here in edinburgh you get beautiful large parks even in the deprived areas yet not attempts are made to divide the park up to make it more friendly and safe, its not exactly expensive to do either. T be honest I'm more worries about my kid falling in dog poo and getting it in the eyes.

Lazyjane, why on earth should I update myself on Texas Law? I live in Oxford. I am full acquainted with UK law, and the majority of people posting on this thread are in the UK

My apologies, I thought Dallas implied Texas, i was being charitable as you clearly do not know UK law. If you are in Oxford, I suggest you acquaint yourself with it.

Unprovoked dog attacks are actually very rare, so you've clearly been very unlucky, MrButtercat. I'm not sure why you feel the law needs tightening - if, as you say, these dogs attacked you unprovoked and caused damage requiring medical attention, and you have witnesses, you are certainly in a position to pursue the issue under the DDA. If these dogs actually attacked you without provocation, it is likely that they will be destroyed.

I have never, in all my years of training and working dogs, seen an unprovoked attack on a human. I have, however, seen many very tolerant dogs ragged around by children without complaint. I do know some owners who do not take proper measures to keep their animals under control, and allow them to approach other people, which is clearly unacceptable. The majority of owners I know take better precautions. You can generalise all you like, but the plural of anecdotes is not data and you have to appreciate that your perspective is skewed by the fact that negative incidents stick in the mind better. If my dog were to be in the vicinity of you, you probably wouldn't even notice him, as he wouldn't be remotely interested in interacting with you. He would be completely under your radar, so to speak.

This is not owner arrogance, it's experience. I know how my dog wll react to most normal situations, and I know his training will over-ride his instinct. I know this because I can call him off livestock with one word, and I've tested that many, many times. I'm also confident if he were attacked while on a lead by a child that he would not respond - but I don't wish to find out, and I firmly believe that the child's parents are responsible for ensuring that this is not put to the test.

I agree with you justanother.

How my dog behaves is my responsibility, I chose to have so she should be (is) trained to behave appropriately in public. I have met twatty owners with badly trained dogs. Often see a man who seems to revel in the fact his Labrador is very aggressive. It is. He lets the dog off it's lead . He doesn't use the excuse "oh he's just being friendly" when social incidents happen he says "you should have kept your dog/self away then". Given I live in a area highly populated by the much demonised Staffordshire bull terrier breed people are surprised when I say the most aggressive dog I've come across is a Labrador.

Also, apologies MrButtercat I was incorrect in my assertion I'd not met any awful dog owners. If you'd met this guy and his dog or similar types I can well see why you have a dim view of dogs and their owners.

I think the separate areas in parks are a great idea to be honest.

'I may get blasted here but i think its largely up to the owner to control the dog in public. It's their pet and they choose to have it in public. Since it is an animal no matter how well trained it may decide to follow its own natural instincts against the owners calls to stop.'

No, that's not being disputed at all, it is my responsibility as a dog owner to ensure that he doesn't harass anybody - but me, lol. Like I said earlier I have him on the lead if I'm anywhere where I would expect people to be or if I can see people. If I'm on a pavement I will either make sure he's not within reach of people passing by (because he's a random licker)or if there's a lack of room I'll move onto the road.

All of that doesn't stop children running up and behaving inappropriately to him - that's what I'm talking about by educating children, don't run up and hug a strange dog, don't wave a stick 3 inches in front of his face and then complain when he grabs it, don't walk up to him and bark in his face because while my dog thinks that's all very entertaining his idea of playing is still too bouncy for most children and even if he doesn't accidentally knock them over - the next dog they try it with might not be so impressed.

LazeyJaney - no-one except you is talking about dog attacks, of course the child is not guilty if a dog attacks it...do you actually understand the meaning of the word attack? Because that is not what's being discussed.

D0 I'm the same - never been jumped on by strange dogs, although the ones that know me in the park might run up and leap over me.

DS2 was repeatedly approached and jumped on by strange dogs, but his fear was making him do things that meant he drew attention to himself & made him interesting to dogs.

I don't allow children to stroke my dog when he's on a lead. He's had a lot of ear problems in the past and gets noticeably stressed when children he doesn't know are in his space.

I may get blasted here but i think its largely up to the owner to control the dog in public

I think pretty much everyone here is saying that, with the additional comment of that they would appreciate children being taught not to run up and disturb a dog they see without asking - for the child's safety.

It's one of my jobs lazyjaney, so actually I know a damn sight more than you. You are making yourself sound foolish now. Just because you want to be right doesn't make you right mate, it makes you dangerous.

I work on a voluntary basis at a local rescue and my main task is to work in conjunction with the Dog Warden and Community Police Officer to capture, remove and round up strays and dogs that have bitten or threatened to bite. We have rescued, rehabilitated and rehomed a number of so called 'dangerous' dogs over the years.

Dangerous dogs that attack ie those not under control are a different kettle of fish, but controlled dogs who have been provoked and dogs who have bitten family members that do not want the dog PTS use our services. Everything we do is to the letter of the law, so trust me, I'm not the one that needs educating here.

I don't actually think she has young kids babyH. I think she's just being a Goady arse. Whatever flicks her switches huh.

We live and walk through a park daily (to get to school) and deal with dogs. I have children who are extremely scared of dogs. One will stroke/pat if the owner indicates that it is ok. The other flaps about a bit and tries to run in the other direction from any dog.

What other ways can I teach them to be sensible about dogs? Genuine question as I'm not a huge fan myself, but want my children to approach dogs in a safe manner, especially as we pass dogs on such a regular basis.

The children know not to touch any dogs unless invited to do so, but I'm worried their scared reaction would sometimes be a trigger for sensitive dogs?

Very true Dallas

reindeer the best advice I can give you is as follows;
If the dog is on a lead, teach them to stand away and ask the owner if its ok to pet the dog then wait til they are told its safe, most owners will turn the dogs head away to prevent any chance of accidental teeth contact.
Teach them to stroke in the direction of the fur and to speak quietly and softly so as not to startle, dogs pick up on tone of voice so confidence is key.

If its off the lead, stand still, fold arms and turn sideways. Do not make eye contact and if the dog bounces they need to firmly and calmly say 'down' and most dogs will then calm down.

Unfortunately trying to get away and getting in a flap with arms is a sign to the dog to play.

My dog and others I know will also respond to 'no' or a hand held out flat above their head as a sign not to jump.

Do you have any friends with dogs reindeer? It might be an idea to gentle introduce your kids if you do, let them see there is.nothing to be frightened of if they treat the dog with respect, may help the one who flaps