The great british menu - food poverty... AIBU?

[Bogeyface]

I hate myself for thinking this but, AIBU to think that Lady Whatsername who said in the 90's that the reason poor people couldnt manage on benefits was because they lacked the ability to cook good simple nutritious meals, may have had a point? The way she said it was totally U and she was very sneery, but I cant help thinking that there might be a grain of truth in it.

Of the three families I have just seen in this program I saw what 2 of them ate in a day. one was a mother and daughter who's only meal of the day was a microwave burger each costing £1 each, and the other was a family where the children had fish fingers or nuggets and oven chips, while the parents had tinned veg.

£14 per week that the first family spent is enough for a bag of baking potatoes, some basics pasta, baked beans, passatta, a pack of frozen sausages, a bag of porridge oats, some cheese, some sandwich meat such as Haslet from the deli counter (35p per 100g in my tesco) and milk. The DD would be getting free school meals if I heard correctly about her age and their income. Far healthier, more filling and more than one meal a day!

The second family, again, for the price of nuggets, fish fingers and oven chips they could make a spag bol using basics ingredients that would feed them all well.

RAther than focussing on the cost of food, which is only going to rise, surely it would be better to focus on educating people who eat badly because the food they choose is more expensive than cheaper, healthier alternatives that require a bit of cooking knowledge?

lots of cross posts while I was looking all that up, sorry. Doesn't seem very relevant now.

But I do think it's worth noting when you do you food bank shopping how much you can get for so little. It really makes me worry about the amount I spend on food when I usually don't think about it enough. Yesterday I bought 3 punnets of raspberries and 2 of strawberries - that alone came to £10. That could be three or four full days food if I was more careful and prepared to eat more calories and lower quality food. It's kind of embarrassing!

I thought that too Fairylea

Where would the bus fare or petrol money come from to shop about so much?

you can eat ok on a small sum of money but week in week out it just drains you... I dream of a full fruit bowl and telling the kids to help themselves :)

I agree that shopping at markets only works if you live near one. Also, dunno what markets are like near the rest of you but our one in town sells things that yes are very cheap but you have to use them pretty damn quick. So you can't do a weekly stock-up even of fruit and veg there, because it goes off within the week.

I used to use Lurpack to sweat the veg or olive oil and premium mozzarella in my sauce - just to melt Value is fine if it's being cooked. Or none at all.

I was given a plant grow my own rosemary and scoff in that in cooking but none of the expensive stuff for years.

DD, DH and I had baked potatoes five nights a week ten years ago but even they are pricy now. The carnivores used to like corned beef hash but that's not budget either. Neither is the ubiquitous tuna pasta.

We managed on £15 a fortnight for two adults when I was unemployed in 2010. It could be done but only because my Mother and sister kindly stocked up our cupboard just after I was made redundant, because we had all the cooking equipment already (if you have never had it before how on earth do you go about getting it on a limited budget) and because I know how to cook and like to cook.

Prices have since gone up so we would struggle now I think and God knows how you would get on if cooking from scratch wasn't something you knew how to do or enjoyed.

As others have said, there are two issues. Poverty is one, cooking skills is another. I do think both need to be addressed. It actually helped my self esteem to know that I could cook for us and we could manage at a time when I was feeling a bit useless due to the redundancy so I guess being able to cook served two purposes for me in that situation.

You can eat on a tiny budget but its surviving not living.

Our benefits have been sanctioned for four weeks after buying gaviscon, nappies, gas and electric then paying the bills there is very little left. We eat because I walk to a close supermarket at closing time for reduced to clear foods. I'm lucky I can walk to the supermarket at the needed times without paying transport and I have the knowledge to cook what I buy. Not everyone has those privileges.

As for the microwave burgers vs stew its more 60 seconds of microwaving electricity or two hours on the hob electricity.

It isn't just the money, or lack of skills but also the time and effort that goes in to cooking cheap meals from scratch. It takes bloody ages to produce meals from dried lentils or really cheap cuts of meat. This uses loads of fuel but it's also the last thing you feel like doing when you come in from a long day being treated like shit by customers for minimum wage (for example). And even if you do, people will be hoiking their judgey pants up about how your kids didn't get dinner til 9pm and went to bed late. Or talking nonsense about batch cooking and freezing when (1) you can't afford to run a freezer, even if you had one and (2) you have loads of other stuff to squeeze in to your days off work so can't spend the whole day cooking (even if you could afford the fuel for that).

It is fairly easy to come up with a one off misery shopping list for 2 for £15, but try eating that stuff every day for the foreseeable future. Lentil soup every night for the next 15 years is not something I'd be looking forward to.

Also, these lists never include stuff like cooking oil and salt/pepper (never mind all the other store cupboard stuff most of us take for granted). If your food budget is £15 every week, then at some point you'll need to buy this stuff. And you won't be buying the big bottle of vegetable oil that works out cheapest, because you can't afford to waste that amount of your weekly budget on oil. No, you'll be buying very small but cheaper bottles that work out more expensive in the long run.

Actually, I would say that poverty is the biggest issue that needs to be addressed. Not knowing how to feed a family with soft carrots, an onion and the last bit of dust in a herb jar wouldn't be an issue if people were living on decent household budgets. When you look at how much money is swilling around a few people at the top of the income scale in this country, surely it is eminently manageable that we don't have people living in food/fuel poverty - we are a rich country. But I guess that redistribution of wealth is a dirty phrase these days.

Oh, Peach, I'm so sorry to hear you've been sanctioned :(
I can't imagine how I'd manage for 4 weeks - am dreading my 'turn'.

That shopping list is grim. Virtually no fruit or dairy and the only protein is from cheap fatty mince. And where are the tea bags.

I also think for a lot of parents on low budgets they will sacrifice some of the budget in order to buy treats for the dc, so the dc do not feel left out in relations to peers or to come home from school and not have a chocolate biscuit or a small cake or whatever else and then all they have to look forward to is a bowl of soup or a potato and then bed. It's a bleak existence for a child. Everyone needs treats.

Mrs Jay - not everyone wants to eat meat either. And if you priority is to fill up your family's stomachs with something nourishing and pleasant tasting then spending such as large proportion of your budget on meat seems counter-productive. I was just disappointed that there wasn't even much mention of how you could get protein from other, cheaper sources in the programme - it seemed like they were just 'playing' at coming up with ideas rather than addressing the problem for the long term.

MacaYoniandCheese Soy mince has as much protein in it as beef mince though, which is my point about sources of protein which are cheap, readily available, and much easier to store to boot.

You can eat on a tiny budget but it is more involved and takes more time / prep to be healthy. Loads if great veggie dishes with beans but to make cheaply, need to dial and boil dried beans (to speed things up need a pressure cooker).

Cheap cuts of neat are great if you're in to watch them, but if not, only really work if you fork out got a slow cooker...

And of course, many of the more interesting veggie dishes need a decent spice cupboard which can often be built up more cheaply from ethnic grocers but is still a substantial outlay if living day to day.

Batch cooking can save, but you need a freezer (unless willing to eat chilli / meatballs / spag bol for 4 days straight...)

I have plenty money, but an interest in cooking and have noticed how much the bill goes down when we do veggie, braises etc. but then I also have the luxury of a well stocked spice shelf to keep it interesting.

I'm sure it's possible but when someone is already struggling, asking them to have time, cooking skills, budgeting skills and planning to eat really well on a tight budget just seems like an extra pressure...

fair enough, maybe my list reflects my own dodgy eating habits and lack of cooking knowledge.

MrsDV It wouldn't occur to me that a potato had to be eaten with anything, I see it as a meal. And I also see the same meal every day as fine/normal. I eat the same meal every night (alternating between two types of fish), it just happens to be a much more expensive same meal.
Maybe the mince wouldn't stretch though - it's 950g, I think that's an awful lot but maybe it isn't.

Abitraryusername does everyone buy oil, salt and pepper? I wouldn't know what to do with them really.

minitheminx are teabags a staple? I don't buy them. Not a lot of fruit I agree but quite a lot of veg. You could probably get 3 portions a day each out of it which is poor but not as poor as many not on a budget. Also, I think baked beans have quite a lot of protein.

I ponced about today making fancy ice cream in my £160 ice cream maker with eggs from my chickens and strawberrys and raspberrys from my allotment.

Real fancy ice cream you'd pay fortunes for in some up town restaurant.

But what a total cock I would be to then extrapolate that to 'oh everyone can make lovely food if they just knew how'

You could cut my wage to benefits level and I wouldnt starve for for 4 months (and not cos I've any savings) - instead because I've a store cupboard, a veg plot, and of course the chickens.

About every 4-6 weeks I cook 30 meals for a homeles charity. About three years ago with basics products I could knoxk up a very nice massive Cottage pie for about £13. The same dish now using the same ingredients comes to more than twenty. Sainsbury's value mince was 85p - it's now 135p for 400g. Cost of 12 packs + 8tins value toms, jar of bisto, bottle of HP, bag of onions, big bag of carrots and 5kg spuds has pretty much doubled. It's shocking - still good value but much more expensive. A lasagne is nearly double that; a chicken stew and rice may be a third more. More perspective about price rises when ou do it in bulk. And I always throw in a couple of pounds of cadbrys because I think you still need something nice - even if your're poor.

I don't do the foodbank but a friend of mine is vicar in a poor area and he welcomes what he calls family boxes for when the money runs out every week - a dinner and breakfast for a family of three to five. I usually put in pasta, sauce, tinned fruit, custard, packet of Mr Kippy pies, cereal, t bags, twist of coffee, small shampoo, bar of soap and - bag of sweets for the dc - why shouldn't they have a bag of sweets. He puts in a pint of milk and a loaf bTW. :( 2

The thing is the same that on a thread a while ago. These people don't have a 'good' store cupboard behind them. It is easy/cheap to cook tasty meals if you have a store cupboard. None of the families in this programme.

It easy to say but this box 'only' cost £20 if you don't have them money for food to eat let alone buying stuff to be used over weeks/months.

I live in a deprived area which in the 2 years my dc primary school have introduced a 'read and feed' scheme so those children who have FSM now can have a free breakfast as well as help with homework. But also so we know that they are having at least 2 meals a day.

Of course the next 6/7 weeks of school holiday means these children may only have 1 meal a day as parents are going to struggle with the additional food costs.

There is no way that £14 could feed a family, even with the best will in the world. It may be doable for a couple of weeks but its not sustainable.

And where is the fruit and veg OP?

I'd agree that having good cooking skills can help families stretch their food budget - particularly if the family lives near shops / markets selling food cheaply and have plenty of time for cooking. But that won't solve the problem completely, particularly if the only shops within walking distance are expensive convenience stores, and you can't afford a big freezer or much fuel for cooking with.

And also, if someone doesn't know how to cook to begin with, I can't imagine you'd feel much like experimenting and trying to teach yourself if you're on a budget so tight that getting it wrong would mean the whole family going hungry.

yy to more food skills.

My DS is at secondary and this year so far in food tech he made Fruit Salad, scones, crumble and a cheesecake. None of that will help him feed himself and certainly not on a budget. He is in year 7 mind so it may get better as he goes through school, but I really think they are missing a trick.

A single potato as a meal? And no salt or pepper or oil? WTF would you do with that to produce a meal. I can't imagine the despair I'd feel if I came in from work and spent 25 mins or so preparing a meal of boiled potato with no seasoning.

The thing about cooking from scratch is that you do need stuff like salt and often long cooking times so as not to produce incredibly bland food. A life of going to quite s lot of effort so that i could eat frozen value mince with some carrot and sweet corn and no seasoning or potato with no seasoning is really quite grim, tbh. If that were the alternative, I'd be buying the microwaveable burgers. At least they'd taste of something.

This blog is good

There are many ways of living on a budget. I've done it and I quite enjoy cooking well for not much money!